Bezoar said:
have to be careful in michigan, the state law does not have an actual statute that puts the right to open carry into actual iron clade legal right.
That’s because that isn’t how the law works. There are no laws permitting us to own shotguns and rifles either. If there is no statute that, “puts the right to open carry into actual iron clad legal right“ (which isn’t entirely true anyway), then there are no laws that do the same for ownership of said weapons. It‘s like saying there is no law giving people the right to sit on their front porch. It isn‘t illegal, therefore it‘s legal.
Thats how laws work. Sadly, we‘ve become a society that‘s so accustomed to asking permission from the State, that it seems that some people now believe that we
must have permission from the state for doing something that not only is within our full rights to do, but is also protected by state law, and the state constitution.
Fact is, the Michigan Constitution states that, “Every person has a right to keep and bear arms for the defense of himself and the state.”
http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(br...spx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-Article-I-6
That, plus MCL 123.1102 is about as “iron clad“ as it gets without government regulation. That‘s another thing. We‘ve also become so accustomed to the Supreme Law of The Land (USC) being ignored, disregarded, dismissed, “interpreted“ (it
was written in English), and it‘s meaning totally warped. As a result of that, we now look to our lords to pass laws to protect rights that we already have laws protecting.
Your absolutely correct. Because our rulers no longer honor our laws, we understand that none of our rights are “iron clad“. The right to OC in Michigan is as “iron clad“ as the right to keep and bear arms. Both are enumerated under the Constitutions (both US and Michigan). Both have been tried in the courts, and have had legal precedence established. Both have had their respective Attorney Generals publicly state that it is so. Yet, we all know that all it takes is some tyrannical (and yes, they are tyrannical), activist judge to come along and impose his personal agenda, rather than law. Actually (come to think of it), Michigan‘s right to OC is more “iron clad“ than the individual RKBA on a federal level since Michigan has a law prohibiting any local unit of government from enacting or enforcing any regulation, taxation, or restriction on the matter. We don‘t get that on the federal level.
Bezoar said:
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however in 1924 i think it was the then state attorney general made a decision where he felt that open carry was fine to do. sicne then each attorney general has made that affirmation.
Up until 1990, local units of government could restrict the right to OC, and many did. Since 1990, those local units of government no longer have that right.
Bezoar said:
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THis summer that was done again by attorney general Cox when a small town government/plice department got scared when a group of CCWs opened carried in a west michigan town to promote self defense laws and rights. …
Really!?
I never heard anything of the police department “getting scared” (and I doubt they were). Matter of fact, I seriously doubt anyone “got scared” by that event. Some people were angry, and/or offended, but not scared.
Bezoar said:
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However there is at least one town where they passed a law ruling open carry to be disturbing the peace….
Cite please?
What town are you talking about?
Any such law is unenforceable because it violates state law.
Bezoar said:
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notice that most people dont see the wisdom of carrying around 24 ounces of 357 until they need it?..
This is a typical “anti” statement.
Most people don’t go where they see a need for “24 ounces of 357 “. I’d agree that “most people don’t see a need for it”, since there are such a small percentage of the population who have permits to carry concealed weapons. However, that doesn’t mean that the “need” to do so doesn’t exist. Nor does it have much to do with the topic of OC.
Come down to Wayne County if you really want to put it to the test. But I suggest you bring several guns with you, as you won't get them back right away after you're let out.
It’s been done, and your predictions haven’t come to pass. Sure, it can always happen no matter where you are. It could happen out in the woods during hunting season. Cops can do whatever they want, and can arrest people for just about any reason they chose (as long as they can justify it in their report, and even then if the can’t, very little will happen).
People have done it Novi, Allen Park, Dearborn, Dearborn Heights, Detroit, Garden City, Livonia, as well as others. Just last week I was with a friend in Westland who was OC’ing, and does so there on a regular basis. He even told me how he held the door for a local LEO while OC’ing, with no problems from that officer. Then of course there was the OCDO picnic in Warren (yeah I know, it’s not Wayne County, but it’s closer to Detroit than some of the other places).
Fact is, more and more departments are becoming educated on the legalities of OC, just as more citizens are becoming desensitized to it. For years we’ve been taught that, “only criminals and cops carry guns”. Law abiding citizens OC’ing breaks down that stigmatization.
Of course people are not going to notice it.
