Officer's response to 911 call that wasn't made.

[CheyennePilot]

Last night around midnight, my family was awakened by a knock at the door. The Roswell police were let in by my wife after they said they received a 911 call from our address. My dog charged into the livingroom in protect mode, but I was already out of bed and intercepted her before any contact was made. I then asked them: " Why are you here?" They said: " We are responding to a 911 call that was "noise" that was heard by the operator." I asked my son who was now in the room if he called 911. He said no. My wife asked if they could check what number the call came in on. They checked but could not come up with a number. I took the dog by the collar and put him in our bedroom. The male officer followed me and began questioning about guns and any others in house. He told me to go back to the livingroom while he secured the house, and I complied. All guns were secured in safes. He finally returned and both officers left with no comment.

Now could you call this a hiccup in the system and a honest mistake? It felt like a shake down. Kind of like law enforcement making their version of a social call. You would think the operator would have returned the call to confirm a problem before sending out officers. I definitely do not want this to happen again!

HappyLandings!

CheyennePilot.

 

[average_shooter]

Sorry, but they don't get in unless they have a valid search warrant. I've called the cops before, when they showed up I talked to them on the front step.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Honest mistake? Yes.

Intention mistake? Yes. There is a phenomenon now called SWATting where callers are able to call 911, report a crime from where the number of the caller is, only an incorrect number comes up on the 911 end with the correct address for the incorrect number or it come up with an address and phone number that are not related.. In other words, the cops could have been there by mistake in that the system was fooled and they were at your place where no problem existed.

Some departments require that 911 hangups be investigated in person.

Tell your wife not to allow strangers in the house again, even if they are supposedly cops. Especially don't allow them in late at night.

So what aren't you telling us? You missed telling us how the officers came to be dispatched to your address. Surely you asked. What was the basis of the 911 operator coming up with your address?

 

[KelVarnson]

It happened to me, 4 or 5 years ago. During a rainstorm, the telephone drop line from the pole to my house got noisy. Even though virtually all phones are touch-tone, the system still works on the old "click" method (for lack of the proper term). If you don't believe me, try dialing one of your friends (or your own number) by clicking the hook button the appropriate number of times for each digit.

So, 9 clicks followed by one click followed by one click equals a 911 hangup call, and the PD's caller ID will tell them right where your house is. The cops that responded to mine at 4 in the morning told me that it happens every time it rains.

Why didn't they just call you back, instead of coming over? Maybe if they really suspected something fishy was going on, they wouldn't trust the person who answered the call back to tell them the truth. Overall, I think it is a pretty good policy, but I don't believe that it should give them entry into your house. In my case, I didn't invite the cops in, and they were OK with that.

 

[esq_stu]

the male officer followed me and began questioning about guns

What questions? "Are there guns in the house?" "Were any guns fired?"

Where I live handguns are registered and the Chief of police has a record of them. "Your department has records on that, officer."

Would I have the presence of mind to say that in the middle of the night? Probably not.

Considering what happened in New Orleans and seems to be happening in Boston, is it time to ratchet up the paranoia again?

 

[CheyennePilot]

We didn't get into a long dialog with the officers. We were in bed asleep at the time. We are not wired with a phone company. Our phone is connected with the local cable service, so how could the law enforcement operator confirm a address without returning the call? We didn't request that service from our phone service provider. It would be like a cell phone. They would need to contact you to get a location. The male officer saw one of my gun safes and asked if all guns were in the safe. I don't know why he thought he needed to ask that question.

HappyLanding!

CheyennePilot.

 

[CNYCacher]

Noisy phone lines calling 911 happened to my Sister and Brother-in-law.

Let me add to that, dialling a bunch of random numbers will call 911 automatically, I have been told.

 

[Officers'Wife]

Hi Cheyenne,

I would have been highly suspicious and politely hostile. And no way would they be allowed in my house.

Selena

 

[Jeff White]

It was most likely trouble in the 911 system. It happens quite frequently, especially in areas where the phone lines are underground and it's been raining. There are all kinds of glitches that could have caused that to happen. I've responded to a 911 hangup and the phone at the residence wasn't working. The people living there didn't know their phone wasn't working until I knocked on the door and asked if everything was all right.

They checked their phone and found no dial tone, just noise on the line. These things happen. The police have better things to do then knock on people's doors and ask if someone called 911. A 911 hangup is not a call we like to respond to. They happen a lot and for every one that is a true emergency (domestic and one party ripped the phone out of the wall, someone trying to call 911 and passing out before the call was completed....) there are probably a hundred that were mis dials, kids playing with the phone, mechanical problems in either the phone line or the 911 system, or a glitch in the 911 software.

Even so, the police will respond every time someone calls 911 and there is no one on the line.

Jeff

 

[Creature]

The male officer followed me and began questioning about guns and any others in house. He told me to go back to the livingroom while he secured the house, and I complied.

That was your big mistake right there. I would have told him no to "securing the house". They did not have a search warrant. Sounds like a fishing trip to me. The police can conduct their business on my doorstep. I find it especially suspicious that they couldn't come up with a phone number. The 911 system is designed to locate an address based on a phone number.

 

[Officers'Wife]

Hi Jeff,

there are probably a hundred that were mis dials, kids playing with the phone, mechanical problems in either the phone line or the 911 system, or a glitch in the 911 software.

To a degree that's a rather frightening thing, not only the waste in time, money and manpower but the prospect that a true emergency might have to wait for a bogus call.

Selena

 

[Gtac]

Some years back, I hastily dialed 911, thought better of it, and hung up. (Long story).

Of course, a State Trooper showed up at my door a little while later.

I went out and met him on the front porch, locking my door behind me. I was very polite and straightforward with him, and explained the reason for the hang up call, reassuring him that everything was all right.

He asked, "Are there any guns in the house?"

I answered, "No, of course not."

I think of that every time I read that it is a criminal offense to lie to a police officer.

Another time, I had occasion to call an ambulance for my wife. Soon my living room was a-swarm with EMTs and State Troopers.

One of the Troopers wandered into the kitchen, and seeing several bottles of my wife's prescription medicines on the counter, became excited. "Hey, look at all these DRUGS!" he exclaimed.

I think he thought he was about to make Corporal.

I don't recall what I said. I just REACTED as if he was a little child and scooted him out of there. Whatever I said, he was embarrassed, as well he should have been.

I have a lot of respect for LEOs in general, but we have a civic duty to not let them get too big for their britches.

Don't let them in your house without a warrant.

If they ask, "Mind if I have a look (in you car/house/etc) for my own safety?"
Just say "No".

 

[CNYCacher]

If they ask, "Mind if I have a look (in you car/house/etc) for my own safety?"
Just say "No".

"No you don't mind? Great!"

 

[Jeff White]

CheyennePilot said;

Our phone is connected with the local cable service, so how could the law enforcement operator confirm a address without returning the call?

Unless your cable company is totally incompatible with the 911 software (most of them are, to my knowledge only the internet phone companies like Vonage give the system fits) the address came up on the screen like any other number would. We have 3 phone companies and a couple of cable systems that provide phone service in our county and all of them work with the 911 system.

We didn't request that service from our phone service provider.

I would bet that your provider is required by law to provide that service. I'd also bet that if you look at your bill closely, you are are paying a tax to pay for the service.

It would be like a cell phone. They would need to contact you to get a location.

If they have the newer software they can locate a cell phone without calling back. It has been illegal for several years for a cell phone provider to activate a phone that doesn't have GPS capability. Even if you have it turned off on your cell phone, it will activate when 911 is dialed.

The male officer saw one of my gun safes and asked if all guns were in the safe. I don't know why he thought he needed to ask that question.

Because, and I know you'll be shocked to hear this, sometimes people get involved in a domestic dispute, one party or the other calls 911 and the other party terminates the call, rips the phone cord from the wall, pushes the disconnect button on the phone, takes the handset from the caller and hangs up...... Then when the police arrive, the abused party goes along with what the abuser says because the abuser is afraid that he/she will be abused worse if they don't, abused party is afraid that if the abuser is arrested he/she won't be able to survive without the abusers income, the abused party has calmed down and isn't mad at the abuser anymore......If your attitude was agitated like it seems to be here when you talked with the officers, they probably checked further then they normally would have, not as punishment to you for having an attitude, but to make sure that your attitude wasn't left over from a domestic dispute. The last thing they wanted to do was respond to a 911 hangup and leave telling dispatch everything was all right, and then investigate a murder or aggravated battery at the same address a couple hours later.

Officers'Wife said;

To a degree that's a rather frightening thing, not only the waste in time, money and manpower but the prospect that a true emergency might have to wait for a bogus call.

It is a tremendous waste, but what are the authorities to do? If it truly was an emergency and no one responded, the public, who pays for the 911 service through taxes on their phone bill, would rightfully be in an uproar. So you respond to every 911 hangup.

Jeff

 

[sacp81170a]

Quote:
If they ask, "Mind if I have a look (in you car/house/etc) for my own safety?"
Just say "No".

"No you don't mind? Great!"

That's why we ask it that way...

 

[Crimp]

Did you recognize the police officer? Do you have his badge number or name? I'd be checking with the Roswell PD to make sure he's really on the payroll before you become this guy's payroll!

 

[bsf]

Happened to me this summer. I believe it was related to a problem w/ equipment on the service provider’s side. I was working in the driveway when squad car pulled up. Officer walked up the driveway and asked me a few questions.

Do you live here?
Did you call 911 and hang up?
Anyone else live here?
Bla bla.

He seemed disbelieving when I told him I did not call 911, and answered in the negative when I asked if the 911 system sometimes falsely indicated calls. He asked for ID. I asked him to stay put and I retrieved it for him. He took my information and I wrote down his last name, squad car #, and time/date. End of encounter.

 

[Slugless]

Looks like we have some LEOs responding to this post....

Officers, what do you want us to do in a 911 visit? Say you go to a house for a 911 call and nothing seems amiss at first:

-What do you do if we don't open the door?
-What do you do if we ask for a warrant?
-How should we confirm your identity as an LEO?
-What do you do if we tell you don't look around the house?
-What if we tell you don't look at my prescription drugs?
-What will you do if we say we have an unsecured gun, either on the nightstand cocked and locked or we tell you about a pistol in a drawer with a trigger lock?
-Do you take the firearms? Hold it until you determine nothing's wrong & return it? Take for a longer period?

What's your best advice on how a citizen should behave while interacting with an LEO during a stressful situation? I'm always polite, use the proper term of address ("Officer", not "sir" or "ma'am"), keep my hands in plain sight, etc.

 

[RoadkingLarry]

Jeff White Posted: ....It has been illegal for several years for a cell phone provider to activate a phone that doesn't have GPS capability....

Source reference or link please. I work in the industry and I don't believe that is the case but I am willing to be educated.

Caller ID can be manipulated with the right equipment/service. I've worked on PBX systems where you can program exactly what goers out over caller ID.

911/E911 is a darn fine system but it is not flawless, perfect or universal. You need to know what level of 911 service is working in your area and know what info will need to be provided to the operator. Knowing where you are is usually a pretty good thing to know.

 

[Gtac]

Quote:
If they ask, "Mind if I have a look (in you car/house/etc) for my own safety?"
Just say "No".

"No you don't mind? Great!"

Point taken. Amend that to, "Yes, I do mind."

I'm not recommending anyone get cocky, or clever, or confrontational.

I really do understand Jeff's points about the cop's perspective. The few times I've had dealings with the police, I've always made it a point to be polite, respectful of their point of view, etc. Mainly, I want to reassure them and help them to relax.

And you know something? It really works. Staying on the High Road is the way to go.

But "the price of Liberty is Eternal Vigilance," and we have a duty to help them stay on the High Road, too.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

The male officer followed me and began questioning about guns and any others in house. He told me to go back to the living room while he secured the house, and I complied.

Doesn't seem quite right to me. I probably would have done it like this.
"Did you call 911"
"no"
"Did anyone in the house call 911"
"no"
"Do you have any guns"
"What does that have to do with calling 911?"
"May we look around"
"Get a warrant or remove yourselves form my property"
We talk about the 2nd A all the time but we forget some others, like the 4th.
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

 

[IonicDOG]

Had an incident also, about a month after I moved into the a house in the city, I was sitting on my computer, in the living room at about 9:00PM. I heard 2 car doors slam, which was odd, several seconds later there were loud knocks at the front door. I got up with my beretta in hand and shouted who was there. They identified themselves at as LEO's, pulled back the curtain and saw them, put the gun on the sofa and cracked the door open. Come to find out they were at the wrong address and upon that they went about their buisiness.

 

[Avenger]

Another possibility is that somebody "Pants" called 911 as they drove by your house. Your address would show up as the origin, IF the area is Enhanced-911 enabled. If they ended the call quickly enough, it wouldn't have updated the origin to another set of co-ordinates or address. Unlikely, but it could happen. Lord only knows how many times my friends have told me they've gotten calls from me, only to hear the rustling of denim.

Do you have cats? They may have stepped on a speed dial button if you have a non-cordless phone around. I've heard tapes of those.....

"Hello, 911, what's your emergency?"
"MEOW?"
"What?"
"MEEOOOOOWW!"
*CLUNK* "GRRRRrrrrr" #HISS#
"Officers responding, use extreme caution entering the residence, their tabby is annoyed."

 

[Gtac]

I'd really like to see some LEO's tackle some of the questions posed by Slugless in post #18 above.

I was very interested to read sacp81170a's comment in post #15.

 

[Jeff White]

RoadkingLarry asked;

Source reference or link please. I work in the industry and I don't believe that is the case but I am willing to be educated.

When my daughter in law (works for Verizon) I'll ask her, she was the one who told me when I asked about getting an older phone I had activated.

Slugless asked;

Officers, what do you want us to do in a 911 visit?

Cooperate, open the door, answer a couple questions and it's over. The officers don't like waking people up in the middle of the night any more then the people like being awakened. Remember this call, even though 9 times out of 10 it's nothing, is an unknown trouble call to the officers. Their guard will be up and they will be trying to detect signs that something is wrong.

-What do you do if we don't open the door?

Depends entirely on the circumstances. If the 911 operator has said it sounded like static on the line, probably log it no contact and leave. If the 911 operator said, "I heard shouting in the background and them the line went dead, not opening the door is probably not an option. Backup will be called, the officers will probably walk around the house looking in windows and listening, trying to determine what was going on. If they saw someone laying on the floor, EMS may be called and entry might be made. It just depends on what the situation is.

-What do you do if we ask for a warrant?

Explain to you that one might not be necessary because the Supreme Court has ruled that under exigent circumstances we can enter residence and that an emergency call was placed from this residence which may establish that there are exigent circumstances permitting them to enter without a warrant. that totally depends on exactly what the 911 operator heard and what the officers found on arrival. You're standing in the door and the house is in disarray, furniture turned over, phone ripped from the wall....the officers are probably going to want to enter or at very least speak privately to everyone in the house.

-How should we confirm your identity as an LEO?

I suppose that somewhere a plainclothes officer responded to a 911 hangup call. Usually the presence of a marked squad car and uniformed officers is enough of a clue for most people, but all you have to do is call the agency, they will verify it.

-What do you do if we tell you don't look around the house?

Again it depends totally on the circumstances. If the 911 operator heard sounds of a struggle, the officers heard a fight going on as they approached the house, they discovered signs of a fight when they looked in the window and the door was opened and you refused to produce the other residents of the house so their safety could be confirmed, they are probably going to secure you and look anyway. If everything looks normal and it sounded to the 911 operator like trouble on the line, the officer probably isn't going to ask to look around if everyone in the house will verify they are ok.

-What if we tell you don't look at my prescription drugs?

Why would they want to look at your prescription drugs? In 22 years responding to countless 911 calls, the only time I can remember an officer looking through prescription drugs was when there was a medical emergency and that information was needed by EMS or the ER.

-What will you do if we say we have an unsecured gun, either on the nightstand cocked and locked or we tell you about a pistol in a drawer with a trigger lock?

Depends on the circumstances.

-Do you take the firearms? Hold it until you determine nothing's wrong & return it? Take for a longer period?

Again it's totally dependent on the circumstances.

What's your best advice on how a citizen should behave while interacting with an LEO during a stressful situation? I'm always polite, use the proper term of address ("Officer", not "sir" or "ma'am"), keep my hands in plain sight, etc.

yesit'sloaded said;

"May we look around"
"Get a warrant or remove yourselves form my property"
We talk about the 2nd A all the time but we forget some others, like the 4th.
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

If the right circumstances exist, you're likely to be sitting in the back of a squad car in handcuffs charged with obstruction. Maybe you can get your attorney to explain exigent circumstances to you so you can add it to your understanding of the 4th amendment.

Jeff