Officer's response to 911 call that wasn't made.

[Officers'Wife]

Hi Rifleman,

Your courtroom scene is dead on. Save the arrest report would mention, the man to be 'panting from exertion', of suspicious demeanor, fill in the blank. True or not in a he said she said which would have the greater weight? Perjury? More likely 'reasonable deception."


However, should he win the first round the guy could starve to death paying his attorny before the civil rights case ever saw the first hearing much less made it through the appeals. The prosecutor and police, of course, having the presumption of innocence would be paying their legal fees from the vast resources of the state.

Would you place it in the hands of apes, or I know how about horses...that's it, horses understand the Constitution...

No, I would place squarely on the Constitution itself. Just as the Founders intended. A warrant signed by a judge after being presented with probable cause.

The other poster, I believe, mentioned hearing a scream in the background. How often an occurance is that? I know I read it in the papers every so often leading me to believe it's rare enough to be considered news.

How is the exigent circumstances rule making police officers more equal? The courts with the exclusionary rule are the check on the police.

Again, the citizen has the option to accept a bad search or bankrupt himself fighting the vast resources of the state in fighting it. If the citizen were to be unfortunate enough to get a judge like the one in Cass County Indiana years ago (I believe his name was Cox) who's judgments were based more on his benefit than the law he would be in trouble plenty.

Selena

 

[Slugless]

#50

If you don't pay cops well then they turn to bribery to make a living. I've been there, seen it, it's ugly and you don't want this country to go there.

My 86 year old mother-in-law's descriptions of the police "rackets" in old South Boston are jaw-dropping. In fact, the term "rackets" that she uses is the source of the word "racketeering." Why did they do this? Because they were so well paid?

Pay 'em well, train them well, give them good equipment. The more you pay, the better qualified people you get.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

too true slugless
and we've engineered a situation in this country where we have foreign thugs with so lil fear and enough cash to take out 6figure contracts on governers and four stars. heck some years back four dc sargeants were nailed for collecting 5 k a week each to protect a numbers bank.

 

[Jeff White]

Officers wife said;

No, I would place squarely on the Constitution itself. Just as the Founders intended. A warrant signed by a judge after being presented with probable cause.

This is not consistent with this:

If the citizen were to be unfortunate enough to get a judge like the one in Cass County Indiana years ago (I believe his name was Cox) who's judgments were based more on his benefit than the law he would be in trouble plenty.

If you can't trust the judges, then your proposal to eliminate exigent circumstances would be futile. After all judges are human beings too.

Jeff

 

[nfl1990]

How heroic of them. I say less pay and more scrutiny.

I think you really need to spend some time in a modern PD, everything is done under scrutiny, even the simple act of running a plate has accountability.
As for pay you should look at what an officer in your town makes the amount will probably surprise you, people don't go into police work to get rich, they go in to help people, and yes I know some go in for the power but those tend to be few and far between.

 

[KelVarnson]

That absolutely does not work any longer except in VERY old phone systems in the most rural areas. Even those old 1A style (still some analog) switches are being updated.

The click method has been dead for at least 10 years except in the absolute sticks.

I stand corrected. I just tried it here, and it didn't work. BUT, I must be in the sticks, because I know I did this less than a year ago and it worked. I also know that at the time I got the false 911 visit, it was working that way, because I suspected that and verified it. And I found a cut in the drop line that was leaking the water in, and had the phone company fix it.

Thanks for the update.

GPS phones are still few and far between.

I have one, as do at least some of my friends who are on Verizon here. When I got the phone about a year ago, I think most of the models they showed me had embedded GPS. I am not sure if Verizon uses the GPS in order to meet the E911 requirement, or whether they use triangulation, or a combination. I do remember turning off the GPS function for general operation, but I was not allowed to turn it off for 911 calls (not that I would want to).

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

my kids firefly has the gps gonna track her butt till she figures it out then i'll get her chipped

 

[TexasRifleman]

I am not sure if Verizon uses the GPS in order to meet the E911 requirement, or whether they use triangulation, or a combination.

Verizon uses GPS as a corporate service differentiator to stand out in the market. They make a LOT of money charging for GPS services with their phones; navigation, business locator, etc.

 

[Deanimator]

I think you really need to spend some time in a modern PD, everything is done under scrutiny, even the simple act of running a plate has accountability.

If there's so much scrutiny, how come there was a home invasion gang operating inside the Chicago PD?

 

[Officers'Wife]

Hi Deanimator,

To be fair, you can't really use any part of the gov of the city of Chicago. Although I'm told it's starting to change a little for the better. As bad of caliber of Jasper county I still have enough respect for them not to put them in the same cat as Chicago.

OK Jeff,

If you can't trust the judges, then your proposal to eliminate exigent circumstances would be futile. After all judges are human beings too.

So naturally we give LEO's carte blanc? Both judicial and exec branch ought to have a true civilian reveiw board chosen like jury duty (vote registration or DL) making recommendations to a special prosecutor independant of both the exective and judial branch. Though how you would find an attorney that wouldn't be an officer of the court is beyond me.

Selena

 

[Jeff White]

I give up...we're in the same circular conversation that always happens here. I'll leave you all with the immortal words of Mick Jagger in 1968:

http://www.keno.org/stones_lyrics/sympathy_for_the_devil.htm

Just as every cop is a criminal (whoo whoo)
And all the sinners saints (whoo whoo)
As heads is tails (whoo whoo)
Just call me Lucifer (whoo whoo)
'Cause I'm in need of some restraint (whoo whoo)

Enjoy.............

Jeff

 

[Officers'Wife]

Hi Jeff White,

Thank you for your politeness and consideration.

Everybody knows the dice are loaded.
Everybody knows the game is fixed.

Selena

 

[Funderb]

police CANNOT come inside without a warrant. Never let them in.
(unless they present a warrant.)

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

i take it you didn't read the thread yet

 

[average_shooter]

This one seems pretty well done... We need that "beating a dead horse" emoticon...

 

[Slugless]

Like this?



All I gotta say is thank the English for their common law.

 

[Crunker1337]

Yes, police CAN come inside without a search warrant, if they have probable cause.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

shhhh don't muddy the waters with facts. i gotta go deal with a dimwit tomorrow who thinks the supreme courts gonna let him go cause they didn't read him his rights. mind you hes in jail and lost the only appeal he had but he has closed his eyes and thinks the video of him stealing doesn't count

 

[Bailey Guns]

The High Road. What a great concept. Until it's time to bash the cops again.

For those of you who think police officers CANNOT come inside your home without a warrant...you're really clueless. If the proper circumstances are in place they certainly can. Happens every day somewhere, despite all the blowhard bravado of some on THR.

 

[Pete409]

Before this thread gets locked, I'd like to ask a serious question.

One of the previous posters (presumably a LEO) replied something to the effect that if the homeowner didn't consent to let the cops in when the cops felt that there were "exigent circumstances", that the homeowner might just find himself handcuffed and in the back seat of the cruiser and facing charges of obstructing justice (or something to that effect).

Suppose the homeowner (or renter), when asked by the cops if they could search the house responded, "You do NOT have my permission to search the house, but I will not attempt to stop you if you insist on doing so."

How could the cops then arrest him for obstructing justice (or whatever the term was) for denying them permission to enter but making it perfectly clear that he wouldn't offer any resistance if they did so?

 

[average_shooter]

To the cops here let me say this; I think quite a bit of the "cop-bashing" is a result of mistrust. A situation where the few bad cops ruined things for the many good cops. It's sad, it sucks, but that's the way it is.

I'm sure there are lots of good cops out there. But personally I can't afford to go around trusting anyone based solely on the clothes they donned this morning or the union representing them. I happen to have had experience working pretty closely with a few of the cops in my town, considering at one point I was thinking of becoming an officer. Working with my local department killed my desire. I don't want to be like them. Knowing how screwed-up parts of my local department are I can't just trust a cop until I see a lot more public displays of cops policing themselves.

All too often I see references to cops having each others backs. Alright, I get it, you're like brothers. My best friend is the closest thing I have to a brother, he's like family. But truth be told, if he f's up, it's on him. I'm not going to stand up for a criminal. Too often I see articles about cover-ups and web-forums about cops going after other cops for writing other cops dui's and speeding tickets. That just ain't right.

I think it's high time that good people, whether they wear a badge or not, start weeding out the bad guys.

 

[zxcvbob]

police CANNOT come inside without a warrant. Never let them in.
(unless they present a warrant.)

There is a difference between giving consent for a search without a warrant, and being very vocal about the fact that you don't consent but still not physically resisting. I think that's the right approach most of the time.

There is a time for resisting (with up to deadly force if necessary), but I'm not sure where the line is drawn for that, but luckily the situation almost never comes anywhere close to that.

 

[Pete409]

Average Shooter,

I agree 100% with your comments. When ANY group won't strongly condem members of their own group who do wrong, then they shouldn't be surprised when the general public distrusts ALL members of that group.

 

[thexrayboy]

They did not have a search warrant. Sounds like a fishing trip to me. The police can conduct their business on my doorstep. I find it especially suspicious that they couldn't come up with a phone number. The 911 system is designed to locate an address based on a phone number.

Of course they were fishing. Duh. Responding to a "911 hangup" can be understood. Asking to wander about the house to "secure it"
is patently and obviously an excuse to "see what I can see".

If they ask, "Mind if I have a look (in you car/house/etc) for my own safety?"
Just say "No".

I suggest you be a little more specific in your replies... as in " No officer, I do mind if you have a look and therefore I refuse to give you permission."
A less specific answer will inevitably be "interpreted" and the officer will proceed as they choose.

 

[oldcop1971]

While there are some very well paid departments...

in this country, I daresay the majority of officers make less than the median income of the citizens of their state. In the 7 man dept i now work for, a new officer gets paid a whopping $8.50 an hour until he is academy certifed, and then gets the exorbitant sum of $10.00 an hour. That's around $22,000 a year. The town does NOT pay health insurance. Even tho the cost of living is relatively low, this is not enough to retire to a Caribbean island. Believe it or not, Constitutional Law is taught in the academy, and covered in depth in in-service training. Yes, we have the power to totally f**k up your life. The vast majority of us, however, do not get off on power trips. We try to do a mostly thankless job as fairly as humanly possible. Most of us do try to get the screwups and bad apples out of the profession. The 'blue wall of silence' exists in some areas/departments, but you also have officers out here who have the integrity and honor to do the right thing, just because it is right. Officer's wife, it sounds as tho you have had a horrible experiance with the .gov in the past. Please, however, do not judge us all for the sins of those whom I've never met nor associated with. I know that once you've been burned, you are reluctant to touch even a cold stove eye again. Believe me, I try to earn the citizen's respect and trust every day I work. I know that not only my reputation is on the line, but also every other officer in the country as well.
rambling rant over.

God Bless
oc71