Older Smith & Wesson vs. New ?!

Status
Not open for further replies.
Try here just to add more info. and opinions. Folks here are great. There too
Click to expand...

Dont mean to hi-jack my own post but Ive been in that forum and I have to say they are NOTHING like the highroaders. They, I shouldnt say "they" so please excuse me,but there were a couple threads that were so blatently racist, sexist, homophobic it was rediculous. And there were so many who joined in, not just one person spewing ignorance and then every one else correcting them....NOPE, people were just joining in and singing the same songs. Things that would not have been tolerated here on the high road. made me literally sick :barf: . The moderators here are to be applauded for maintaining the standard they maintain. Thanks but Ill stay here for my communion w/my fellow arm bearing brothers. ok......

BACK TO OUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAMMING.:eek:
 
I have to agree with you Don Lu. I love my Smiths, but I'm just as open to owning other brands one day. Over on that "other" forum, if you don't own a Smith, you own crap, and you are quickly lambasted for it.

Just to clarify, as I don't spend a lot of time on the S&W Forum, it could be I was over there on bad days.

I go over there to search for additional info on my S&Ws only, I don't like hanging out their like I do on THR.

My thanks to the Moderators on THR as well for maintaining such a fine, civil forum for us to live and learn!
 
Last edited:
I bought a new one (25-13) last year and love it. It's the only gun I own with a lock onboard. With the 4" barrel it is something S&W hasn't made historically. I looked into some of the old Model 25's, but all I've ever run across had 6" or longer barrels. I don't care for the lock (or the finish all that much), but for function and fun it has been a beauty. Otherwise, I agree with several other posters - if I can find an older model that suits my wants then I will get that over a new production version.
 
Dont mean to hi-jack my own post but Ive been in that forum and I have to say they are NOTHING like the highroaders. They, I shouldnt say "they" so please excuse me,but there were a couple threads that were so blatently racist, sexist, homophobic it was rediculous. And there were so many who joined in, not just one person spewing ignorance and then every one else correcting them....NOPE, people were just joining in and singing the same songs. Things that would not have been tolerated here on the high road. made me literally sick . The moderators here are to be applauded for maintaining the standard they maintain. Thanks but Ill stay here for my communion w/my fellow arm bearing brothers. ok......
Click to expand...
...I honestly haven't noticed that "over there", but I am an infrequent visitor. However, the time I have spent on the forum has been pleasant...I have typically found the folks to be helpful, friendly, and respectful. I do recall a bit of a homophobic reaction to a post about fanny packs in their "concealed carry" forum once, but if I remember correctly someone corrected them quickly, and made a joke about the gay community in their area wearing cowboy boots...in other words things were defused with some harmless humor.

But thanks for the heads up Don...I don't want to be hanging out with bigots !
I will remain vigilant when I visit. I too commend the moderators here..... and from time to time reminding us that this is "The High Road" !

Sorry to get off track !

I still prefer the pre-lock versions.....just picked this 37-2 up yesterday...factory bobbed hammer, no lock, and no MIM parts...looking forward to it's arrival !!
2r5fam9.gif

-Regards
 
Last edited:
I lurk over there, and have seen no "bigots", or any of the other bad things mentioned. Was I in the right forum? All I saw was folks that liked revolvers, talking about some grand old examples, and some cussin (not literally) over the new ones. I did see one thread, where a fella was asking about one of those key lock 620 revolvers, and didn't get much of a response. Apparently those revolvers are not well liked, or purchased by the folks over there.

I did see some off color foolishness in the "lounge", section. Nothing all that terrible. I didn't think it was my cup of tea, but thats what I use my back button for.
 
I spent a bit of time on the Smith&Wesson forum, and I also didn't much like the folks there. The ranting about "the lock" went, IMHO, beyond reason into insanity, with frothing at the mouth and fake stories about people killed when their guns failed, rants about S&W guns by people who obviously never owned any S&W revolver, stories about MIM parts breaking (one man says he saw hundreds of S&W revolvers with broken triggers, an obvious lie), etc. It is my opinion that the forum has been infiltrated by anti-gun people, who sooner or later will cite their own racist and extremist rants as "proof" that gun owners are crazies who should not be allowed to own guns.

I have had the opportunity to examine the new S&Ws and while I would prefer not to have the lock, it doesn't bother me; I just leave it alone. As Old Fuff says, the older guns were beautifully made and finished, as were all gun company products of the 1880-1930 era. But none of us could afford that kind of work today.

The MIM "scare" was apparently dreamed up by the S&W haters; I have pretty good industry sources and have heard of no problems. Further, MIM allows parts to be made with innovative designs that really do reduce costs and retain precision. Their new trigger, for example, has no pins; that doesn't seem like much until you realize that every pin has to have a hole drilled, and the pin has to be installed by hand.

Jim
 
The ranting about "the lock" went, IMHO, beyond reason into insanity, with frothing at the mouth and fake stories about people killed when their guns failed, rants about S&W guns by people who obviously never owned any S&W revolver, stories about MIM parts breaking (one man says he saw hundreds of S&W revolvers with broken triggers, an obvious lie), etc
Click to expand...
....yes Jim, there were some rants I saw too regarding the lock and MIM parts. The older, more established members used to calm thing down regularly with the voice of reason...but perhaps they are fatigued by the unrelenting backlash. Any who.......if I can get what I want without the lock I do. In my old age I am more patient and wait until I find what I am looking for at a price I am willing to pay.

-Regards to all !
 
Thaddeus,

The "Lounge" is where I had my experience with the "off color" humor. Of course im not saying everyone over there is some type of horrible person, and Im not going to put quotes up of my examples b/c I dont want to turn this into a this forum vs that forum ..or a bashing clinic. I guess the point I was getting to is, Id rather spend my Internet time on the highroad where people seem to be better at expressing views about issues, even when they dont agree.
 
Dont mean to hi-jack my own post but Ive been in that forum and I have to say they are NOTHING like the highroaders.
Click to expand...
I've never seen anything that could be characterized as racist or homophobic there.

My objection is to the cult-like adulation of the commercial entity S&W. There's a certain element there who can't seem to distinguish between S&W and some sort of deity. They will tolerate NO criticism of S&W the company, and either attack people with DOCUMENTED issues with S&W's customer service, or stick their fingers in their ears and sing loudly any time somebody doesn't fawn over the company. Sometimes it's simply creepy, as in the example of the guy who accused someone of being a devil worshipper because he didn't like his user ID...
 
I believe that most of those promoting the guns with The Lock are dealers and those gun writers who are in the makers' pockets. Ad money speaks loudly at most magazines.

I think a fair number of those posting on forums are dealers.

I very much doubt that I will personally ever buy a gun with the lock. Too ugly, and I just flat don't trust them.

I think the solution is to see some lawsuits against atorneys who cause trouble by suing when there is no cause. And the gun companies and their association need to look seriously at this option.

Lone Star
 
Last edited:
Back again. I just read the negative comments above by Don Lu. I am a member of the S&W board (under another name) and find it to be quite gentlemanly in all forums, including The Lounge.

I said "gentlemanly" to describe the manner, but we have several female members, a couple of whom have wicked senses of humor and keen minds.

There are some old grumps and a few self appointed evangelists who want to mix religion and guns, but I don't see that a lot. There was a long-running thread (over 39,000 views) of women not wearing a lot, but I liked it, and it was tastefully handled. Some of the very conservative types must have complained, because the owner pulled it. There is a post now on the Ruger forum showing a gal with little on, but I see nothing awful about it. Judging from Thaddeus Jones's phrasing and spelling, I think he must be one of those who don't much hold with pichers of wimmen who ain't fully dressed. Tsk, tsk! Most gun forums do have a lot of very conservative members who take that attitude. The S&W forum is quite careful about letting such fun get out of hand, and I don't think the risk of seeing a partially clad chick is a major one. Most forums with mainly male members have that sort of thing. Gun boards probably have less of it than others.

I really think the dissing of the S&W forum was overdone. If anything, it prohibits racist remarks and barbs aimed at Jews, gays, whatnot. The political sentiment is conservative Republican, as at most gun forums. Given the Democratic effort to control guns, that is fully understandable. But bigotry is just not allowed.

The conservatism is pronounced enough that I would hesitate to refer to an article in, "New Republic", "Playboy", or "National Geographic" to make a point, but that is again typical of "gun people." Most are not intellectuals, and the image of the typical gun owner as being a yokel driving a pickup truck with a gun rack in it has some validity. "The High Road" is more open, and some here have more tolerant minds. But there also seem to be many who are just being introduced to firearms. I think this is healthy, as some less traditional shooters join our community. But they have to understand that voting for Democrats is fatal to gun ownership. The stated goal of that party is to work for more control, and many of them are absolutely virulent in their hatred of firearms.

Rant over, but give the S&W forum some credit. It isn't flawless, but it is by no means what some have described above!

Lone Star
 
WOW Lone Star! From my measley old 17 posts, your able to tell what I think! Karnac ain't got nothin on you. Would you tell me the win, place, and show, at Aqueduct tommorow? Sorry fellas, I didn't know we were takin of for spellin.
 
Further, MIM allows parts to be made with innovative designs that really do reduce costs and retain precision. Their new trigger, for example, has no pins; that doesn't seem like much until you realize that every pin has to have a hole drilled, and the pin has to be installed by hand.
Click to expand...

There is no question that the new design reduced manufacturing costs, but when hammer/trigger internal parts and springs were nested rather then retained or pivoted on pins the smoothness - that made S&W actions so famous - suffered. I don't believe that any 'smiths who work on tuning revolvers really prefer the new lockwork over the old, or find it easier to work with, or get noticeably better results.

It's more a case of having to accept these changes because we live in a 21 century political/economic environment. From the gun owner's perspective, these cost-cutting "improvements" are seldom seen as the best thing to come along since sliced bread. Seeking out older guns isn't so much a case of being an ultra-conservative old reprobate (which of course the Old Fuff is), but rather a matter of examining what the realities are. But this is nothing new. If anyone thinks that the revolvers made by Smith & Wesson during the middle 20th century represent the best, they should get one made during the first two decades of that time and see what real workmanship was.

That said, I don’t want to encourage anyone to buy these older guns. It might prevent me from getting them all … :evil:
 
I believe that most of those promoting the guns with The Lock are dealers and those gun writers who are in the makers' pockets. Ad money speaks loudly at most magazines.

I think a fair number of those posting on forums are dealers.

I very much doubt that I will personally ever buy a gun with the lock. Too ugly, and I just flat don't trust them.

I think the solution is to see some lawsuits against atorneys who cause trouble by suing when there is no cause. And the gun companies and their association need to look seriously at this option.
Click to expand...
In the past, I've noted some odd qualities of the SUPER hardcore defenders of S&W as a company.

Back during the highwater mark of the anti-HUD Agreement boycott, I was seeing a small but vocal minority of people in various places on the internet vehemently defending S&W's dealings with the Clinton administration. They sounded very much alike, and defended S&W to such an extent that it sounded like they had a PERSONAL stake in the matter. They did this so much so that I started to believe that they were actually S&W employees, disseminating the company line. I sometimes get a similar impression from certain people on S&W Forum...
 
I think this is healthy, as some less traditional shooters join our community. But they have to understand that voting for Democrats is fatal to gun ownership. The stated goal of that party is to work for more control, and many of them are absolutely virulent in their hatred of firearms.
Click to expand...
Lonestar....you had me until this. Please keep the political views to the "Political Forum". Whether I completely agree with you or not is irrelevant.....in my old age I find that folks have to figure these things out for themselves. Comments like yours rarely sway the otherside.......particularly if they are "slipped" into a thread devoted to the discussion of S&W revolvers, old and new. In my opinion your political views inserted here are more detrimental to the cause than of benefit. YMMV.

That said, I don’t want to encourage anyone to buy these older guns. It might prevent me from getting them all …
Click to expand...
....Ah, ha !...the truth is revealed. :D

-regards
 
I've owned or used several pre-lock revolvers from S&W and one post-lock revolver from S&W. I've also owned and/or used several with and without MIM parts.

I like them all. I believe that the key lock malfunctioning is a rare instance. THe earlier poster was right about it being more a problem of perception. Essentially you have a revolver design which has been highly successful for over 50 years without the internal lock. Following the adage of 'if it isn't broken, don't fix it', would show that the lock isn't needed.

Right now there is a market for older S&W revolvers without the lock and there are newly produced revolvers with the lock.

The most interesting thing to me would be if S&W produced a model with the lock and the exact same model without the lock. Then they should let the market show clearly which model the public would buy.

Jim
 
Drama class

Lone Star, I have to agree with you on the issue of "the other forum." Having been a member of both forums for at least a couple of years, I have seen no more ignorance displayed on one forum than the other.

Also, I must say that the fingerpointing, us versus them types do remind me of some people at that far-away place/time called high school.

There are many forms of bigotry, and more than one kind of phobia. I wonder if labelling that "other forum" full of bigots is bigotted? How non-inclusive to not include those with differing opinions! OOOH, everyone run away, he thinks differently than we do!! He must be a hater! Call the thought police! Hey moderators!!!:eek:
 
Last edited:
I believe that the key lock malfunctioning is a rare instance.
Click to expand...

I guess as long as it doesn't happen to you, it isn't a problem....eehhhh.

It shouldn't even have to be discussed. It should NEVER happen, rare or not. About the only way that will happen is to get rid of it.

bob
 
The lock also saves me money!
Click to expand...

My 3 Tauri saved me money....:uhoh: One of 'em does have the hammer mounted lock, but I lost the key. I don't think there's a way it could activate itself. If I was worried about it, it's easier to disable with a grinding wheel, but still requires getting into the lock work, pulling the hammer. I've never messed with it.

I'm still undecided about the locks on Smiths. Loctite might be the deal. That red stuff (best tasting, btw, mmm, cherry) is some STRONG stuff. Don't put it on a bolt you ever wanna remove, put it that way.

Frankly, I think new Smiths are over-priced big time. The 642 ain't too bad, but most of 'em are north of $500. I'd rather buy a Taurus or Ruger, depending on the application. Used Smiths are no bargain around here, either. I got my last used M66 Taurus for $180 and it shoots very tight groups. Hey, when money's tight, it pays not to be a brand snob.
 
Hopefully this will be the last post about the other forum, as it was not the point of me starting this thread. Please read post #34 where I clearly stated, Im not saying it is everyone in that forum. I also said The lounge is where I had my unenjoyable experience and that is singular so im not saying it is some rampant thing that always occurs, I wouldnt know, because after my one and only brush with it, I have decided not to go back to that forum. They could all be great guys exept for the ones I ran into. Im not interested to find out. With that said, If I eat at burger store X and find a bug in my food, It should be understandable that I wont eat there again, and may even tell someone about my experience. Just because you didnt find a bug in your food does not mean it didnt happen to me. People shouldnt be so defensive, If the shoe doesnt fit you then just dont wear it. I promise that will be my last post about this..thanks to those that stayed on topic.
 
Sorry about the bad experiences ya'll had on the Smith forum. I have had good experience there when needing some repair info. or some advice on which used model to buy or a birthdate. I don't read every post. I own several older S&Ws and I love each one. I do know that Mr. Keenan who posts here on occassion is one of the most helpful and knowledgeable people I have met on forums. I met him on jouster.com and he is consistently a gentleman and always willing to share. Just a plug for a nice person.
 
Im not going to put quotes up of my examples b/c I dont want to turn this into a this forum vs that forum ..
Click to expand...
I agree. Thank you Don. We don't do forum wars at THR. If I am forced to edit and remove this tangental content, then the flow and readability of this thread will suffer. Let's just drop comments regarding other forums now, and get the thread back on track.

This thread from the S&W forum was an attempt to document actual lock induced failures. Hardly an example of blind adulation of the S&W company.

FWIW, I'm a member of the S&W forum as well (same user name).

attachment.php
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

M
  • Locked
S&W Rev's: New style button = lock or not?
Replies
5
Views
470
Mickstix
M
R
  • Locked
Thinking of starting a collection of Smiths.
2
Replies
33
Views
2K
A Pause for the Coz
A
kidneyboy
  • Locked
S&W 625 older vs new
2
Replies
33
Views
2K
mdauben
mdauben
O
  • Locked
Now I get it, old vs new S&W revolvers..
2
Replies
25
Views
2K
Byron Quick
B
elktrout
  • Locked
Pre-lock vs Lock Smith & Wessons
2 3 4 5
Replies
101
Views
5K
aaaaa
aaaaa
Back
Top