Online gun purchases
- Thread starter Slater
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There are 2 stores locally that will almost always beat anything online. The price on the tag is the out the door price including tax. Glocks are $419 right now. I have bought a couple of Ruger Predators for $389. I had them order a Tikka T1 for me @ $440.
But there have been a couple of times when they couldn't get what I wanted and I've ordered from Whittakers and Buds Gun shop in the past. I paid no tax or shipping either time. Transfer costs are $5 at either local location. One guy has an indoor range and he will waive the $5 transfer fee if you pay for one range visit.
It still cost me a little more to order from Buds and Whittakers than the local stores sell the same guns for. But the difference wasn't much and I only ordered when the local guys couldn't get it.
But there have been a couple of times when they couldn't get what I wanted and I've ordered from Whittakers and Buds Gun shop in the past. I paid no tax or shipping either time. Transfer costs are $5 at either local location. One guy has an indoor range and he will waive the $5 transfer fee if you pay for one range visit.
It still cost me a little more to order from Buds and Whittakers than the local stores sell the same guns for. But the difference wasn't much and I only ordered when the local guys couldn't get it.
OneFreeTexan
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I like Gunbroker for the unusual, or discontinued guns that I like....Can’t really find them locally,
Have never been disappointed.
Have never been disappointed.
Shhhh...... We don't need people competing for the quality used guns and boosting prices.
Everyone, buy only BRAND NEW black rifles and plastic pistols. Do NOT buy used, especially those old wood and blued steel guns. They are probably crap, they might even be dangerous to shoot.
I've had some online sales go really well and some less so. There sure is more inventory to select from online. I did get one where I decided exactly what I wanted, and got a decent price online, and all good. Other purchases, just sent one back as a complete fail last week. Still kind of offended they wasted my time shipping it to me, thinking I might keep it. I probably just won't deal with that seller again, but maybe I will - if I want what they have bad enough … lolShhhh...... We don't need people competing for the quality used guns and boosting prices.
Everyone, buy only BRAND NEW black rifles and plastic pistols. Do NOT buy used, especially those old wood and blued steel guns. They are probably crap, they might even be dangerous to shoot.
I was astounded at one of my last purchases on line.It was with Classic Firearms. They charged me 6% Michigan sales tax on the purchase as well as 6% sales tax on the shipping charges.
I was irate and called them. The sales tax on the Star BM @ $179.99 should have been $10.80 (6%). They charged me $12.29 in tax. The extra $1.49 was for tax on the shipping. (&*^&(%(&&^(0*7##$@64
I was irate and called them. The sales tax on the Star BM @ $179.99 should have been $10.80 (6%). They charged me $12.29 in tax. The extra $1.49 was for tax on the shipping. (&*^&(%(&&^(0*7##$@64
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dogtown tom
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There is no need for nexus since the US Supreme Court ruling in South Dakota v Wayfair.
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/50-state-guide-internet-sales-tax-laws.html
There is a store in North Atlanta that does free transfer's. Can't remember the name. A little Google Fu will show them. Shop around to find a lower transfer rate. My LGS charges $35 flat fee for transfer's. Never ordered one online.
silicosys4
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What I've purchased online this mongth vs. LGS prices.
GP100 LNIB purchased online for $350, $415 out the door after shipping, tax, and transfer fee. LGS wants $500+ before tax for the same gun.
Remington R51 2nd gen in 98% condition, purchased online for $150, $215 after shipping, tax, and transfer fee. LGS wants $299 before tax for the same gun
Magnum Research Desert Eagle MKI .44 magnum with extra MKXIX slide, MKXIX .50 barrel, and MKXIX .44 barrel for $800, LGS that did transfer said they would price the package at $1800 - $2000 if they had it in the shop.
S&W customized PPC gun online for $299, will be $360 after tax, shipping, and transfer. Best guess is $650-$800 before tax if priced in my LGS judging by similar guns they have sold in the past
I can still find much better prices online even considering tax, transfer, and shipping.
dogtown tom
Member
The State of Michigan thinks 6% is charged on shipping fees:
https://www.michigan.gov/taxes/0,4676,7-238-43519_43529-154427--,00.html
.
ponchh
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Those are agreements between the state and a company. I now have to pay sales tax at Amazon but not Buds.
Styx
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For most guns, my LGS charge over $50-$100+ over internet prices. I pay $15 transfer fee one one gun or $25 for up to 3 serials.
At my LGS as I write this getting sights installed. Two examples are the M&P Shield 2.0 that they have for $450 and the Walther PPS M2 that they have for $499. I purchased my PPS M2 LE (3 mags) for $300. The 2.0 Shield can be purchased online from multiple retailers for $329 shipped at some places.
At my LGS as I write this getting sights installed. Two examples are the M&P Shield 2.0 that they have for $450 and the Walther PPS M2 that they have for $499. I purchased my PPS M2 LE (3 mags) for $300. The 2.0 Shield can be purchased online from multiple retailers for $329 shipped at some places.
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dogtown tom
Member
No, it's not an agreement between the state and a company......its the result of South Dakota v Wayfair.
And Buds will be in hot water pretty soon when the State of Arkansas finds out they aren't collecting Arkansas sales tax: https://www.salestaxinstitute.com/r...ts-economic-and-marketplace-nexus-legislation
and https://www.dfa.arkansas.gov/excise...emote-seller-frequently-asked-questions-faqs/
ponchh
Member
I guess all vendors I buy from are in a heap of trouble. Amazon is the only one that collects taxes and Amazon doesn't collect taxes in all states. It made the news here when they came to the agreement to collect.
dogtown tom
Member
Yeah, did you read any of the links I posted about South Dakota v Wayfair?
You should, 'cause that will explain a lot.
They are, states want that revenue and do not care if the companies go broke as they are in other states anyway.
USA Today article from 4 days ago,
https://preview.tinyurl.com/rlr43xs
Yahoo News
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/online-sales-tax-ruling-challenges-150205865.html
Inc,
https://www.inc.com/carrie-mckeegan...ales-tax-a-nightmare-heres-how-to-get-by.html
And this.
https://taxfoundation.org/online-sales-tax-systems-legal-challenges-after-wayfair/
I would not want to be a small business trying to comply with all the different state laws and even greater number of locality added taxes.
Wayfair was simply a bad decision that the court did to force Congress to fix the situation from the previous Quill ruling.
My LGS charges $25 for transfer, there is no BC if one is a holder of a Carry permit.
I don't know how it is in other states, my SIL is a dealer in WV and it does not cost her any thing to do a back round check.
I think the change in collecting sales tax on sales no matter if the seller has a store in your state or not was changed by our great leaders in congress.
I now get charged tax on any thing I get from Amazon.
There is one thing I am not sure about is, I bought a new kitchen stove and refrigerator last year from a company in NY no shipping and no sales tax to me in NC.
When I asked the driver where they came from he said Raleigh, NC, What I have been told is they charge sales tax to NJ, CT and NY.
I would think it is a book keeping mess to keep track of every sale to every state.
I don't know how it is in other states, my SIL is a dealer in WV and it does not cost her any thing to do a back round check.
I think the change in collecting sales tax on sales no matter if the seller has a store in your state or not was changed by our great leaders in congress.
I now get charged tax on any thing I get from Amazon.
There is one thing I am not sure about is, I bought a new kitchen stove and refrigerator last year from a company in NY no shipping and no sales tax to me in NC.
When I asked the driver where they came from he said Raleigh, NC, What I have been told is they charge sales tax to NJ, CT and NY.
I would think it is a book keeping mess to keep track of every sale to every state.
dogtown tom
Member
Didn't read anything is this thread?
PaFrank
Member
I always give my LGS first crack at pricing something I want.. Often he can match it or come close enough that I toss him a bone... but even when he cannot, he charges $25 to receive and transfer... and thats for everybody not just me
George P
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Soon it will be cheaper to have your LGS buy from Bud's or similar
George P
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So you're comparing you buying new guns online versus your LGS selling new..........not exactly fair.
I've tried to explain this before and it evidently it didn't get much traction, so I'll try again. The core of the issue is where the "buy" takes place. As I hope most folks understand, unless you have an FFL, you cannot "buy" a handgun from someone outside of your state, or, in most cases, a long gun from a state that is not contiguious to your state. Yes, you may send the person the money, but you are not actually "buying" the item at that point. The actual "buy" only takes place when you take possession of the merchandise. In the case of a firearm that has been transferred from one FFL to another, that means that the accepting FFL isn't the actual "buyer," but rather the "buyer" is the person into whose hands the firearm is being transferred. If the FFL were the "buyer," he/she would have to pay sales tax on it! So, when the person who sent the money, finally fills out the paperwork and the background check, etc. is approved, the tax has to be paid at that point. That is why more and more FFL holders are including a copy of the business license with their FFL when they send it out for the firearm you bought six states away. He/she knows that somebody will have to pay a sales tax somewhere along the line and he/she doesn't want to be the one stuck paying it. In the past, one consequence of all this was that if the federal folks really wanted to shut down a dealer, they would do a very careful audit, and then if they couldn't find any violoations that they could use to shut down the dealer, they would quietly mention to the state tax folks that it appeared that this particular LGS wasn't submitting all of the sales taxes they were supposed to be submitting. The result was often a heafty fine that the LGS couldn't afford to pay, so having lost his/her business licence, he/she were out of business which is what the feds wanted in the first place.
The folks who have pointed out that things have changed in recent years and the states want more money are correct. For example, years ago, there was no tax on services, only on physical things. Now, lots of states have instituted a tax on services. It used to be that the plumber, for instance, only charged tax on the parts he/she used, but now most states require him/her to collect tax (state gov. folks don't like us saying they "charge tax" but rather "collect tax") on his/her service as well as the parts.
So, if your state is one of those states with a sales tax on services, you're supposed to be paying a sales tax on top of the fee that the LGS is charging you. In my county, for example, sales tax is 7.5 %, so when my LGS charges $20 for a transfer, he really should be collecting $21.50, and if he/she doesn't charge that additon $1.50 in sales tax, he/she will have to take it out of his/her pocket at some point. Hope this helps.
The folks who have pointed out that things have changed in recent years and the states want more money are correct. For example, years ago, there was no tax on services, only on physical things. Now, lots of states have instituted a tax on services. It used to be that the plumber, for instance, only charged tax on the parts he/she used, but now most states require him/her to collect tax (state gov. folks don't like us saying they "charge tax" but rather "collect tax") on his/her service as well as the parts.
So, if your state is one of those states with a sales tax on services, you're supposed to be paying a sales tax on top of the fee that the LGS is charging you. In my county, for example, sales tax is 7.5 %, so when my LGS charges $20 for a transfer, he really should be collecting $21.50, and if he/she doesn't charge that additon $1.50 in sales tax, he/she will have to take it out of his/her pocket at some point. Hope this helps.
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dogtown tom
Member
1. You sure as heck can buy a handgun or long gun from outside your state, happens thousands of times per day.
2. Don't confuse"buy" with "transfer of possession". One is a financial transaction the other is not.
3. Oh, my goodness,
the contiguous state restriction on long gun sales ended thirty four years ago. The Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986.False.
Well who/which is it?
First you claim the person sending cash IS NOT the buyer, now they ARE the buyer.
Says who?
I'm a member of the largest dealers forum on the internet and have not heard of a single FFL doing such nonsense.
Most likely because a transfer dealer IS NOT THE BUYER.
When a dealer makes a business purchase of an item for resale, he does send in his state sales tax permit. But thats only on his purchases.
Well, he isn't the seller, he's only performing the transfer. When I do a transfer I'm not selling a firearm, I'm performing a service.....not taxable in Texas.
If I were to sell a firearm from my inventory I would collect Texas sales tax.
Yeah, horsehockey.
1. ATF doesn't review a dealers financial records during a compliance inspection.
2. If they can't review a dealers financial records they have nothing to tattle on.
3. A dealers bound book is a record of acquisitions and dispositions........doesn't show whether it was a sale, repair, or transfer.
4. "federal folks really wanted to shut down a dealer" with no violations? Yeah....you're making stuff up.
Just stop.
Edited to add:
Your understanding of who or when the sales tax is collected is off as well.
For example, if a buyer in Texas orders a gun from Palmetto State Armory in South Carolina, PSA is required to collect 8% Texas sales tax and remit that to the state of Texas. The transfer dealer in Texas isn't involved in anything but the transfer and has nothing whatsover to do with any part of the financial transaction.
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