Open to comments on Beretta 92 Series

[Sean Smith]

Concerning military vs. civilian Berettas, I was issued an M9 for almost 6 years in the military, and after shooting a new 96FS (US made, and not even the updated 96A1), I can tell you that subjectively the civilian Beretta was leaps and bounds nicer in every single way. The difference was kind of stunning actually. I don't know if this is normal but it's something to think about. If nothing else I imagine it's easier to ensure quality when making small batches for civilian sale than when you're cranking out huge lots of guns all at once for a government order. Could that be a factor in civilian market Berettas racking up round counts that would make a military-issue M9 jealous? Maybe.

Another thing to think about is that almost nobody practices with +P ammo, but military 9x19 is all +P. That might not sound like a big difference, but if you hit the locking block 5% harder than the design can really handle that doesn't mean you're giving it just 5% more wear. It could easily be 100% more wear, or even more. For civilian shooters who might only put a couple of magazines of +P self defense ammo through their gun over its entire lifetime this is irrelevant of course.

 

[harmon rabb]

I have concealed carried a Beretta 92 for over a year and a half now - even in the summer...

It's not that hard...

Anyone can conceal anything, it's a matter of how much effort you want to make. If you want to pull on any random pair of shorts and and random t-shirt, you're not going to be able to carry a 92 in the summer. If you're willing to find the right holster, and are willing to select your clothing properly, you can do it.

 

[Shipwreck]

Anyone can conceal anything, it's a matter of how much effort you want to make. If you want to pull on any random pair of shorts and and random t-shirt, you're not going to be able to carry a 92 in the summer. If you're willing to find the right holster, and are willing to select your clothing properly, you can do it.

I wear cargo pants 99% of the time outside of work. I carry IWB at 3 o'clock with a comptac holster. I'm not a huge guy - 185lbs, 6'1"

As long as the t-shirt isn't one of those super thin and super tight $5 wal-mart specials - I have no issue with hiding the 92 with just regular t shirts.

No, I do not carry it if and when I carry shorts - I could, if I wanted to wear cargo shorts. But, I always thought they look funny. So, if I do wear shorts, its more exercise type shorts. And, without a belt, I can't carry like that.

But, I wear more cargo pants 99% of the time. Only time I really wear shorts is when I wash my car.

 

[mr.scott]

jack - Not anymore. At the last gun show I compared a US and a Italian side by side and the US one was better all around.

 

[Gunner442]

I carried a M9 for 20 years in the service, and have thousands of rounds ( firearms instructor/competitions, etc) and never had an issue with the pistol. Sweet shooter, and accurate. The military had a problem with cheap(low bidder) magazines a few years back. Stick with Beretta mags and you should not have a problem.

 

[IdahoLT1]

Chindo, no disrespect to you but if I had to believe the testing at Berettas factory with government officials watching or an anonymous internet forum member, Im gonna believe the former. With Govt. officials watching, the Beretta M9's averaged one malfunction every 20,500 rounds. This is a far cry from your claims. From my own personal experience, Ive shot over 5000 flawless rounds through my 92F(made in 1989) w/out touching a thing(locking blocks or recoil springs). I have no idea how many rounds had been through it before I owned it but it had been shot a lot. Im taking your opinion with a grain of salt.

 

[prickett]

I've owned several over the years (6) and currenty have two. They are high quality hand guns. Slide breakage was not a big issue (only on the internet) The Navy didn't like them and bought some Sigs, which also had some slide failures. Yes they are large and fairly heavy but are accurate and very reliable. Just rack the slide, no other pistol can compare. And no, I am not a Beretta nut, most of the 25 guns I own are S&W and Sig.

he he! just got an email back from taurus saying my PT-99 (taurus version of the beretta) is being returned with a replaced broken slide.

i've had both the typical broken beretta/taurus parts: broken slide and before that, a broken locking lug after a shot count of less than 7K.

something else to consider is the inability (unless the design has changed recently) to change out the sights to fiber optic or tritium.

 

[Chindo18Z]

Im taking your opinion with a grain of salt.

I don't believe anonymous internet posters either.

This thread asked for comments on the 92 series and I've offered mine. I stand by every observation I have made.

YMMV.

 

[Onmilo]

I'm still waiting to break a slide or a locking block on a Beretta,,,

 

[Whiskey11]

I think chindo brings up an interesting point about nato ammo, I just find it hard to believe that a pistol designed to function with that ammo would fail so high with it and beretta NOT fix it. I would hope that the new versions would at least try and fix the problem.

But comparing civvie ammo round counts to nato counts is a stretch.

 

[leadcounsel]

The Beretta 92 series, (aka the M9 in the military) is one of the few handguns I don't really care for. It's alright, but there are much better ones that are less expensive, more rugged and more reliable and less cumbersome/bulky.

My first gun was a 92 so I had some sentimental attachment. I didn't care for it after getting more experience with other guns.

I've shot my personal one many times but also carried one in Iraq many many months. Much training with one. I don't care for it.

Others that are better and smaller, less expensive, etc. are the CZ 75, Glock, XD, Hi Power, S&W M&P.... you can do much better than the 92.

 

[DesertVet]

I was issued and carried the M-9 for 10 years in the US Army. I carried it all over Europe, put a fairly high round count through them traing CQB. I carried one in Operation Joint Guardian, Operation Noble Eagle, Operation Enduring Freedom, and Operation Iraqi Freedom.I found them to be accurate and reliable when maintained to Army/unit SOPs.
The malfunctions I witnessed were due to poor quality aftermarket magazines the Army had supplied and running the weapon without proper lubrication. While it is not my very first choice of a 9mm pistol, I have carried them in arguably the most dangerous places in the world and into combat. I would carry one again if needed and I am confidant it would perform as needed if properly maintained/cared for.
I have three currenly in my personal inventory, one with a high round count in the neighborhood of 20,000 rounds....no problems yet.
Also, the civillian US made Beretta 92FSs that I own are IDENTICAL to the weapons I used in the Army except markings on the slide. The newer ones seem to be different with plastic parts and angled dust covers....not sure if its better or not.
It properly maintained, lubricated, and good quality magazines are used, the M-9/Beretta 92FS will perform as well as needed for any defensive uses of a 9mm sidearm in my experiences. I used them in combat, used them extensively in military training, used them as sidearms during high risk protection details, Quick Reaction Force missions, and Counter-Terrorism / Force Protection missions. I have also used this weapon in the past for Law Enforcement duty.
NOT my very 1st choice for a 9mm but it is still a good choice!

 

[DesertVet]

A good friend of mine who was involved with the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center's transition to semi auto pistols some years ago in Glynco Ga, was a Law Enforcement Firearms Instructor, helped set up the International Police Academy in Jordan, is also former Special Operationand has been a DOD contractor since 2005 in some of worst places on the planet SWEARS by the 92FS for what it's worth.

 

[Proud Southern Son]

I'd like to offer my not-so-unique perspective on the 92. Like Chindo, I have a fairly extensive history with this particular pistol. However, my experience has been law enforcement and civilian specific, and have never handled a military issue gun. I've shot some supposedly "NATO spec" rounds, but at nowhere near the number of Chindo, I'm sure.
When I first came into the business about twenty years ago, the Beretta, the S & W third generations, and the Sigs were the most popular carry guns in this region (Glocks were still made fun of here). I was in the Beretta camp. I've also been an enthusiast for longer than I've been the police, so I tended to shoot a lot... not just at mandatory range sessions, and even reloaded my own ammo for practice for a period of time. In the late nineties Glocks became more accepted and in about '04 I started carrying my issue Glock 23 on a regular basis. Besides my issue gun, I also regularly shoot one of my 92s and a personally owned Glock 22. I give all my guns about the same attention when it comes to maintenance and cleaning. I'm not one that keeps a good round count, but I figure that I've shot about equal amounts through both platforms, maybe still a little more with the Beretta design. I also would bet that I've seen fellow officers put similar numbers of rounds through each platform at training events and qualifications. I've owned several other types of pistol, but these are the only two handguns with which I would ever claim to be extensively familiar.
Here's what I've seen: Reliability-wise, I've probably seen equal malfunctions in Glocks and Berettas. Personally, with my guns, I've experienced more malfunctions with Glocks (very few). Durability-wise, I've seen more parts breakage with Glocks (usually recoil guide rod assembly or extractor). Personally, with my guns, I've experienced a broken extractor on a Glock, a broken slide catch on a Beretta 96 (.40 cal), and a broken firing pin on a 92.
Having said this, I trust Glocks and Berettas equally. I now carry a Glock every day on the job. My home and family is defended with Beretta when I'm not there. I can't give a higher endorsement than that to any gun. Admittedly, my endorsement is worth no more than the next "anonymous internet poster", but this thread was about opinions, right?
As a side note, I did own two 1911s in the past. Never could get either (both big-name manufacturers) to shoot more than a couple of hundred rounds without a malfunction. I won't go back that route, and I'll never again pay a gunsmith to make an expensive gun work as it was designed. Mighta been just bad luck on my part, but it sure wasn't my imagination.

Just as Chindo, I also stand by my observations.