Opinions - concealed carry for small female

[LightningMan]

MY 2 cents for what it's worth, I was at my clubs range where a couple were shooting, and the wife was trying different simi-auto pistols for the purpose of concealed carry. This gal was on the petite side, and could not rack the slide on any of the pistols her husband gave her to try, also she had a hard time hitting the targets. I too suggested a revolver, but if she had to have an auto pistol, that a Tomcat tip-up barrel might be the only way to go. Then I remembered I had my Sig P238 with me, and that little .380 has a slide that is easy to rack, so dug it out of my shooting bag. Low and behold, she could rack the side, and hit most the the targets. Her husband said; "I think we found a pistol for you" I haven't seen them sence, so I don't know how it worked out for them. LM

 

[jon_in_wv]

Supposedly the cracked frame issue didn't effect the inox Tomcats. Personally, I think the Tomcat sounds like a good one for her. If she likes it she is much more likely to practice and carry it. I don't think the snub nosed 38 is a good choice for her at all. The lightweights are miserable to shoot and the steel framed ones are too heavy for what she wants. Stay away from the 22 mags. Not a good round for self defense in my opinion.

Personally I would try to talk her into the LCP or the 380 Bodyguard. Both are much better shooters than they have any right to be and they are lighter and more convenient to carry than the others. Also, take to her the a shop and have her handle a Kahr 380 or 9mm. They are really cool too. She might like that one. If she is stuck on the DA/SA trigger the Bersa 380 is a great weapon for a lady. Recoil is almost non existent and its accurate and reliable too. Its a little larger than the other 380s but its still lighter and easier to carry than a steel framed 38 and a heck of a lot easier to shoot than a lightweight snubbie.

 

[Madcap_Magician]

The Tomcat is actually not the worst gun she could have, besides the obvious caliber issue. If her heart is set on it, and she's tried all the others, that may be the way to go.

With a little training, she should be able to figure out how to rack a slide.

In that case, I would recommend a Kahr K9 or the Walther PPS. They both carry a much better load and are very compact. The Walther is lighter, of course, having a polymer frame. Both have a reputation of being easy to shoot.

The Walther may be the best bet if she wants to take it running. I find when I run that a gun that gets much over a pound is hard to carry comfortably, especially when you add in a cell phone, driver's license, CCW permit, and keys.

 

[jon_in_wv]

The Kahr CW9 is also a great choice and the price is good too.

 

[Manco]

I've had the chance to help out a fair number of very small asian women that came out for their first ever gun shooting expierience. Once shown how to hold the slide with an overhand four finger and heel of palm hold and to commit to really racking the slide hard they all did well.

The biggest problem was that at first they were afraid to really put any power into racking the slide for fear of breaking the gun. Yep, honestly.

Based on my own experiences, at least, I think you nailed the root cause. As far as I can tell, a healthy woman of virtually any size (the smallest I've helped so far is a slender 4'11") can generate enough physical force to rack a slide, with no special techniques required; I do recommend the overhand grip, however, as it is stronger. They just need to be forceful and merciless on the gun, which as you've observed many are reluctant to be. I've had to describe what happens to the slide when shooting and then let them shoot a few rounds to see how that feels in order to convince them that they could not possibly harm the gun by racking the slide too hard.

Amusing side note: A pair of these very small and light first timers got all giggly and nervous at the idea of shooting a 12Ga shotgun. Someone at the next station was shooting one while I was working them through a 9mm semi. They were shocked at what looked like a crazy gun and all the noise. I told them that I could show them how and it would not hurt them. The reluctantly agreed. By the end of a shared box of target loads they were happy as could be. Two weeks later they came back... For the shotgun...

They probably found the shotgun more comfortable to shoot, especially if it has a short or adjustable stock. I think the main ergonomic issue that beginners need the most help with regarding long guns is the fit between the stock and their shoulder. Show them how to properly hold a rifle or shotgun, and they'll have fun, while others who don't get the proper instruction (so simple and basic) may end up with a sore bicep or face or other body part, and may never want to touch a long gun again.

 

[chieftain]

My youngest daughter is a 24yo at 4'10" and carry's a Springfield EMP 9mm for her CCW/EDC. Her primary shooter is a full sized Colt Government model in 45acp of course.

The grip of the EMP is smaller than any other 1911. That IS what is special about the EMP.

Good luck.

Fred

 

[allaroundhunter]

The Sig P238 is the softest shooting sub-compact .380 that I have ever shot. It has much better sights than most other "mouse guns", is very accurate, and it is still light enough to barely (or not) notice it when carried. The slide is also extremely easy to manipulate

 

[Captain]

Kahr PM9 is what I got for my wife and daughter. Small framed women and small but powerful firearm. Easy to conceal and carry for them also.

 

[Certaindeaf]

I think our military requires someone on the payroll to carry more than two pounds per forty mile day. What was the nevermind.

 

[3KillerBs]

Size doesnt matter for her to conceal... She could put a revolver in a purse or any other gun for that matter. There is ankle carry iwb shoulder and on the inside of your upper leg. I find women have it easy because of their purse. There is a YouTube girl that she's ways women can better conceal u should check her out I'll edit this post with her user name. - Faliaphotography is her name shows different ways for different types of dress.

It is a serious mistake to think purse carry first when a woman is considering carrying a gun. There are far too many social situations where it is normal and expected for a woman to set her purse down and walk away from it.

Purse carry, like dayplanner carry and briefcase carry, should be considered a last resort for when no other method works at all.

 

[3KillerBs]

Has she tried a Taurus PT709 Slim?

I'm afraid that I can't really comment on slide racking issues because that's never been a problem for me despite my small hands. But I do have difficulty with concealment since I'm both short and overweight and the Slim is small enough to conceal for almost all purposes.

I can say that I absolutely DO NOT recommend my MPA Protector .380 for any beginner because it is quite difficult to rack and actively painful to fire. The tiny size may look appealing, but its a special purpose gun for people who know what they are doing.

It is a counter-intuitive fact that larger semi-autos are often easier to rack. So if she can find a means of concealing something bigger than a sub-compact she may find such a gun easier to handle.

My carry method is to use a bellyband around my ribcage with the gun positioned under my strong-side arm as if it were a vertical shoulder holster. I've got enough range of motion in my shoulder to draw that way if the barrel isn't too long. I don't have enough length in my arm to reach a traditional shoulder holster with the DD obstacles in the way.

 

[heyjoe]

if you rack the slide with just one in the magazine instead of fully loaded, it is much easier to do. next fill the magazine and insert it into the gun. you are ready to go.

 

[IdahoSkies]

First off Welcome. Second I owned and loved my tomcat. I mean really loved it. I carried it every day, everywhere I was legally allowed to. Until it broke. It was a blued model, and the crack threw the accuracy to heck. It was really bad. Beretta redesigned the Tomcat with a wider slid that was supposed to fix the problem. It makes the gun heavier and I felt like it made the slide uncomfortable (look around you probably can find a wide body model to at least hold) to grip. The wider slide also prohibits one from installing a crimson trace grip on the pistol.

After getting it back from beretta (they sent a new replacement pistol to me) I traded it away for a kel-tec p32 and have been very happy. However, it does not have the incredibly comfortable heft and feel the tomcat had. If that is what your friend likes, I strongly suggest she try the sig p238. It is about the same weight, and it feel almost as comfortable (IMO). The slide is easy to rack (much easier than the tomcat's) and the recoil is really incredibly mild for a pistol that size. The Sig p238 has the added bonus of being chambered for the .380 which has some much better self defense ammo, than the .32 ACP does (and this coming from someone who carries a .32 every day).

Good luck. Have your friend read the cornered cat. Hopefully you are not bombarded by to many well meaning opinions, and put a p238 in your friends hand before she decides to buy something. (If she doesn't like it she has tried the closest thing she could).

(The p238 is more expensive, be prepared for some sticker shock. That is probably why I went with a kt32).

 

[Serenity]

Welcome to THR!

I always have trouble with the slide lock when checking out a new gun; I bought my P226 due in part to the fact that I could operate everything on it without moving my hands around.

I haven't shot but I fondled a Kahr PM9 and I really liked it. It is heavier but with a secured holster I don't think it would be a problem.

 

[doc2rn]

I have lost more good guns to small women than I care to count, but hey its worth it! I recomment a S&W mod 10 in either 2" or 3" for daily carry, and a Kel Tec .32 for CCW. Another great gun, if you can find one, is a Ruger SP 101 in .32 H&R magnum. My sister in law (who is anti-gun and shall remain nameless) may have turned the corner when I let her shoot mine on the last family outing, and its the only gun she wanted to shoot...baby steps.

 

[mortablunt]

Welcome to THR. Women tend to be built differently from men, so our CC options would look plain obvious on you. An M1911 is a slim and easy gun to conceal, but it might not work on your friend. I myself am 5'5" and I've managed to conceal an Airsoft M1911 rather well. The best advice for her is to try on various holsters and guns. Fortunately, there are many subcompact handguns of respectable caliber so there's a pocket pistol with her name on it somewhere. Don't buy a handgun for anyone who isn't there to okay that particular gun and how it works with their hands.

Look at this blog post made by a woman who routinely carries a gun concealed.
http://corneredcat.com/Concealed_Carry_for_the_Fashionable_Woman/

 

[PabloJ]

Since the Ruger LCP is out we are down to 10% Peppergard and large male or female companion for those jogs or hikes. In big bear country I would take along person I could outrun.

 

[aaronu]

Another option for the lady: Sig P230 or P232 in .380 ACP. Easy to rack, simple design. Very elegant looking pistol. No safety, just a decocking lever.

 

[SHR970]

Chopchopgirl wrote: Any ideas? I'm about to suggest she get and American Arms .22 MAG -no racking, but no real protection either, or get the Tomcat and pray for success.

I believe you meant no real stopping power either.

I know that the plural of anecdote does not equal data but there are plenty of instances that a 22 pistol or revolver equalled threat neutralized. In most instances the possibility of being shot was enough to thwart the threat. If the goblin believes that there is a real possibility that he will be ventilated, he will probably retreat. Part of that is the person on the other end showing the confidence that they can and will use that gun to hurt them. As the saying goes, a 32 auto in hand beats a 45 auto on the dresser.

I'm 5'4" and I have issues with double stack weapons and large caliber semi's due to grip issues. I can shoot them well enough in nonstress situations but they are not my first choice. I have carried professionally in harms way in the past and know that high cap. does not equal high hit percentage when it counts.

Have her try a variety of weapons like the Sig, 230 / 232, 238, 239, Ladysmith, Walther PPK, etc. The one that fits the hand well is the one that will be more easily controlled. With that comes confidence in the ability to use the weapon. If that means using an Amer. Arms Guardian or Black Widow so be it. Also a snub with a more full grip like a Centennial is worth a look. Look to local gun ranges that have a selection of weapons available for rent. If it is a double action revolver, have her fire it in that manner and not cock it between shots because when it hits the fan that is what she will do. If she can't hit the target Double Action Only then move to another candidate. If Semiauto DA/SA, have her fire the first shot Double action then the rest Single action as that is how the gun will be used in real life. She has to find the gun that she can shoot and hit the target like she is pointing her finger at it.

People who say that in a 5'4" frame you can easily conceal a 1911 are full of themselves and don't understand reality. The trick is to have it on you, not in a purse that can easily and quickly be taken from you before you can react. A 22 L.R. at point blank in the crotch will readjust someones attitude real quick.

 

[chieftain]

People who say that in a 5'4" frame you can easily conceal a 1911 are full of themselves and don't understand reality. The trick is to have it on you, not in a purse that can easily and quickly be taken from you before you can react. A 22 L.R. at point blank in the crotch will readjust someones attitude real quick.

The literate will have read it earlier, but that is why for CCW/EDC my 4'10" daughter carries a Springfield EMP.

She most often carries using the Galco ankle glove, and it seems to work well for her.

Go figure.

Fred

 

[PabloJ]

Large male companion should be good "sand bag" or nice Griz toy if needed. The 1911 style pistol in 9x19 is ladies gun for sure obviously a man would favor .45ACP.

 

[Geno]

ChopChopGirl:

First, welcome to The High Road.

The best option, for anyone, is to find a user-friendly store with a range. When I go to purchase a pistol/revolver, I like to go to Target Sports here in Michigan.

When I walk in, I have the cash in-hand, and have a general idea of what I want. Since Ray rents what he sells, I let him know that I am here to buy a firearm, but am undecided between 3 or 4. He lets me try those free of charge, because I am for fact leaving with a new handgun. That's called good business sense.

As I always advise folks, man or woman, fit is everything. If it doesn't feel right, you likely won't shoot it right. In terms of caliber, I personally am as-scared of a .22LR revolver as I am of a .380, a 9mm, a .45 ACP or even .44 Mag. Heck, bullets cause a humanoid to spring leaks!!! That isn't a good thing, unless the objective is to stop an attack.

Best of luck and have your friend sign-up here and cornered cat. They are both great places to hang-out with decent, like-minded folks.

Geno

 

[Byrd666]

How about the Keltec P3AT with the extended magazine. Or like another person said, a revolver, like the Ruger LCR

 

[MAG-63]

Sig P232.

 

[19&41]

Another vote for the Keltec P3AT. It's small, flat and though it looks ratty, it has a good texture to hold and if she was using it to take on runs it would not be a weapon one would worry about having it's looks ruined. Whatever the choice, try before you buy!