Pack at work? Despite company policy?

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I packed in a hospital when I was working night duty. I would have a 9mm IWB to and from work and I would have a .25 in my pocket, even if I was in an operating theatre.
Why? Because this was in Johannesburg and the security guards there are armed with batons only. The official policy is for staff to hand their guns in to security. It is a long process and there is a big delay while recording the serial number, how many magazines, name of owner etc.
There were enough incidents on hospital premises for me to know that a gun in a security depot is no use when things go sour. So I kept the 9mm in my own locker and carried the .25 on me. If there was ever a ruckus out front at the trauma unit, I swapped the .25 for the 9mm and carried it IWB. A lot of guys saw me packing, but nobody ever reported me. I guess that's what comes of being one of the few armed staff members there. They've had patients pull guns on them in the traum unit, they've had patients gunned down on the ward, and they've had rival families brawling out front. Until the Flying Squad gets there, its nice to know they can come down to the X-ray department and at least there will be some defense from the evil-doers.

One morning after I finished my shift, I got a call from one of the ortho consultants (who is a reserve policeman). He said "Quick, get down to the rear helipad, now!"
When I got there, a police helicopter was there, just about to take off. I jumped in with the ortho and we took off, looking for a suspect. I was an extra pair of eyes. I wasn't supposed to be packing on the chopper, but they trusted me enough not to make things awkward. We never found the guy.
Same applies to several trips on the rescue chopper (as an observer). I packed there too. But that's the nice thing about a hospital: the staff members tend to look after each other. I X-rayed that pilot and he took me for a spin on the way to the rear hangar.
Twice I was told I could not accompany first responders UNLESS I was packing. Once was with the Johannesburg Flying Squad on a night patrol, and the other time was in a doctor's medical response vehicle on New Year's Eve, also in Johannesburg. Those were both very enlightening experiences.
So I guess the answer is yes, I have carried as often as I can, but the South Africans haven't given me any trouble about that. It is probably also to do with respect for me as a radiographer, as well as a feeling of added security. Never had to draw in the hospital (but came close twice). Drew once in the medical response car, and drew once after exiting the police car at the scene of a reported robbery. They are covered by an indemnity form, and the captain in charge of that unit is the same guy who taught me 'things' ;)

Most unusual place I carried (unannounced) was on a military helicopter in the Drakensberg mountains. I won't say how I got to ride on that, but I can say it is my number one unusual carry place as a civilian.

Here is the Oryx:

ORYXoutsideview.gif

And here is the view from where I was sitting on the deck:

ORYXdoorview.gif

So I guess what I should inscribe on my pistol is "Have ticket, will ride" :)
 
Results 1 - 10 of about 1,210 for txgho1911. (0.32 seconds)

ok so try google folks.
That number 1210 is scary. This name is on company filters.
Don't ask don't tell is a good policy.
Does not help when 100+ folks in your building are getting walking papers from now till Jan. Seems just to good a time for setlin old scores.
 
I have my 45 in a fanny pack, I carry it everywhere...When Im at work, it goes into a drawer in my workbenck/toolbox area...I can get to it pretty fast if I need to...We have notjhing in our handbook in regards to weapons...so I just stay mum..:)
 
Employees are prohibited from bringing weapons onto company premises, including buildings, parking lots, or any other company property.

This policy applies to weapons of all kinds, including guns and knives, and to related paraphernalia such as ammunition.

Policies like this one make me chuckle, especially in some of the shops I've worked at that had such. "No dangerous or deadly weapons"; good luck with that one in an autoshop. 4 foot prybar, 3 pound hammer, 20" screwdriver, Sureshot cans full of brake clean (AKA, flamethrower:evil: ) etc, etc.

That said, the nature of the job offers abundant cover, should some looney try to shoot up the place. I shouldn't have trouble getting to my car 40' away (we are not prohibited from keeping weapons on the premesis). I find carry to be more than a PITA than it's worth. Have to get in too many awkward positions and could easily print or outright expose.
 
"Results 1 - 10 of about 6,300,000 for green lantern. (0.13 seconds) "

:evil: I just found an advantage to my "generic" username!

Even though *I* brought it up, I'm not overly paranoid about my EMPLOYER using 'net dirt against me. At least until THEY can buy your ISP from your provider or something. OR you yap and tell them your net doings, OR you do it on a company computer. Thankfully the last option isn't even available to me...! ;)

Really, with at-will employment, what's the point? You don't need a REASON to quit, they don't need a REASON to fire you...

Like others have said about feeding your family - your disability or death benefit if you're maimed or killed by a BG will probably run out quicker than your income from a new job.

And on "keeping your word, always" - if EVERYONE in the course of history thought like that, I promise we wouldn't be here now at a RKBA board. Maybe a "tea, crumpets, and cricket" board! :D
 
How's the air up there on that horse? Because you know that the anti-self defense stuffed shirt bean-counters that MAKE such policies? In lieu of common sense, rational thought, and oftentimes REAL security measures and concern for employee safety...?

THEY sure can't claim "the high road!"

So, you think it's OK for a man not to keep his word, so long as the person he is making his oath too isnt a good person?

The fact that MY word is unshakable has nothing to do with the people I give it to, it has to do with me. I am not a liar, and it doesnt matter who i am talking to.

If you can look a man in the eye and lie to his face out of your own self interest, then that is your business, and if you need to tell yourself that "it doesnt count" because his politics make him "unclean" so you can sleep at night, that is also your problem. Just dont pretend that you are in any way morally superior to him, because at least he is honest in what he asks of you.
 
Well, whenever anyone implies that another is less than just without having the whole story, that kind of grates on MY sensibilities.

But both points are well-taken:
1. I wouldn't rescind my word (written or verbal) on a promise without good reason and notice (including taking a job which requires such an agreement over carrying a weapon);
and
2. I wouldn't arbitrarily follow a new "rule" that I had never agreed to.

Simple as that.
 
No I don't because here in Georgia because of where I work it is a felony to carry. It isn't worth it it to me.
 
I think there was a "No Guns on Premises" sign at Rubies Cafe too. It worked well with almost everyone.
 
So, you think it's OK for a man not to keep his word, so long as the person he is making his oath too isnt a good person?

The fact that MY word is unshakable has nothing to do with the people I give it to, it has to do with me. I am not a liar, and it doesnt matter who i am talking to.

If you can look a man in the eye and lie to his face out of your own self interest, then that is your business, and if you need to tell yourself that "it doesnt count" because his politics make him "unclean" so you can sleep at night, that is also your problem. Just dont pretend that you are in any way morally superior to him, because at least he is honest in what he asks of you.

I'm guessing that you'd also frown upon any cop or Guardsman in post-Katrina N.O. that chose not to obey the order to round up all civvie firearms, and went so far as to lie to his superiors about it....? :confused:

When I look at the world, I don't see only black and white - there's quite a bit of gray in there as well.
 
I'm guessing that you'd also frown upon any cop or Guardsman in post-Katrina N.O. that chose not to obey the order to round up all civvie firearms, and went so far as to lie to his superiors about it....?

When I look at the world, I don't see only black and white - there's quite a bit of gray in there as well.

There certainly is plenty of gray, and one has to weight the moral weight of their decisions. It is one thing to decline an unjust order when it comes in, that is actually the duty of sworn military and law enforcement personel. It is a different thing entirely to swear to do something with the full intention of violating that oath the moment you get the chance, ESPECIALLY when the violation of that oath is out of self interest, which is what we are talking about here. A person promises to follow a companies policies in order to collect a paycheck, they then violate that promise because they dont like it, where is the altruism in that?
 
Well, I never said that the "packer against policy" was as pure as the driven snow either....

It's just that in the grand sceme o' things, he's doing LESS harm than the policy-maker. Unless of course, the policy maker actually makes a "no employee weapons" policy while sparing no expense on SECURITY. IE, metal detectos and armed guards, the works - to make sure the BAD GUYS abide by the weapons policy too! ;)

As long as the carrier is even-headed and responsible and otherwise "honorable," the worst he can do to the company is give a corporate bilssninny indigestion in the event he has to use his CCW to defend his life or that of his co-workers.

On the other hand, if everyone obeys said blissninny's policy and one day a BG having a lousy day comes in and shoots the place up....?

*******************

OK, to prove I don't have a "personal" axe to grind here, I do NOT CCW at work myself! I DO leave it locked in the car as it's not expressly forbidden for employees to do so.

I make this choice looking at many factors, not the LEAST of which is that we do NOT have a "ROB ME" (aka, no-gun) sign for customers to obey. So while I would not be breaking the law if I DID carry, the fact that customers CAN carry makes me feel safer than the alternative.

At NO point when coming to this decision did I EVER come to the comclusion that this makes me "morally superior" to fellow CCWers that may not do as I do.

Honestly, what REALLY got under my skin, c_yeager, was your insinuating that anyone not as "righteous and honorable" as you is unworthy of being trusted with a CCW gun. It's NOT your "truth above all else" code of honor, which I have to admit I find admirable (to a point.... ;) )

Sure, I know full well that soldiers have a duty to uphold the Constitution. But I assumed they also had a duty to obey the orders of a superior? Otherwise, if the former overrules the latter, why aren't we hearing about a LOT of court-martials after Katrina? :confused:

IMO, I think comparing signing a bunch of conduct papers on a regular basis at work is a bit different than "swearing an oath."

Signing those papers keeps the company happy because even though everyone is an "at-will" employee, they need to have something on file to justify firing someone if they need to. You'd understand better if you worked there. Just a few weeks ago, we all had to sign papers stating that we would follow money order procedures 100% to avoid helping terrorists launder their money! :scrutiny: :what:

I have no choice but to keep that "pact" with the company. Helping terrorists with their finances could lead to innocent lives being lost, which I could not live with. But more to the point, we don't even SELL money orders in there in the FIRST place!

An "oath" on the other hand, would be like something of a little more significance...like an oath to uphold the Constitution. Or a man making an oath to his family that he will always be there for them....
 
During the first Gulf War, I was the facility security officer (in charge of classified operations) of a classified NASA contractor.

Since I worked both in security and IT, I had two bosses. My boss for security was an incompetent racist/anti-Semite/misogynist who eventually had all of his classified work taken away because he kept discussing classified in open meetings. In response to the latest in a series of bomb threats (which he didn't tell me about) he ordered all employees [without explanation] to congregate in the lobby... where they would make an excellent target for a mass shooting.

Thereafter, until the end of the war, I started bringing a briefcase to work. Inside were a ballistic vest, my Series 70 Colt and extra magazines. I told my non-idiot boss what was going on, what could have happened if the threat had been a ruse, and that if anything happened, he should head for my office. My office was behind a vault door in the basement. Anybody who wanted to shoot their way in, would have had to use a 20mm cannon to do so.
 
Would/do you take the risk of loosing your job over protection 24/7 ?
Nope.

I once took a new job, and AFTER I had begun work they gave me the personnel manual with the prohibition on firearms on company premises. They wanted me to work closing shift, be the last guy out, in a strip mall adjacent to a high crime section of the city, and they wouldn't even allow me to bring a gun to the place and leave it in my locker during the shift.

I started work Monday, handed in my resignation Wednesday, and worked my last day Friday.

Yes, the manager of that particular outlet would have looked the other way, or I could have carried and not said anything and nobody would have been the wiser. However, as someone posted previously, whether or not I honor my promises is a statement about ME, not about the idiot who wants to extract the unreasonable promise. I don't consider that in any way being "on a high horse." It's just the way I was raised. If I sign an agreement that says I won't bring in a gun -- I won't bring in a gun. Since that's an unreasonable demend, to which I could not agree ... I had no honorable option other than to resign ... without signing my copy of the personnel manual.
 
Not so long ago, I worked for a large company in Miami. They had a very strict 'no guns on premises' policy.
Now I had to drive through Liberty City and Overtown to get to the office, and those are pretty bad parts of town. I always carried a handgun between the driver's seat and the rocker panel. Most of the time, there was an AR in the back seat floor, covered with a blanket.
Often I walked during lunch. The route was along Biscayne Blvd, from about 25th, up to maybe 54th and back on 2nd.
One day, I was accosted by two young hoodlums that did not like me being in their 'hood'. There were words, and with luck, I convinced them that it was in everyone's best interest if we just parted friends. After that, I always carried a J frame in my pocket. Picked it up in the parking garage when I left on my walk, put it back in the car when I returned.
 
I'd like to carry OTJ but in scrubs it's not as easy to conceal as with other clothes, not impossible but difficult. It also is not worth losing a nice easy job, close to home etc. However I can get to my vehicle in about 15 seconds
and I keep a Glock in it when I am on the clock.

In the past I frequently did carry while working, it was just too dangerous not too. I worked a mobile imaging van in LA for a number of years, often alone. In spite of the moronic California anti carry laws I usually had a 45 in my briefcase and a snubnose .38 under my lab coat.

On more than one occasion I had a some homey wearing either a red or a blue bandana (depending on where the unit was parked) inquire of me as to who I was and what the **** was I doing on his turf. I was always able to explain the need for my presence peaceably but it was nice being able to talk
while having a hand on the butt of some insurance.
 
However, as someone posted previously, whether or not I honor my promises is a statement about ME, not about the idiot who wants to extract the unreasonable promise. I don't consider that in any way being "on a high horse."

I agree, since you don't go on to say something condescending like "and only people who think like that are REAL men." ;)
 
Years ago my company came out with a "lawyer letter" that everyone had to sign. No illegal drugs, alcohol, guns, etc on company property. Company property being, company housing, vehicles, offices, parking lots, etc.

When my boss gave me this letter to sign I said I'm not signing it.
He said, "I know, I know. We have already been through this with the other hitch. Scratch out guns and sign it".

Many of us carried guns to and from work, including my boss, and we left them in the company housing.
A friend was a dispatcher and carried a Hungarian P-63 at the counter and in his office.

After 9-11 many of us has guns in our cars, at the office, and I wasn't going to wait for anyone's blessing to carry a pistol in my briefcase in flight.
 
wink, wink, nod, nod....

official policy reads....

ABC company wants to have a work environment that is free of illegal drugs, alcohol, firearms, explosives or other impoper material. We prohibit the possession, transfer, sale or use of these materials on company premises. :uhoh:

according the the personal manager....just keep it in your car. :)

so I keep it in my car :rolleyes:

Not quite sure what that tree stand out back is for?
 
I'm an MD in a medical office that's affiliated with a large hospital system. It's posted. I see patients in the hospital and at the office, and I wouldn't dare carry at work.
 
A friend and his wife work shift work on different schedules.

They both carry pistols in their cars, against the rules of having a gun on company property.

He was involved in a drive by shooting on the road coming home late one night.
He didn't shoot.
Especially after that he's going to have a gun in the car, even if it meant getting fired if caught.
 
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