Picked up a Kel-Tec RDB

[GBExpat]

It may help your resistance to consider that a tipping bolt is not great for accuracy anyway, ...

Well, the FALs that I have built have all been surprising accurate ... but certainly not "target" rifles.

...and a bigger RDB in .308 is all but inevitable in a couple of years.

Yeah. If 7.62 RDBs appear in the marketplace (especially if they are at or under $1000) I will not be able to resist.

O'course, it would be nice to have a light, handy, quickly-deployable 5.56 RDB for vehicle-travel and walkabout.

 

[GBExpat]

Thanks for the explanation.

Welcome!

Over the years since their appearance in the market, I recall reading posts over at KTOG (KelTec Owners' Group Forums) about periodic issues with the forward-ejection mechanism (among other things). That helped me to hold off buying one.

This downward-ejecting design appears to be a really SimpleStupid solution, which is almost always the best way to manage such things.

In addition, for us reloaders that rear ejection port will be very handy for case collection.

 

[GBExpat]

... I actually went there with the intention of ordering an FN PS90. Maybe next time. ...

I would love(!) to have a PS90 ... if it weren't for the extreme difficulty in reloading 5.7x28. I will not own a firearm, especially one that I will want to shoot a LOT, for which I cannot easily reload the ammunition.

 

[SKILCZ]

1) Price is around 900$
2) There's plenty on Gunbroker
3) If you only buy at gunstores, you're stuck with only the biggest brand names

I know. I may yet end up buying one but want more real world reviews first. Plus, I'm waiting to see when the RDB-S becomes available. I still think it would be good to be able to hold a gun before buying it.

 

[barnbwt]

I know. I may yet end up buying one but want more real world reviews first. Plus, I'm waiting to see when the RDB-S becomes available. I still think it would be good to be able to hold a gun before buying it.

Especially the Survival model; I understand the appeal of being slightly smaller, but there is no way that grip is comfortable. It's a ban state compromise design. I just want them to release its Grendel barrel, already.

That & barrel extensions, so the aftermarket can start feeling out barrel conversions for itself.

TCB

 

[Gtscotty]

Especially the Survival model; I understand the appeal of being slightly smaller, but there is no way that grip is comfortable. It's a ban state compromise design. I just want them to release its Grendel barrel, already.

That & barrel extensions, so the aftermarket can start feeling out barrel conversions for itself.

TCB

I agree, I know that a lot of folks are interested in the S model, but unless you're from a ban state, I'm not sure what the draw is?

It's Keltec supposed to be coming out with easy caliber conversions for the RDB?

 

[barnbwt]

This downward-ejecting design appears to be a really SimpleStupid solution, which is almost always the best way to manage such things.

I think KT caught the big boys napping with this one. Best execution of ambidexterity in any rifle and best bullpup trigger at the same time, on a gun with modularity potential that rivals the competition. It's nearest competitor is the MDR at over 2X the price, with a far more questionable ejection system, but superior accuracy & build quality. I suspect if you put a decent barrel on the KT similar results could be had for around half the price.

The gun even appears to be capable of being greatly shortened into a PDW like the MDR, at least that's why I assume there's a second unused gas block journal about 6" before the real one.

 

[barnbwt]

I agree, I know that a lot of folks are interested in the S model, but unless you're from a ban state, I'm not sure what the draw is?

It's Keltec supposed to be coming out with easy caliber conversions for the RDB?

"Easy" would be a bit expensive since it'd be an entire front end, not just a barrel. The barrel is bolted down with a lock nut like a Savage as best I can tell, with a clamp on gas block/rail support. Not as easy as for a floated AR barrel, but not difficult either.

A short 7" barrel suppressed version in Blackout or even Beowulf would be an interesting PDW concept seemingly ideal for vehicles

 

[SKILCZ]

Especially the Survival model; I understand the appeal of being slightly smaller, but there is no way that grip is comfortable. It's a ban state compromise design. I just want them to release its Grendel barrel, already.

That & barrel extensions, so the aftermarket can start feeling out barrel conversions for itself.

TCB

That was my first impression about the "S" model, too, and I have no doubt it was made for ban states. It looks like it might be uncomfortable, but I saw some rave reviews of it. It's also a little shorter and is listed on the site as having a lighter trigger pull.

I think KT caught the big boys napping with this one. Best execution of ambidexterity in any rifle and best bullpup trigger at the same time, on a gun with modularity potential that rivals the competition. It's nearest competitor is the MDR at over 2X the price, with a far more questionable ejection system, but superior accuracy & build quality. I suspect if you put a decent barrel on the KT similar results could be had for around half the price.

The gun even appears to be capable of being greatly shortened into a PDW like the MDR, at least that's why I assume there's a second unused gas block journal about 6" before the real one.

I'm surprised more people haven't come out with downward ejection since the Browning SA-22 has been using it for a long time.

 

[wally]

What about the RFB? I'm not an expert but it seems like a slightly enlarged RDB and in 308 like you mention.

the elevator on the RFB is somewhat fragile, mine has been back to Kel-Tec three times and they sent me replacement parts once, still its longest round count between failures has been like 175 rounds. Love the concept and the caliber, the implementation has issues.

My RDB has been flawless so far, although I've not shot it all that much and being in 5.56 the stresses on everything are lower.

 

[zaitcev]

I'm surprised more people haven't come out with downward ejection since the Browning SA-22 has been using it for a long time.

What stopped them is not that it's downward, but that it's on the magazine side, and so the action travel is significantly longer than is commonly expected. George Kellgren (or one of his minions) realized that it's pretty common to have excessively long receivers, just for the sake of reliability. AK is one such design, for example. So, adding more travel was not prohibitive, especially in a bullpup.

 

[Dave Markowitz]

Yesterday I was off and was able to get to the range with the Kel-Tec RDB.

The IOR Valdada 3x25mm scope on the Kel-Tec needed to be zeroed, along with shooting the rifle for the first time. Due to limited time, I was only able to get the scope zeroed at 50 yards, and put only 60 rounds through the rifle. The ammo I shot was 20 rounds of Federal American Eagle .223 55 grain FMJBT and 40 rounds of Prvi Partizan 5.56mm M-193 Ball (55 grain FMJBT, but loaded hotter than .223-spec rounds). I fed the rifle from the Magpul Gen 3 20-round P-Mag that was included with it, and a Gen 1 20 round P-Mag.

The Kel-Tec's manual states that it comes from the factory with the gas system setup to function with M-193 spec ammo. I tested this by initially loading one round, to see if it would lock the bolt back after firing. It did so, and thereafter while I was sighting in, I loaded 3 rounds per magazine.

Sixty rounds isn't anything more than a basic function check but the rifle did work perfectly. The RDB has a 1:7 twist and doesn't seem to care for 55 grain ammo, however. Groups were about 2" to 3" at 50 yards, reminiscent of an AK. I plan to try it with 69 to 75 grain bullets to see if it shoots them more accurately.

The recoil impulse of the long-stroke gas system reminded me of an AK. Unlike an AR-15 or AK, I got absolutely no gun-schmutz in my face, since the top of the action is sealed.

Ejected cases fell at my feet.

Again, 60 rounds isn't much of a test but I was curious to how much fouling got into the gun. When I field stripped it, what fouling that existed was concentrated at the face of the piston and the gas head. (Part 156 in the diagram in the manual, <https://www.keltecweapons.com/media/catalog/category/rifles/rdb/rdb17_series_manual.pdf>)

I still need to get it back to the range for final zeroing at 100 yards, but my first shooting impressions are encouraging.

 

[CapnMac]

Ian and Karl had a pretty glowing review over at InRangeTV; only frown-y spot being the mud test.
I've been eyeballing RDB for better than a year now. Prices are coming down, if ever so slowly.
Prices today 26Aug17 at the Fort Worth Gun Show were from $1100 to $1400, with a very notable exception at $995 (was sore tempted on that one, but the dealer was being a hard case on everyone trying to dicker with him).