Pistol Caliber Carbines? (.357 and 9mm)

Status
Not open for further replies.
P

perpster

Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
Messages
624
I have S&W revolvers and Glock semi-auto handguns in .38/.357 and 9mm calibers, respectively [I don't touch S&W semi-autos and Glock doesn't make revolvers].

I'm thinking of getting a Marlin 1894C (Winchester Model 94 Trails End??) to complement my S&W .38's and .357, and a Kel-Tec Sub 2000 and/or other 9mm carbine to complement the Glock 9mm's.

Would be used for SHTF, suburban family/home defense, target and plinking.

Any thoughts on the pistol caliber carbine concept in general and these carbines in particular? One of my goals is to limit the different number of calibers of ammo to stock and to have ammo interoperability (to KISS). Thanks.

Perp
 
Get a HI-Point 9mm carbine. I used to have one. They're very accurate and one could be had for $150 +/-.
 
Last edited:
I originally bought my M92 Rossi in .357 magnum because most of my reloading was for the caliber (and .38) at the time. I sorta fell in love with the versatility of the little rifle for outdoor use, though. A 20" barrel really woke up the .357 loads. Out of a rifle, it's a whole nuther caliber, capable of killing deer efficiently to 100 yards. With light .38 loads, it is effectively a reloadable .22 lever gun for small game. However, I've not found it to be quite as accurate as a good .22 for squirrel hunting, so haven't used it in that roll. It shoots about 1.5" groups at 25 yards, near 3" at 50, which I consider not quite good enough for squirrel hunting.

In the urban defense roll, it would pack a lot more punch than the revolver and be a lot easier to shoot accurately, especially at extended ranges. However, I've found that you don't really wanna leave that tube magazine loaded for extended periods. The spring pressure tends to deform the nose of the bullet after while. I would suspect this would be the case with the Marlin, too, similar magazine. Mine holds 10 rounds and you really don't need to load that many, though. With five rounds in the tube, there's a lot less spring pressure on the rounds.

I don't use mine in the self defense roll at all, but it'd be a good gun for that. The only advantage a 9mm or .45ACP carbine have is ease of shooting, because of the faster burning powders they use are burned pretty efficiently in shorter barrels. You don't get the big velocity increases with these rounds like you do with magnum revolver rounds. I really don't have a use for such a gun, but self defense is one legit use for them. They lack the penetration of rifle rounds in an urban environment, which is a good thing. Many, like the Marlin, are magazine fed, sure the KT is too, though I've never looked at it that close.

Anyway, if it's ballistic improvement you're looking for, the magnum rounds benefit most. The auto rounds are just a bit easier to shoot accurately out of a carbine, won't improve much in range or energy.

Check out the IMI Timberwolf pump .357 magnum carbine. That one looks really, really cool to me and would be faster to shoot than a lever gun. The lever gun has the traditional looks, of course.
 
i have a Sub 2000 and i dig it! its quite fun to shoot, ammo is cheap and its more accurate than one might expect. the trigger is pretty bad but its no match rifle to begin with. you can get a short picatinny rail to mount under the forearm for a flashlight or other gizmo, and you can pick up glock 33 round mags for about $22 each nowadays. i like lever guns too, but for a potential defensive rifle, i'll take capacity and semi-auto speed anyday. and heck for $299-ish, you can't go too wrong.

Bobby
 
Lever Action.

I like the compact, easy to tote, non-dependent on magazines to run package.

.22 long rifle .357, .44 mag, and not pistol caliber 45-70. Proven and continue to work today as they will tomorrow.

Born and raised Southern Gentleman myself, too many folks just use these.

I have piddled some with Marlin camp carbines in 9mm and 45ACP, just not as dependable, and parts today are hard to get, as is a gunsmith who knows what he is doing.

Find a good used lever action, tweak the fit, tweak the sights [NO scopes for me] and use it. Pass it down to your grandkids.

There is that political correct bit as well...it is as American as Mom, Chevy and Apple Pie.
Make mine a fried apple pie if you please.

*grin* I know some Southern Belle's Toting Lever Actions, cutest little grins, and beautiful as all get out. Don't mess with a Southern Belle and her lever action. She can shoot a gnats butt at 50 yrds. "You want me hit the right cheek or left one darling ?".

Darling damn Southern Belle's have that way of saying that too!

:D
 
SM: I want to buy US whenever I can. That's why my shotgun will be a Mossberg, not the Benelli the gunshop tried to sell me on. Owning a levergun will fit right in with my love of America and my CMP M1 Garand.

Bobarino: Good points. I think I'll have to buy BOTH a Sub 2000 AND a Marlin 1894C. Heck, they're both American, right!?

McG: I've seen posts about the Timberwolf but apparently it is no longer made? It's not US-made, but it seems to be the only pump .357 out there (and Israel is a democratic ally). Good point about the longer tube only boosting the magnum load, but I'd like to be able to reach out and touch accurately a little further than I can with a 4" barrel on my 9mm Glock.

Great replies; keep the thread going.
 
i have both a sub 2000, and a hi point 9mm carbine. they are great all around fun guns. wouldn't hesitate/feel undergunned using either in a defensive role. my wife's got an 1894 marlin in .357. that gun has amazed me how accurate and reliable it is. gonna put a scope on it soon and it'll be even better. my suggestion is, buy all 3.:)
 
The Marlin SHOULD (not sure) be drilled and tapped for a receiver aperture sight. I LOVE apertures, adapted one to my Rossi. For self defense, use irons or at most a red dot style sight, nothing with magnification. If you go with a receiver, ghost ring it. You'll be quick and accurate with a ghost ring aperture. My little carbine will group 4" at 100 yards with my own gas checked, cast 158 grainers. Pretty amazing little carbine and the Marlins are stronger, too. That 92 action is an open top style. Lever guns are just CLASSIC and purposeful with a receiver sight.
 
Leverguns? I Love Leverguns!

Hi Y'all,
Yeah, I do. I love Leverguns. I have a few, in .22, 357Mag., .45Colt,
and 30/30.
Nothing like them.

The Pistol caliber carbines match my Rugers, in the same.
You can't beat a GP 100, .357m\Mag. with a Trapper Special
to match.
Or, likewise, hard to beat, is a .45Colt Vaquero with a Trails End,
to match.
Or, shoot, a .22 Single-six, with a little Henry levergun to match.

Good for Fun or Home defense. Great for the Homesteader, out in
the woods.

Yiup, I like my 1911's too. I just can't find a levergun to match 'em
Have fun.
Old John
 
If you want to go with a .357 Magnum such as the Marlin 1894C and be able to share ammo between that and a revolver, then 158 gr bullets will probably be a good choice. Select hollow or soft points depending on your application -- I use soft points. There are revolvers that shoot the 158 gr bullet very well and some that don't, so you might need to do some experimenting to find the combination that works best for you. My S&W 586 and Ruger GP-100 both shoot 158 gr bullets nicely.

I have the XS Sights ghost ring setup on my 1894C and it works very well. Easy to install, too.

I have found that the .357 Mag carbine is a good choice for plinking and varmint control around my property (rural area) since it doesn't have the range and power of a rifle round. Obviously, care must still be taken to be sure what is beyond your target.

The 1894C would make a good defensive weapon should circumstances warrant. It actually can serve a good many purposes. My .30-30 is my favorite lever gun, but I'm glad to have the 1894C around -- it's just so handy and easy to shoot.
 
While I appreciate pistol calibers in lever actions - make mine a OLD Model 94 in 30-30 for general purpose.

Now if my next sentence don't convince ya, nothing will.

Darn sexy to watch a tall Texan Gal, hot sun beating down, little beads of sweat, tight jeans, tanned, with a green cotton shirt, ponytail tied back with a length of rawhide, Ray-Ban Aviators, straw cowboy hat, bone stock Gov't Model of 1911 on her hip - hike a boot on the back bumper of a pick-em truck , or lean across the hood and take out feral cats with a Model 94 in thutty-thutty.

I was riding shotgun and spotting shots.
 
Personal opinion

I personally don't have any use for them. If it's a pistol calber, you can have it in a convenient pistol sized package. If the weapon is larger, go with a rifle caliber and make the best use of a larger weapon. Again, just my opinion.
 
1911 Guy, I agree it's best to use the right tool for the right job. But, there are times where your rifle might not be available but a small carbine is, and if you have your handgun with you and they share the same ammo/mags, you've got an intermediate range weapon.

I don't think pistol caliber carbines are the greatest thing since sliced bread, but I can see where they fill a niche for a handgun owner.

Also, there may be times when you have a rifle but overpenetration is a concern. Pistol size carbines would minimize that problem.
 
Also, .357 and .44 are a lot more powerful from a rifle. .357 can be brought up to 30-30 levels. 9mm does not gain much from a longer barrel.

A short .357 lever gun is pretty versatile - it has enough rounds, power, and speed, and is compact enough to be reasonable at home defense, plus it can easily be used for hunting out to 100 yards.

Add the PC factor, and is a reasonable solution to some problems. Granted, there are specialty weapons that fill all these roles better, but if you only have one rifle, it is not bad.
 
30-30 VS. 357

I'm not sure I'd agree with that. I know there is a velocity gain in the longer barrel, but a 30-30 doles out more than a .44 mag. Rifles is rifles, handguns is handguns. Magazine interchangeability narrows the field even more.
 
roscoe said:
Also, .357 and .44 are a lot more powerful from a rifle. .357 can be brought up to 30-30 levels. 9mm does not gain much from a longer barrel.

A short .357 lever gun is pretty versatile - it has enough rounds, power, and speed, and is compact enough to be reasonable at home defense, plus it can easily be used for hunting out to 100 yards.

Add the PC factor, and is a reasonable solution to some problems. Granted, there are specialty weapons that fill all these roles better, but if you only have one rifle, it is not bad.
Click to expand...

I confess, the PC factor is a reason behind my Marlin 1894PG. Face it, my AR-15 is great and with a few uppers can be very versatile, but it is persona non grata in some places (as is my Glock 17). People just don't seem to be so frightened when they see a "cowboy gun."

Plus, the .44 Magnum makes a handy 100-150 yard game cartridge out of a carbine, I'll shoot it in some areas where I'd rather have a shotgun than a "real" rifle and it is lightweight. It is reliable and holds 10 +1 of .44 Magnum and is far easier to shoot past 25 yards than any handgun I've ever held.

Needless to say, I like the idea of pistol caliber carbines myself and all I have to say to those who tell me to get a rifle cartridge if I'm carrying a rifle is :neener: !! ;)
 
"I have S&W revolvers and Glock semi-auto handguns in .38/.357 and 9mm calibers, respectively [I don't touch S&W semi-autos and Glock doesn't make revolvers]."

What is wrong with S&W autos? Just curious because I used to think they were junk before I owned any. Now that I have tried some of them, I respect them. I have the 3913 and the 6906 and they are very good guns that are 100% reliable and pretty accurate. I used to think they were average or below average pistols but now I know they are above average.

I have only owned three makes of semi-suto pistol that have never jammed, S&W, Ruger and Beretta. I have owned just about every type, make and caliber out there but one of the above three would be my choice if I had to grab a gun and know it would work without breaking it in or tweaking it. Kahrs will break in nicely but out of the box, they may have some problems until break in is over.
 
I'm not sure I'd agree with that. I know there is a velocity gain in the longer barrel, but a 30-30 doles out more than a .44 mag.
Click to expand...

Check the Buffal Bore website:
.357 from an 18.5" barrel - 158gr. Speer Uni Core = 2153 fps


I don't know what the gain is for a .44, however.
 
Pistol Caliber Carbines!!!

I have a few of these in 357, and 44 mag. and they are handy little rifles. One or two more things about them that I like is, The hit probability is a lot higher with the rifle than with a handgun, and if you watch out for a good deal they are much less expensive to buy that a Handgun in the same calibers. :) And since I already have the handguns and reload for them why not get another firearm that uses the same ammo?
 
roscoe said:
Check the Buffal Bore website:
.357 from an 18.5" barrel - 158gr. Speer Uni Core = 2153 fps


I don't know what the gain is for a .44, however.
Click to expand...

I have to say that sounds rather optimistic. I get 1827 fps out of a 20 Inch barrel using a 158 Grain SWC gas checked in front of 14.5 grains of 2400, which is a pretty hot load, hot as I wanna go anyway. That load gives 1171 ft lbs at the muzzle. That's pretty respectable, though. Out of my Blackhawk that load is moving 1472 fps (6.5" barrel) for 760 ft lbs.

The load you're showing rivals .30-30 ballistics and there's just no way.
 
MCgunner said:
I have to say that sounds rather optimistic. I get 1827 fps out of a 20 Inch barrel using a 158 Grain SWC gas checked in front of 14.5 grains of 2400, which is a pretty hot load, hot as I wanna go anyway. That load gives 1171 ft lbs at the muzzle. That's pretty respectable, though. Out of my Blackhawk that load is moving 1472 fps (6.5" barrel) for 760 ft lbs.

The load you're showing rivals .30-30 ballistics and there's just no way.
Click to expand...

:rolleyes:

http://www.buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#357
 
For a catastophe weapon I would vote for the most PC carbine you can buy. Usually a Marlin, Rossi or Winchester 357 lever action. I hope that you all remember what happened in New Orleans after the flood. There is a video of police officers disarming and roughing up an old woman. These guys were VOLUNTEERS and at least one was from CA. It apparently is not hard to convince them to disarm legally armed people. They used the trust generated by the police uniforms to get close enough to attack her.
The lever action carbines are suitable for any member of the family. If you get something really PC, maybe they won't rough up your mom and take the gun
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

P
  • Locked
Pistol Caliber Carbines? (.357 and 9mm)
2
Replies
31
Views
2K
xtarheel
X
.455_Hunter
  • Locked
What would you pay for an almost NIB Marlin Camp Carbine in 9mm?
Replies
8
Views
590
.455_Hunter
.455_Hunter
S
  • Locked
Still want a rifle/handgun combo
Replies
16
Views
874
451 Detonics
4
cluttonfred
  • Locked
Would you buy a conventional 9mm carbine?
2
Replies
30
Views
2K
Packman
P
F
  • Locked
Pistol caliber carbines
2
Replies
30
Views
3K
nipprdog
nipprdog
Back
Top