Powderpuff loads

[B!ngoFuelUSN]

So I'm looking to purchase a S&W .460 (5"). For many cases at the range, I'd like to shoot it with very light loads.
I reload, but I've never been clear about how to compute low recoil or whatever term you'd like to apply (e.g. light load, cowboy action, powderpuff).
In the case of the .460, since it can shoot .45LC, I presume basing a light load off of that cartridge would be best. Is it as simple as checking the loading book or powder web site and selecting their minimum load for the solution?
Is it also best to use the lightest projectile as well for the lightest recoil (since F=MxA)?
Any input would be appreciated. I've googled some but I haven't found a clear model for such a solution.
Thx,
B

 

[blarby]

Im sure someone will chime in with a pet lighter load for the 460, but you are aware you can just use 45 colt in the 460 right ?

Many cowboy loads abound for the 45 colt, and it just seems a simpler solution for exactly what you want.


If you must use those super long cases I'd go with the lightest published load behind a 200 grain bullet.

 

[ljnowell]

Yes, using 45 colt brass there are plenty of sources for "cowboy" loads that would probably fit the bill quite well. Out of that gun they will redefine the term "powder puff load," lol.

 

[LUCKYDAWG13]

i would look for a 45 colt load using RedDot i use that in my 44 mag and 41 magnum
in 45 colt brass did not want you to think that I ment in your 460 brass

 

[Ccctennis]

Just use trailboss. Problem solved!

Your are welcome

 

[BigBore45]

Do not use load data for a 45 colt in your 460 case. IT could/would cause lots of problems from squibs to pressure spikes. Get some cowboy action loads in 45 colt, shoot them then reload them. Best solution i can think of.

 

[B!ngoFuelUSN]

Just use trailboss. Problem solved!

Your are welcome

Thanks.
And thanks everyone.
And yes, I was certainly aware that the .460 shoots .45 Colt. That is part of the allure. That is shoots three rounds of varying power. So starting with the .45 C and running it with a minimum load will be soft.
But I'm still curious about the general case. Are lowest recoil rounds loaded with heavy bullets with modest amounts of powder? Or light bullets with minimum powder?
And how do you compute a light (lightest) load off of load data?
Thx,
B

 

[Toprudder]

Just use trailboss. Problem solved!

Your are welcome

My thought exactly.

 

[Lost Sheep]

Trail Boss is good.

Large cases and slow powder do not go well together. Erratic pressure curves. Internal ballistics is an arcane science. Look up the terms "S.E.E." (Secondary Explosive Effect), "Detonation", "Ringing", "Flashover" and such. Some people claim these phenomena are hogwash and some believe they happen. Judge for yourself.

However, faster powders seem to be immune to the effect. But take care, for the position of a small amount of powder may give you trouble. If all the powder is next to the primer, not a problem, but if all the powder is piled up against the bullet and not near the primer flash hole, you might have trouble. Using a filler is usually the solution, keeping the powder near the back of the cartridge.

Trail Boss (a little more expensive per shot) is a really good, safe alternative.

I have a friend with a 500 S&W who runs TB for fun. 800-900 fps for a 300-350 grain bullet recoils like a 22 rimfire in that big, heavy gun. He lets curious bystanders shoot one of those, then move up to more potent rounds slowly. No one has ever wanted to move up to the 700 grain "Tyrannosaurus Thumper". This is good. Even HE doesn't want to shoot one of those out of a 4" barrel.

Good luck. Have fun. Be safe, Always, all ways.

Lost Sheep

 

[Lost Sheep]

Adjust charge weight for volume change?

While it is not standard practice among reloaders, the rule of thumb if you REALLY want to use the 460 case for 45 Colt power levels is that you will need an amount of powder roughly proportional to the increase in volume inside the case under the bullet.

Not EXACTLY proportional, but in the general direction.

I have done so with Unique and Bullseye powders in .357 cases to shoot 38 special velocities and 44 Magnum cases for 44 Special velocities.

But take care, use a chronograph if you have access to one and work down to the velocities you desire in small increments just as carefully as you would work up to higher (off the books) velocities. Look for non-linear relationships between velocity and charge weight (experimenting with powder position as you go) and beware of velocities below 700 fps or so (stuck bullets may result if you go too slow, and I do not know how slow is too slow).

Again, good luck.

Lost Sheep

 

[CLP]

You can step it down another notch and shoot 45 Schofield.

 

[TimSr]

Any of you your published standard 45LC loads with typical fast powders will not cause squibs in 460 cases. Use teh max listed, and don't bother with listed starting loads. You can up it by 10% if to make up for any lost velocity if it makes you feel better. You could potentially run into problems with Ruger Only loads that use slow burning, full case type magnum powders like 296 or something. Your Bullseye, Red Dot, Unique will be fine.

The higher the velocity, the lower it will shoot. For this reason I use very light bullets in 45LC loads for my 454 Casull, so they hit closer to where I am sighted in with my full power loads. I'm using 180gr for 45acp, and my Freedom Arms is happy with them, and at 50' they stay pretty close to where my normal 454 rounds hit.

Recoil will be nothing in that gun with standard LC loads, so I wouldn't even consider it a factor in bullet weight or charge.

 

[buck460XVR]

Speer has some good recipes for reduced load in the .460. I have also used TrailBoss with good success. The biggest problems with the powderpuff loads in the .460 is the huge difference in printing from when using legitimate .460 loads. The difference is sometimes measured in feet and not inches @ 70 yards. IOWs, don't expect to shoot your powderpuff loads and legitimate .460 loads the same day using the same scope/sight settings.

 

[TimSr]

The difference is sometimes measured in feet and not inches @ 70 yards.

I'll second that, and its no exaggeration.

 

[Rule3]

I have tried to find less potent loads (not true powder puffs) for the 460 and there really isn't a lot of them out there. As mentioned the best bet is just use 45 Colt brass, and/or Trailboss

You will get less felt recoil with lighter (within caliber) bullets and start loads listed for that bullet. Heavier bullets will give you more felt recoil.

Some of te 460 from SW came with 2 rear sights to adjust for different calibers,

The "lightest" load I found with 460 brass is Longshot and a 200 gr bullet

Hodgdon data online

As mentioned Speer 14 has a load with Power Pistol and a few others.

 

[BCRider]

While I know that the .460 can chamber and safely shoot the shorter cases I have often wondered at the effect of the unsupported bullet travel within the chamber before it enters the throat on the final accuracy. It just seems to me that it's setting the stage for damaged bullets. Or I may be worrying about a whole lot of nothing.

I shoot LOTS of .38Spl in my .357's. But that's got less of a gap than the length of the riding band on the bullet. But a .45Colt mouth is a whopping .515 shorter a case than a .460. So the bullet is going to be totally free flying for at least some distance within the chamber before it enters the cylinder throat and once again has at least some small measure of guidance and gas sealing.

So those of you with these guns, what's the accuracy like with .45 Colt rounds?

I think I'd rather go with the .460 brass and just load lighter charges of some suitable powder that either tolerates small charges in big volumes or just use a little filler. At least that way I know the bullet is going to be pointed the right way when it enters the forcing cone...

Something to watch with Trail Boss is a higher than expected pressure when loaded in large volume cases like the .460 and straight walled rifle loads. Looking at the loading data I've noticed that for small starting loads it's all just fine. But when loaded to maximum pressure the Trail Boss loads either produce lower velocities or the same velocities but with higher pressure than other options.

So while Trail Boss might be great for handgun and other smaller volume cases it's not always the best option for larger volume cases if a maximum load is desired.