Powders

[rodwha]

How does Black MZ compare to Triple 7 as far as power per volume, clean up, smoke volume, ease of ignition (#10/11 caps), and corrosiveness? Were BH209 easier to ignite I'd try it as well, but I'm not about to change my nipples out.

Is there anything else I should consider?

I'll be ordering a few pounds of powder soon, and will be trying out some Olde Eynsford as I've been curious about trying real BP as long as it was energetic.

This is for my .50 cal percussion Deerstalker and Old Army.

 

[Tinpan58]

Black mz weighs more than 777 or pyodex so you get less shots by volume. ignition is better than 777 or pyrodex. I use it exclusively in my howdah works great. power feel strong more like 777 then pyrodex but I don't have any proof other then how it feels. the granules are much larger than ff 777, I read somewhere it is closer to f in size. it is easy to clean up with just water. because of the weight thing I don't use it in my pistols, I use it in the howdah because it solve the ignition problems I was having with 777 and Pyrodex doesn't work at all in that gun. A lot of smoke like Pyrodex. also tried it in 45 colt cases works great in everything just weighs too much.

 

[Tinpan58]

Hear you go Rowha. I used a 25gr lee measure scoop and weighed them. a lb of powder is 454 grams by weight that is 7005.2 grains.

Black mz 18.0 gr = 389 25gr vol. rounds
777 ff 14.2 gr = 493 25 gr vol. rounds
pyrodex fff 14.4 gr = 486 25 gr vol. rounds

pic black mz far left, 777 ff center, pyro fff right

 

[Busyhands94]

I've never tried it in any of my guns, but a friend of mine says he uses it in his inline with good results. I prefer Pyrodex or Triple Seven and use both powders in everything from .22's (I like to load rimfires with BP for fun) up to 12 gauge in paper hulls. FFFG seems to work well for just about everything I load. So far I'm happy with it, I wouldn't want to pay more for powder.

 

[AbitNutz]

Is black MZ available anymore? I thought it was out of production since that nasty explosion.

 

[rodwha]

Thanks Tinpan! For my application it sounds like Triple 7 would be the better sub for me. Not only do you get more shots per lb, but it'll work well in pistols and smaller calibers as well. Still quite curious about Olde Eynsford and Swiss though.

 

[BowerR64]

I didnt think i needed to make a new thread so i just searched and added to this older one.


I finally gave this Black MZ stuff a good run shooting 24 rounds without cleaning in both a brass frame Remington and a brass frame Colt 1860 and then a few days later did the same thing with tripple 7 3F

I even let the black MZ sit in both guns for 2 days before cleaning and i didnt have any cylinder lockups, with T7 the next day i had to beat the pin out of Remington and really crank on the load lever of the colt before it pushed the barrel off.

The Black MZ is pretty big granuals maybe 2F or 1.5F but it doesnt seem reall finicky on how you pack it.

Ide have to say the black MZ has the best cleanup of all the subs ive tried now.

 

[Barbie]

Ide have to say the black MZ has the best cleanup of all the subs ive tried now.

Duh! I've always said to use APP. It measures and loads as BP.

Any American Pioneer Powder, Black MZ being one of them, is the only powder you should be using. Cleans so easy and no fouling.

Triple 7 and Pyrodex are worthless.

 

[BowerR64]

Duh! I've always said to use APP. It measures and loads as BP.

Any American Pioneer Powder, Black MZ being one of them, is the only powder you should be using. Cleans so easy and no fouling.

Triple 7 and Pyrodex are worthless.

I dont remember you saying that

 

[loose noose]

All I've used is the real BP, except just before I made my exodus from Peoples Republic Of California, then I used Pyrodex, and believe me it was a real mess to clean up, as compared to the real BP.

 

[rodwha]

From what I recall those powders are more on par with standard Goex performance. I Googled them but it didn't show anything for pistols, and what was shown for cartridges didn't give velocity numbers.

Since I intend to use these for hunting high performance is necessary, and something equivalent to a .45 Colt load (>400 ft/lbs) is my minimum requirement. The only powders that I'm aware of that can offer this is (3F) is Swiss, Olde Eynsford, and Triple 7.

Anyone have velocity numbers for APP or Black MZ? And not the sticks or pellets as those are generally much more expensive than loose powder.

 

[BowerR64]

I agree pyrodex has the worst cleanup and the fouling is like tar but its so accurate its hard not to use it specially the RS.

Some of my best groups are with pyrodex and swiss

 

[Trek]

Hi Rodwa,
Here is some chronographs results comparing Black MZ with Pyrodex, Graphs, Triple 7, Old Eynsford, and Swiss. According to this test, I do not believe that Black MZ will give you the results you were looking for. Only Swiss, Old Eynsford, and Triple 7 will give top velocities, although Black MZ did better than Graphs and Pyrodex, velocity wise.

http://1858remington.com/discuss/index.php/topic,6410.0.html

 

[rsrocket1]

Here's a video I made comparing it to BH209

Blackhorn209 vs BlackMZ smoke: http://youtu.be/wFpqtvEFrhE

 

[Crawdad1]

Here is some chronographs results comparing Black MZ with Pyrodex, Graphs, Triple 7, Old Eynsford, and Swiss. According to this test, I do not believe that Black MZ will give you the results you were looking for. Only Swiss, Old Eynsford, and Triple 7 will give top velocities, although Black MZ did better than Graphs and Pyrodex, velocity wise.

That's some good information there. A little surprised by the energy figures though. However unless we can compare it to some standard those muzzle energy figures mean little, to me at least. But the OP is right, consistency is the key to accuracy and accuracy is one important key to hunting.