Pres Bush takes responsibility for Iraq war intelligence...

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I keep reading allegations about Bush & Co. getting rich from the war - and most of the hooting and hollering involves Halliburton. And then there are the allegations about starting a war to make the oil companies richer - usually with Exxon as the posterchild.

Guess what? All of those so-called "war profits" are not dropping into the pockets of GWB and his buddies. In fact, if you have a pension plan, or a 401K account, YOU are probably pocketing those profits.

Here are a few facts to chew on:

Halliburton ownership:
89.60% of the company's stock is owned by investment companies and mutual funds.
00.73% of the company's stock is owned by Halliburton insiders.
0 (zero) non-institutional owners hold 5% or more of the stock.

ExxonMobil ownership:
52.20% of the company's stock is owned by investment companies and mutual funds.
00.84% of the company's stock is owned by Halliburton insiders.
0 (zero) non-institutional owners hold 5% or more of the stock.
 
Face it; there is NOTHING Bush and Co. can do that will not bring out every Ihatebushofobiak in opposition to whatever it is he does. Even if he stopped breathing they would claim it was just a stunt to funnel money into the pockets of his rich Funeral service friends.

There is an unfortunate madness that seems to effect the ability of some to reason beyond that which is not politically advantageous to their cause. They see a conspiracy behind every action of Bush, and believe that Bush actually was willing to order soldiers to their death just to help out his Oil buddies.

The thought that a person is willing to stand behind his convictions, and not waver is foreign to them. Therefore there must be an ulterior motive to his actions by their way of thinking. The Left does not stand for anything if it requires an honest commitment and sacrifice (unless the sacrofice is paid by someone else). Nothing is worth having if it takes more than 3 weeks to achieve. 2+ years is an unheard of concept to them, therefore there has to be something evil if it requires a consistent, steadfast, committed, long-term, sacrifice. All of these ideas are foreign to a Leftist.

The Ihatebushofobiak conspiracy theories will continue.

Regards,
 
Nematocyst-870 said:
Pres Bush + intelligence = oxymoron.
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I wouldn't call him a genius (I'm not either), but if he had beaten me (my political leanings) 2 times in a row I would think twice about saying he was devoid of intelligence. But then as I said, I tend to look at all the facts prior to forming an opinion. And if I had to ignore every fact that didn’t support my opinion to justify my position it would say much about my own intelligence and intellectual honesty. And if I wasn't 100% sure about the facts I used it would make me wreckless and transparrent in my Jaded position.

But then again I may be wrong!

Regards,
 
NorthernExtreme said:
I wouldn't call him a genius (I'm not either), but if he had beaten me (my political leanings) 2 times in a row I would think twice about saying he was devoid of intelligence.
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"He" didn't win the election.

His machine did.

Regards,

Nem
 
Nematocyst-870 said:
"He" didn't win the election.

His machine did.

Regards,

Nem
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His Machine? I'm not sure if you can discount the honest decision making process (voting) of millions of Americans as a Machine, nor would I say my decision (vote) was a thoughtless reaction of a Bush implanted thought. If that were the case I wouldn't disagree with him on Immigration, Out of control Government Spending (a Democratic problem too), Growth of Government (too big), most of his stances on 2nd Amendment issues (Pilots with guns, he was against), Much of the Patriot Act, Entitlement Spending, and many others.

Does he (Republications) have a big vote getting organization, YES? Did the Democrats have just such a “Machine, YES. Are you suggesting the American people were devoid of intelligence in voting for him? I would be careful if you plan on going that far. In reality the vote went to the man who projected ideas that most of America agreed with. I feel both candidates fell short of projecting fully Constitutional positions, but then I am but 1 voice in the crowd.

I (and Bush) agree things could have been better, but to say that because some things didn't go as planned justifies accusations of Lying and Steeling is a bit much (IMHO). If you spend you’re whole time looking for that which is wrong and not seeing (ignoring) that which is good; you are doomed to see nothing but wrong.

Regards,
 
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CAnnoneer said:
Great! Please explain how they would make more money that way?

The biggest, fattest, most defenseless pork-cashcow is the US treasury. The fat cats know that. That's why they have their arms shoulder-deep into it. First you bomb a nation's infrastructure into the stone age, then you give non-competitive gov contracts to your friends to rebuild it and to supply a large ground force for years. Tie the companies' profits by a flat percentage to spent material, and see the rampant wastage.

But, it's all good. If there weren't peasants to support their masters, there wouldn't be masters. I bet the porkers would just laugh their fat butts off reading the staunch defense mounted in their name. :rolleyes:
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Simple. They cut a deal with Hussein by which sanctions are lifted and the oil flows, for a percentage of the cut. Kind of like the deals he was working with UN, French, German, and Russian politicians. You see, as it stands, there is no oil flowing from Iraq and when it does, the world's eyes will be on where the money goes.

As for the non-competitive contracts, you do realize that Haliburton got the same kind of contracts under Clinton, and would have gotten them regardless of competition, for one simple reason: no one else can do what Haliburton does. It's got the manpower, organization, and resources to accomplish these tasks.

But let's not let facts get in the way of a good diatribe about the military-industrial complex. I mean, Gulf War I was nothing but an ad campaign for Boeing, Lockheed, and General Dynamics right? And Vietnam was a conspiracy by the music industry to develop angst in the American people and sell music they otherwise wouldn't buy?
 
Bidding on a government contract is a long and involved process that can take years. Will those who bellyache about "non-competitive" contracts shut up and sit down if the full blown bidding process for implemented. Year after year nothing would happen all the while MSM broadcasts pictures of a busted up country flood the TV screens?

Come on people. A little consistency is admirable. Accept non-competitive contracts or accept a multi-year bidding process. Pick one and go with it.
 
Facts, Facts, Facts, Facts,...

Can't you guys see there is no room for such rubbish in some peoples' mind! The Facts only confuse a perfectly good (Ihatebushofobia) conspiracy.
 
NorthernExtreme said:
Are you suggesting the American people were devoid of intelligence in voting for him? I would be careful if you plan on going that far. In reality the vote went to the man who projected ideas that most of America agreed with.
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Many people vote emotionally, rather than rationally. Also, many people care about one or two issues to the exclusion of everything else in the package deals, no matter how they affect them in the long run.

For example, everybody knows that the deciding issue in 2004 was, what a shocker, gay marriage, of all things. As a country, we had and have far more important and far-reaching problems than who exchanges rings with whom.

That's the reality. IMO there is serious shortsightedness involved. What names you give it and whether you extrapolate it to stupidity or attribute it to a fine-honed propaganda machine or simple misinformation/ignorance, is irrelevant to the final result. It remains to be seen how much damage the voter is willing to accept until there is a phase inversion.
 
Waitone said:
Bidding on a government contract is a long and involved process that can take years.
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Why does it have to take years? Maybe because of ridiculous bureaucracy? Overactive legislative body?

So, the system is so broken that the only way to get anything done fast is to move away from healthy competition and just serve the pork.
 
buzz_knox said:
Simple. They cut a deal with Hussein by which sanctions are lifted and the oil flows, for a percentage of the cut.
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And journalists wanting to make a name for themselves would not be all over that like flies on cowcake? A deal like that would if anything attract more attention, just as it did with the UN "oil for food", which incidentally turned out to be a big corrupt ring.

That is the genius of what these guys do. They take your money perfectly legally the way they do it now. And many of GWB's friends, including H, sell oil equipment, not oil.

no one else can do what Haliburton does. It's got the manpower, organization, and resources to accomplish these tasks.
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Great. So they are a monopoly. Anti-trust laws, anyone? Poor Bill Gates should have learnt a trick or two.

But let's not let facts get in the way of a good diatribe about the military-industrial complex.
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I am still waiting for some good facts.
 
GlenJ said:

Only thing I can add to this is how they went after the American worker with a labor bill that wanted to do away with employers having to pay over time.
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http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/fairpay/side-by-side_PF.htm


The above is a comparison of the old rules which dated to 1949 and exempetd everyone who made more than 250 a week from overtime, of course most employers facing the reality of the labor market had to pay overtime to folks makeing more, but some like Wa WA and 7-11 used the old rules to their advantage by not paying "Managers" who only made like $20,000 or less a year any overtime.
Before you bash Bush on the overtime rules at least have some idea of what you are talking about by actually reading the rules rather than counting on the LA times to tell you what they think the rules say.
 
For example, everybody knows that the deciding issue in 2004 was, what a shocker, gay marriage, of all things. As a country, we had and have far more important and far-reaching problems than who exchanges rings with whom.
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And which brilliant political party hitched its wagon to that issue before going over the cliff?
 
NorthernExtreme
Isn't it funny how some people are willing to look at ALL the facts (even those they don't like) before they accuse others of lying and steeling from them.
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Fact number one; taxing private income at source to give to others under socialist programs, domestic and foreign, is stealing. Unless your ideology happens to be one or another type of socialist that is; then it is perfectly acceptable of course.

Yes, they continue stealing from us.

Fact number two (one of many around this subject); George W. Bush, among others, publicly stated (verbatum or to the effect) that, "No one could ever of imagined that anyone would hijack aircraft to fly into buildings" after 9/11.

This despite the fact that agencies under George Bush were practicing drills for such an event at the time of the WTC and Pentagon events. There was even an episode on national TV in March 1999 entitled "The Lone Gunman", the plot of which centered specifically around hijacking an airliner to fly into the WTC.

Yes, they lie. The only alternative to this is to accept that George W Bush is incredibly stupid, an idea that I do not accept at all.
---------------------------------------------------------

http://ussliberty.org
http://ssunitedstates.org
 
mindpilot said:
quarter....hmmmmm lets see.....Texas Oil Man for Prez.....Oil for Blood....hmmmmm

my $.02
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Just stringing together a bunch of innuendoes is not an argument, unless you're Michael Moore.

I want to know exactly how Bush and/or Texas oil men have profited from the Iraq war. I want you to trace the line between oil in the ground in Iraq to money in Bush&Co's pockets.
 
Nematocyst-870 said:
Pres Bush + intelligence...
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Please...save us from the liberal left quackery! GWB is one of the smartest presidents we have had in a long time.
 
LAK said:
NorthernExtreme
Fact number one; taxing private income at source to give to others under socialist programs, domestic and foreign, is stealing. Unless your ideology happens to be one or another type of socialist that is; then it is perfectly acceptable of course.

Yes, they continue stealing from us.

Fact number two (one of many around this subject); George W. Bush, among others, publicly stated (verbatum or to the effect) that, "No one could ever of imagined that anyone would hijack aircraft to fly into buildings" after 9/11.

This despite the fact that agencies under George Bush were practicing drills for such an event at the time of the WTC and Pentagon events. There was even an episode on national TV in March 1999 entitled "The Lone Gunman", the plot of which centered specifically around hijacking an airliner to fly into the WTC.

Yes, they lie. The only alternative to this is to accept that George W Bush is incredibly stupid, an idea that I do not accept at all.
---------------------------------------------------------

http://ussliberty.org
http://ssunitedstates.org
Click to expand...


LAK

In reference to steeling; the current Tax code has been in place long before Bush took office. Please don't expect me to blame that one on Bush. (another example of the Left looking to blame Bush for everything) That Said, I'll grant you the the Tax code is far from fair, or legal in my opinion, but to accuse me of being defensive in supporting Bush even though he is steeling from me (in your opinion) is beyond the rational scope of things I can wrap my mind around. Taxes are wrong (as they are), but I won't blame Bush alone; Clinton, Bush 1, Reagan, Carter, Nixon, Johnson, Kennedy, ...along with every member of Congress for a long time have just as much to with it. Sorry,

By the way, I am as far from a Socialist as you seem to be, but I refuse to confuse a jaded opinion of someone (Bush in your case) for a bankrupt social policy just because they support that person on an issue.

As far as Lying; The Government practices for a wide range of potential disasters. Most training to prepare for such are done on a broad and multi scenario basis (most bang for the training buck). Just because Hollywood put out a show about a nut-case flying a plane into a building does not imply the Government should take it as proof of threat. If that were the case (according to your inference) I want to know why the Libs have not demanded defensive measures against Alien attack be established; because I saw War Of The Worlds, and I think the Aliens seem to be a far greater threat than the Terrorists by measure (according to Hollywood).

If you continue to look for ONLY that which supports your opinion, and ignore EVERY other fact just because it doesn't fit nicely into your jaded opinion, you will never be able to see the Forest for the Trees (the whole truth vs. one side of the argument).

Regards,
 
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