Problem making nitrate soaked papers

[xlrrp60]

I have been trying to make nitrate papers so that I can make paper cartridges for my IAB 1863 sharps replica...I soaked some tracing paper in a container with pot..nitrate (salt peter) in water for around 15 minutes. I them let the sheets of paper completely dry....I tried burning some of paper to test it....it burned...did not flash...burned like a ember until consumed...is this normal...maybe the black powder explosion...would consume the paper...note...the paper seemed to burn faster without the nitrate...any help or comment would be appreciated...

 

[scrat]

Cigarette paper. zig zags used them before they worked very good

 

[ofitg]

xlrrp60, what you report is pretty much the same thing I see when I nitrate sheets of printer paper. If I ignite a 2"x2" square in one corner, it takes about 40 seconds for the fire to sizzle across to the far corner. It does not flash.

Of course, the paper is only about 1/100 inch thick. In the chamber of a Sharps, it should be totally consumed within one or two tenths of a second.

 

[col.lemat]

zigzag

Thats what I use. I buy by the carton, not the pack,and get a break on the price. Makes about 400 rds. as I join two together to get a good wrap around the .52 cal. I went back after the big weekend shoot and the guy nearly had a heart attack when I ordered more. I think he was thinking I was smokeing them.

 

[TheRodDoc]

You used the wrong stuff for making your paper.

It should be - Nitrocellulose paper -

Made by mixing nitric acid and sulfuric acid, then soaking cellulose paper in it. Then rinsing and deactivating the acid with plenty of water and sodium bicarbonate.

Same as gun cotton but with paper instead of cotton.

 

[JohnM]

A dangerous process and slightly on the illegal side.

 

[rcmodel]

Try soaking 'onion skin' typing paper in salt peter.
It may burn better then typing paper.

But at any rate, salt peter is not going to make flash paper out of anything.

That would be nitrocellulose paper, as TheRodDoc mentioned.

But making it is dangerous, and drying it is dangerous, and storing it is dangerous.

rc

 

[dprice3844444]

in the confines of the chamber,as soon as it ignites,and the powder ignites,paper goes poof.is there any delay in ignition with the way you guys are doing it?remember the kiss principle and try not to overthink the safe process.

 

[jimrbto]

JohnM
please explain your response

Jim

 

[Loyalist Dave]

How about ordering flash paper from a magic supply store, or does it burn too slowly?

LD

 

[moonpie]

no experience myself but if i were to - i would check the burn rates of different types of paper and the treat the best candidates.

 

[shunka]

My Dear xlrrp60 -

You are actually on the right track. Your really do not not "flash paper" for your paper cartridges, and in fact it would be wise to avoid the use of gun cotton (if using rag bond) or nitrocellulose for use in paper cartridges.

The rate of burn does depend both upon the concentration of saltpeter in the paper and the type of paper itself. You can typically expect complete consumption in perhaps 5-10 seconds, altho 40 seconds as posted by oftig does seem a tad long in my experience with the paper cartridges I make for my 1863 Sharps...

you may find the following link both instructional and entertaining, especially with the posted videos :
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,37269.50.html

yhs
shunka

 

[Pops]

I second the " KISS" theory.....

ZIG- ZAG papers...

The burn rate on different papers should be a moot point..
4 seconds or 389 nanoseconds...immaterial...
Bottom line, When I open the chamber after a shot.. no paper residue !!

 

[Shadow 7D]

Google Nitro-Cellulose, used to be what film was printed on
Gun Cotton
basically it's Nitroglycerin with cellulose used instead of glycerin as the organic half.
More stable and less energetic.

All you are doing soaking paper in KNO3 is making a paper soaked with an stable oxidizer, IE. something that BURNS a little more energetically.

 

[ofitg]

The rate of burn does depend both upon the concentration of saltpeter in the paper and the type of paper itself. You can typically expect complete consumption in perhaps 5-10 seconds, altho 40 seconds as posted by oftig does seem a tad long in my experience with the paper cartridges I make for my 1863 Sharps...

Shunka, you're probably right, the paper I tested was a "slow burner"

I'm still using a stack of nitrated papers I prepared 20 years ago, and they weren't heavily nitrated in the first place.

No matter, they still work OK. When the gun is fired, the entire inner surface of the paper tube is ignited - the fire only has to travel 1/100 inch (the thickness of the paper) before it hits the chamber walls. It's all over in 1/10 of a second. By the time you drop the breechblock, the paper is gone.

 

[VA27]

Nitrated paper is ok, but not really necessary. I've made cartridges for my '63 Sharps out of curler papers, the thin cardboard that serves as the center of rolls of Christmas paper these days and brown paper sacks. It all burns up.

I've heard that coffee filters work well, but haven't tried them.

I do have some of Charlie Hahn's tubes ordered to try out.

What I'd test for (were I of a mind to test) would be which paper leaves the least amount of residue (ash) after it's burned. That would be worth knowing.

 

[VA27]

double tap

 

[scrat]

I use Zig Zags. soked in pure potasium nitrate. Same stuff made black powder of. Instead of water though i used 90% rubbing alcohol. soak the sheets in the mix then pull them out with tweezers they seem to dry up pretty quick with the alcohol.

 

[Snaggletooth]

I used curler papers I obtained at a beauty shop. Alot of trouble so I contacted Charlie Hahn and got some of his tubes. Sure saved time and stress. Ol Smokin Gun uses phone book paper if thats any help/ I like the Charlie Hahn solution