PS90

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Bobson

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Hey folks. I know at least one person here owns two PS90s, but I'm hoping others at least have some experience with it. I did a search and nothing came up.

Anyone have anything to share regarding the PS90? Accuracy, reliability, ease/difficulty of takedown, etc? I just checked and they're much more inexpensive than I thought they would be. I'm thinking this may be my significant preference over an AR-15 for HD/range fun, which is great because I didn't buy one yet.

Thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

BTW, what do people refer to the PS90 as? Is it a carbine, bullpup, or rifle?
 
I had one. Ended p selling it when I needed some money. It really didn't serve much of a purpose in my collection but it was fun. There are times I wish I still had it but I never shot it that much. SBred they are a great compact PDW but lack the power of a 5.56 round.
 
They're neat little guns. I had a chance to play around with one that had the proper length barrel (neutered magazines due to crappy Canadian laws though :rolleyes:). The let down is the cost and limited availability of ammo, and I wouldn't get one unless it was a candidate for turning into an SBR.
 
I own 11 of them still. 10 are unfired, one sleeps by my bed at night.

The 10 were leftovers from when I closed my shop. I accepted the order instead of taking a restock hit. I'm holding on to them to see what happens in O's second term.

I've shot 5,700 rounds now through the PS90 and FN Five Seven (that's the exact count of ammo I've gone through, but I have no idea how that splits between the rifle and pistol). The majority of those rounds have gone down the PS90 barrel.

Some of the facts...

I have never experienced a single failure to feed or fire.

Generation 1 PS90 optics are junk. (The white "donut of death" reticle). It's impossible to use in low light and if you're shooting at white paper targets you can't get any idea of where you are aiming.

Generation 2 PS90 optics kick all sorts of ass. They are labelled as "RE" versions. The reticle is a crosshair configuration, but in low light, the thing glows red. It's really sweet. :)

Then you have Tri-Rail configuration, which features a MIL-STD 1913 rail on top and two smaller ones on the sides. These have no integral sights, you must add an optics system of your choosing (EOtech, Aimpoint, etc).

One of the neat features is the downward ejection of brass. You can buy a clip-on baggie (FNH or aftermarket) that the gun is designed to accept. All of your brass falls in the baggie when you shoot. So you can unclip it and dump your empties - they never touch the ground.

They also feature a dust-cover in that ejection port, which you can snap shut to keep any grit or crud from getting in to your action. This is opened automatically when the action is worked manually or by firing a round, and remains open until closed again by hand. It creates a great seal to keep any dust, sand, or dirt out of the mechanism.

Obviously the 50 round capacity is a huge boon.

The ammunition, weapon, and magazines are fantastically lightweight, even with the stock 16" barrel.

It's accurate enough to hit 6" targets reliably at 200 yards with the non-magnifying reticle sights.

The SS197 ammunition (which is loaded with 40gr Hornaday V-Max) leaves the PS90 at something around 2200 FPS - and hits with a significant amount of disruption. The jackets are thin and the round pretty much disintegrates in to small fragments on impact.

They do not penetrate deeply - just under 10" (corrected) in most penetration testing with denim or bare gelatin. This should be considered a potential drawback as most sources consider 12" penetration or deeper to be required for effective defense. Or, it could be viewed as a positive if you live in an apartment, or have pets/family that you are concerned with.

Ammunition is also commercially available through other sources (check FiveSevenForums.com), with different characteristics than the FNH factory ammunition.

Ammunition used to cost less (all ammo did), and is currently hovering around $21 a box/50 rounds (0.42c each).

Reloading the 5.7x28mm is a bit complex, I haven't gone there yet, but plan to. If you plan on reloading do yourself favor and do a lot of homework!

In terms of practical real-world, non-anecdotal effects, the 5.7 has been shown to be a devastating cartridge. I won't cite a source here - most people here will know what grim incident I am referring to, and it's best if we don't discuss it. It's sufficient to say that I have no doubts whatsoever, on whether it can be used as an effective self-defense round.

Any other questions?
 
Oh, couple other things:

Disassembly takes all of about 2 seconds, and is push-button fast.

They do NOT get dirty. Like, at all. I clean my barrel once in awhile (every 500 rounds or so), and have only cleaned the action once. I put a dab of oil on some parts when it's dry, but other than that, it's a pretty much zero-maintenance weapon.
 
The let down is the cost and limited availability of ammo
That's something I'm curious about.

My local Cabela's sells 50-round boxes of SS197SR for $25 bucks (and they have lots of it). Buds is even cheaper.

On the other hand, WWB .40S&W ammo is $27 for 50 rounds, and WWB 9mmP is $22 for 50.

It doesn't seem overly expensive or hard to find. Pretty much right on par with common handgun calibers.
 
That's something I'm curious about.

My local Cabela's sells 50-round boxes of SS197SR for $25 bucks (and they have lots of it). Buds is even cheaper.

On the other hand, WWB .40S&W ammo is $27 for 50 rounds, and WWB 9mmP is $22 for 50.

It doesn't seem overly expensive or hard to find. Pretty much right on par with common handgun calibers.
Ah, that could be extremely confusing. I was basing ammo availability and cost on what we have up here in Canada, which naturally doesn't apply to you. Sorry, sometimes it slips my mind that I'm posting on an American forum. :eek:
 
I bought an AR57 upper after playing with a PS90. The bullpup design is very compact but I preferred the length of the AR. Great round for up close shooting. Low recoil makes keeping it on target a breeze and 50rounds makes engaging multiple targets just plain fun.
Ammo cost average about .40 cents a round and are really easy to find at most sporting goods stores.
 
My understanding was the 5.7x28 wasn't developed specifically for penetration - It was made as a short, compact, high capacity weapon, which could reach out effectively to ~200 meters.

The original ammunition was more powerful, but was scaled down to reduce recoil, weight, and make it more controllable.

Ballistic vest penetration is a function of projectile shape, density, and (in some cases) velocity.

Remember, an arrow fired from a 60 lb longbow will penetrate ballistic vests, but it wasn't specifically designed to do so.
 
The pistol ammunition was a big debate, BTW. Military AP ammunition frequently uses hard metals (tungsten, steel, etc) as cores to allow some light armor penetration. In the United States, hardened cores in handguns are a big "no no". Thus, the military ammunition, as created by FN, cannot be purchased by civilians.

There was no LEGAL restriction on some of the ammunition - the SS195 is loaded with the same projectile as the SS190 if I recall correctly; one is legal, one is not. This was done on a concession by FNH to overcome some of the "cop killer" stigma that the anti-gunners were throwing around with the introduction of the FiveSeven.

On the other hand, we get hollow point projectiles and a lot of other good stuff that the military won't use, which have proven to be highly effective in their own right.

Fire the projectile out of something fast enough, it'll go through ballistic vests. Remember, the 5.7x28mm cartridge is loaded with .224 bullets - the same projectiles shot by the AR15 and other 5.56 NATO and 223 Remington rifles. Bullets up to 55 grains can be used in the 5.7x28mm case.
 
Trent,

Good points and knowledge base. Damn anti-gunners making everything complicated.
 
They feed so much misinformation it's staggering. To compound the issue, we have a fair percentage of the PRO gun crowd spamming the IntarWebz with disinformation and hearsay, despite direct evidence that the cartridge has proven itself to be highly effective and quite lethal if used on humans.

Granted, most of the well known events were perpetrated by bad guys against good guys (night club shooting in Mexico, with ~50% of those shot were killed, plus our own military base shooting that I won't site because there's no need for THIS thread to end up on Google for the anti-gunners to start stalking.)

Remember one thing - the rounds which are "restricted" are NOT restricted by mandate, but rather, by FN Herstal's voluntary action. FNH is responsible for their "military" ammunition not being offered to civilian shooters.

There is no such restrictions on manufacturing your own ammunition, and several aftermarket companies offer full-power loadings.

(The ONLY thing you must abide by is using ammunition in a handgun which would violate state or federal law. For instance, in Illinois I couldn't load up steel core ammunition or 52gr tracer rounds and shoot it out of the pistol - wouldn't even want to have any such ammunition assembled in 5.7x28mm in the same building as a 5.7x28mm handgun. Laws vary by jurisdiction, however, and I only care to know my own.)
 
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I'm afraid this is going to be a dumb question, but I have no clue where else to find this info.

Do you happen to know how LE/military restrictions work? I mean, say Jim owns a PS90. Jim also happens to be a city LEO. Can he order the LE-restricted ammunition for his personal use in his PS90?
 
Department letterhead is enough.

Keep in mind, you'll occasionally see SS198 end up on the private market. That is restricted for sale *by FNH* to military or law enforcement only. There is no ATF regulation that says this ammunition cannot later be re-sold to private civilians - so once in awhile, you'll see some end up on the private market.

FNH has made a conscious choice not to sell this ammunition to civilians to stem some of the anti-gun movement to get the FiveSeven specifically banned. (They do sell a lot of the handguns in the US, after all..)

SS190 is a different animal. Because it has a steel core, it's illegal to possess as pistol ammunition in many states. Again, it's not specifically regulated on the federal level.

(And there is some interpretation on whether you need to have the ammunition AND pistol in order for it to be construed as pistol ammunition.)
 
Roger that. SS190 is what I was wondering about specifically. Not sure whether or not my state's laws address it; I'll need to check. Thanks for the answer though.
 
Mine has proven both reliable, durable and accurate (with factory ammo). I like the handling characteristics of the PS90. Field stripping it is very simply. I like mine but for HD I would reach for my Noveske first without hesitating.
 
My shooting buddy has one. Accurate, reliable and just plain fun. 2" groups at 100 yrds are pretty easy to do. It is more a fun gun to blast at dirt clods then to punch paper with though. I go back and forth if I should buy one for around the house. It handles well, is easy to carry, 50 rounds is a lot.....

My only gripe is I can't rifles and with the sights so high, my can't creates havoc with sighting it in.
 
You cant rifles - left eye dominant?

As far as effectiveness, hit the local meat market, pick up a pig head (they're cheaper than a full body), put it out at 100 yards, and see what a single 5.7x28mm does to it. It'll make a believer out of you. :)
 
No, I just cant rifles. Most of the time it is not an issue since I do it reasonably consistently. The problem is adjusting sights. I get them set for me and my shooting buddy takes a high right shot every time. Since I roll the gun over slightly this makes sense. It was the Ps90 sighting it in that proved it to us. My shooting buddy was having trouble getting it on paper because he could not see the dirt clod hit when he fired into the berm. I could so I walked it in and put it on paper. He takes over and high right for him, right on for me.

Neat gun, If it weren't so expensive I would get one in a heartbeat.
 
This thread was very helpful. Thanks for your input Trent. I've had one of these on my list, primarily for my wife since she can't hold up rifles very well. But of course I'd have some fun too. I'll be getting one down the road.
 
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