Raw footage: 2 vs 1 in mall (WARNING: Graphic violence)

[conw]

3) DO NOT GO to any place like it.

This seems to be overly general and not very helpful. Unless you happen to never shop in retail stores with linoleum floors, security cameras, and glass automatic doors. Am I missing something?

 

[ColdDeadHand]

Yes, you're missing something. Ther's a law of averages and some neighborhoods are best avoided. Gang violence does not tend to break out in areas not frequented by gang members. Emphasis on the TEND.

 

[conw]

That is a big inference on the "places like this" statement. I agree with your post right above this one but can't really say that from the video itself, I was made aware that that is a particularly high-crime area.

 

[Moto4Fun]

What I saw, that I don't think anyone pointed out (not that it matters a whole lot), but both assailants had guns to begin with. The guy in the dark clothes fired his as they spill in to the mall, and I don't think the white shirt guy's gun ever fired. When the white shirt guy's gun hits the floor, the dark clothes guy retrieves it and is trying to handle two guns, and stops his efforts to shoot the victim to assist his partner in wrestling for the victim's gun.

It seems like a lot of action outside dictated the events we see inside, but I agree with one person who suggested that he ignored the facts of the situation too long and should have already had the gun out. Unless he was ambushed right outside the door, and we are seeing all of the action, it seems that he should have drawn much sooner.

I appreciate the discussion. There is always something to learn.

 

[mortablunt]

That was pretty much an execution. The guy didn't stand a chance. On a grim note, the murderers need a lot of practice; that technique was absolutely sloppy. 2 guys gang up one 1 guy and it still took them almost a whole minute to kill him and they got to the first shot off. The victim definitely should have gotten his gun out faster. That is why is you concealed carry, draw ability is so important. An advantage of open carry is that drawing is easier. The pistols jammed because they used horrendous technique with an ungodly amount of limp wristing, and they nearly shot each other multiple times. The one who was attacked didn't really have a chance, but he still managed to actually hold really well and definitely could have made it had there not been another guy, and he had gone for his gun sooner and made some distance The video definitely destroys the whole "why don't you just learn martial arts" argument. It also shows that handguns are not a guaranteed effective quick way to kill someone, especially someone who really doesn't want to die and is full of adrenaline.

Video educational score: 10/10
Killer proficiency score: 4/10
Victim resilience score: 8/10

 

[charlie echo]

Thank you for posting the video.

If I was was faced with such an attack, I'd be readty to die fighting, but fight to take one with me or leave a bloody mark, for evidence. At contact range, better to get closer aside then to turn and expose your back, and do the utmost to get back on feet when knocked down.

I don't carry because I don't have a CCW Permit. If I were to conceal carry I would practice with a holster and pistol, loading a cartridge proven since trenches of WW I: 45 ACP. 380s or 9MM seems effective for killing or maiming when you have the advantage of the element of surprise, but i want the best chance of stopping armed felons that surprised me or have already mortally shot me.

Without guns, what kind of knife would you carry? I usually carry a Benchmade folder or a handier fixed knife for urban carry. Hopefully, that and the years of karate/Hapkido base with jiujitsu training will help. When the situation calls for it, I have brought my handgun, that I have shot 1000s of rounds: better to explain then to fail to defend my loved ones.

"karate" is for when you're out of bullets (or have not yet presented your bullets) ...there're many delusional wishful thinking karate schools out there, by the way.

 

[jrdolall]

The only thing I can see that should have happened is that the victim should have kept moving, assuming he was capable of moving with bullets in his gut. Once he became a stationary target he was a dead man unless he was a well trained pistolero. Bullets in stomach is not a good thing. Laying on your back with bullets in your stomach is not a good thing. Laying on your back with bullets in your stomach while two men with guns are charging you is not a good thing. He could not have anticipated a jammed gun for his opponent and apparently he did not anticipate his own gun snagging. Assuming that he had the physical ability to continue moving he should have tried his best to move to a position of cover before trying to defend himself. All of that is easy to say but I have never been shot.

 

[harrygunner]

I'm not saying the bystanders were wrong, but this also reminds us we will be alone as we fight for our life. Important part of mindset.

 

[rEVOLVEr VII]

I disagree. He clearly made some decision-making mistakes. Attempting to draw his gun instead of get up off the floor was one. Another was not attempting to control his opponent's gun.

So your referring to the victim as if he should be Superman? Just a quick question but has anyone here been shot? If so please share your experience with the rest of us. I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume being shot isnt a fun experience, I'm also going to assume that after being shot multiple times (were all unaware of how many times the man was shot in the vid) one will not have the strength or the proper mindset to effectively disable his attacker and his attackers weapon after already being knocked to the ground, riddled with bullets.

My point being this isn't Hollywood, sure we've all read reports of people surviving gun shots and defending against their attacker, but from what this video shows this man was finished before he had time to do anything about it, he couldn't even draw his firearm for that matter. I believe the only analysis we can gain from this video is to be prepared for the worst, and be properly trained, otherwise you'll look like this poor guy.

 

[f350fiver]

It seems the incident would have not made into the mall had shooter one had a good working weapon. The bystander did the right thing by getting out of the way when he saw the flash and obviously heard the shot. The question should be asked if you were carrying would you intervene?

 

[F350Lawman]

The question should be asked if you were carrying would you intervene?

Only if I thought I could safely shoot all three of them... No really..I'm only slightly kidding!

The "victim" here could probably just as easily return fire(if capable at some point) at you while you are playing good Samaritan. Either 1. because he thinks you are the law or 2. because he thinks you are another gang member and shoots instinctively at you. This isn't like helping out some elderly women or some shopkeeper where the sides are defined..this is like jumping into combat, who knows what happens. Too hard to separate the REAL bad guys from the AVERAGE bad guy, who knows this moron might have done a failed drive by on his attackers the night before. Get cover, get other people, let the thugs have at it and get a good description for working LEOs when they arrive.

 

[XxBulletBendeRXx]

Damn.. That was a eye opening video. Ive seen gang shootings on vid before but nothing like this.
I no longer will pocket carry a single primary pocket sized pistol anymore when doing a quik store run or whatever errand that will be short . My pocket carry will be a BUG and Only a BUG. I will from this moment on carry my primary pistol in a holster from now on. I can easliy see From this video how fumbling with a draw from pocket rig can take too long or simply not be fast enough. WOW what a video..!!