RCBS Progressive Press

[cfullgraf]

I've been using a few of the Dillon lock nuts as well, primarily on the powder measure drop die (I forget the "official" name it is called). With the Dillon wrench, which is also small, and the small size of the nuts, it fits well between dies.

As far as the powder measure included with each Pro Chucker 7 die plate, I'd think one would only need the powder drop die for each die plate.

With my Hornady L-N-L and RCBS Pro2000, I raise and lower the powder drop die for different cartridges but do not need to make any other adjustments to the linkage of the case activated system to achieve full stroke.

 

[RealGun]

Thanks Tilos for the link.....maybe I'll try Dillon nuts....they DO look smaller around. That would make 2 Dillon products I use. I bought some case polish locally a few years ago.

BTW, this picture has the answer to RCBS Pro Chucker 7 die plate problems.

Could you comment on what we're looking at here and why it is a solution?

 

[jmorris]

Looks like the part of an RCBS powder measure that threads into the tool head (oops die plate). If they sold one without a measure, that would be the only part (well the powder through expander inside too) to swap the measure from one tool head to another with no other adjustments except powder charge.

 

[GW Staar]

cfullgraf, jmorris: Exactly.

Hornady has been selling the parts shown (the one's on the left) as a Quick Change Powder Die, for Hornady P.M. users. In fact they made PTX's (pwdr-thru expanders) for their P.M. long before RCBS started.

Pro 2000 users on this forum have used Hornady PTX's and Quick Change kits since the came out......yes, Uniflow uppers work just fine with Hornady lowers. They really are that similar. These same people here complained to RCBS about needing PTX's and they finally listened, making.....their own PTX's, even improved over Hornady's....copying features of the Lyman "M" dies....making bullet feeders "stick" bullets straight stopping bullet lean on the way to the seater.

BTW, Mr. Bullet Feeder uses the same idea to improve Dillon PTX's for use with their bullet feeders.

RCBS has not up to this point made similar lower linkage quick change kits....oh, you can buy them alright, if you order P.M. parts separately.....big PIA, when you can just order a Hornady kit from Midway for $29.

Well, now that they have this 7 station die plate (tool head) that has too little room for their preferred way of doing things......they started selling the combo units to tie whole p.m.'s to the plates.........when all they needed is a "combo unit" that comes with the plate and a lower only. Much cheaper. Finally, they see what we users have known for years. "Quick Change" linkage lowers for each, allows instant caliber change.....leave the toolheads alone....just unscrew and unspring the P.M. from the lower, empty the P.M., insert another "toolhead" with it's own lower, reattach the P.M. and go.

Old Uniflows need the mic, so that quick presets can happen.....or on Quick Change Uniflows that come with only one cylinder and don't use the mics, you have to buy powder reservoir adj. screws for each load.....another (different) quickchange option. There....clear?.....I know ...as mud.

 

[RealGun]

Exactly.

Hornady has been selling the parts shown (the one's on the left) as a Quick Change Powder Die, for Hornady P.M. users. In fact they made PTX's (pwdr-thru expanders) for their P.M. long before RCBS started.

Pro 2000 users on this forum have used Hornady PTX's and Quick Change kits since the came out......yes, Uniflow uppers work just fine with Hornady lowers. They really are that similar. These same people here complained to RCBS about needing PTX's and they finally listened, making.....their own PTX's, even improved over Hornady's....copying features of the Lyman "M" dies....making bullet feeders "stick" bullets straight stopping bullet lean on the way to the seater.

BTW, Mr. Bullet Feeder uses the same idea to improve Dillon PTX's for use with their bullet feeders.

RCBS has not up to this point made similar lower linkage quick change kits....oh, you can buy them alright, if you order P.M. parts separately.....big PIA, when you can just order a Hornady kit from Midway for $29.

Well, now that they have this 7 station die plate (tool head) that has too little room for their preferred way of doing things......they started selling the combo units to tie whole p.m.'s to the plates.........when all they needed is a "combo unit" that comes with the plate and a lower only. Much cheaper. Finally, they see what we users have known for years. "Quick Change" linkage lowers for each, allows instant caliber change.....leave the toolheads alone....just unscrew and unspring the P.M. from the lower, empty the P.M., insert another "toolhead" with it's own lower, reattach the P.M. and go.

Old Uniflows need the mic, so that quick presets can happen.....or on Quick Change Uniflows that come with only one cylinder and don't use the mics, you have to buy powder reservoir adj. screws for each load.....another (different) quickchange option. There....clear?.....I know ...as mud.

Seems like the question remains whether the cramped die cluster on the 7 station head allows room for this lower assembly to fit along with all its neighboring dies, all of which I find a rather critical fit on a 5 station Hornady LnL AP, especially with the Bully Adapter bullet feeder.

 

[GW Staar]

The lower assembly is used whether or not it comes from a whole P.M. as supplied with RCBS's expensive combo or by itself......so yes it fits....and it's adjustable with the clamp screws that allow you to turn the P.M. (and therefor the lower assembly) so that it doesn't interfere with the bullet tubes on the next station.

 

[RealGun]

The lower assembly is used whether or not it comes from a whole P.M. as supplied with RCBS's expensive combo or by itself......so yes it fits....and it's adjustable with the clamp screws that allow you to turn the P.M. (and therefor the lower assembly) so that it doesn't interfere with the bullet tubes on the next station.

I see from the picture of the Pro 7 that RCBS has simply elevated the measure out of the way of the other dies. Clearly the measure is detachable, so there is no apparent reason to require an additional measure with a new tool head whatchamacallit. There does not appear to be a reason to include the lower assembly either, although that would be the part to leave in place to make swapping out setups convenient. The Hornady LnL AP does not have that long necked lower assembly to elevate the powder measure nearly as much, so there can be interference with neighboring dies and a need to be forced into a certain position for free movement of the powder measure rotor or even removal of other dies to allow turning the collar on the lower assy.

 

[higgite]

Exactly.

RCBS has not up to this point made similar lower linkage quick change kits....oh, you can buy them alright, if you order P.M. parts separately.....big PIA, when you can just order a Hornady kit from Midway for $29.

RCBS has finally started selling the case activated linkage kit pictured on the right as a complete assembly with linkage arms (which you don't need to move the PM from one base unit to another.) BUT, I say BUT, they want a premium price for it. MSRP $73. Midway has them for $62.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/802477/rcbs-uniflow-powder-measure-case-activated-linkage-kit

 

[Tilos]

RCBS has finally started selling the case activated linkage kit pictured on the right as a complete assembly with linkage arms (which you don't need to move the PM from one base unit to another.) BUT, I say BUT, they want a premium price for it. MSRP $73. Midway has them for $62.

I've read that RCBS pays Hornady to use/sell that powder measure drop design, as well as Dillon pays Lee to use their patented powder measure design, but what do I know...

 

[GW Staar]

higgite: that's another product......the whole case-activated linkage kit......top assembly & bottom assembly.

Hornady sells that too, for $66.00. All we need is the lower half of that and no linkage parts.

Realgun: Appearances can be deceiving. Below is a Pro 2000 like mine. The much smaller powder hopper makes it appear shorter, but only if you include hopper size. Bullet feeder dies are also very long...all of 'em, and they can get in the way if the lower isn't turned so that the metering arm is away.

I .... There does not appear to be a reason to include the lower assembly either, although that would be the part to leave in place to make swapping out setups convenient. The Hornady LnL AP does not have that long necked lower assembly to elevate the powder measure nearly as much, so there can be interference with neighboring dies and a need to be forced into a certain position for free movement of the powder measure rotor or even removal of other dies to allow turning the collar on the lower assy.

I highlighted the reason you want this....If we gotta have "combos" the "lower" is the combo part of choice.....and shouldn't add more than $30 to the price of the die plate.

The die plate will get a higher price than the 5 station one, but not that much. In fact, I think a "combo" like we're talking about is worthwhile for the P.C.5. as well. IOW's I'd buy a lower with each die plate anyway, if I owned one.

As for the Hornady lower........it's exactly the same height as the RCBS one....look at the first picture (post 54)......The lower (and where on the barrel the linkage is clamped on) provides the stand off ..... the size of the hopper provides the over all height......for that Hornady used to win until these monster hoppers came out with the Pro Chucker 7.

 

[higgite]

higgite: that's another product......the whole case-activated linkage kit......top assembly & bottom assembly.

Hornady sells that too, for $66.00. All we need is the lower half of that and no linkage parts.

That's what I thought I said. I guess I didn't say it clearly.

I have 2 RCBS bottom assemblies installed on 2 Pro 2000 die plates, one for 9mm and one for 45ACP. I swap a QC measure back and forth and swap out 2 preset small metering screws as needed. I have a large metering screw also, but haven't used it yet. It's a shame that RCBS hasn't seen fit to sell only the bottom assembly. If they don't wise up, the PC7 may go the same way as the Pro 2000 simply because their marketing sucks.

 

[cfullgraf]

I have both a Hornady L-N-L and an RCBS Pro2000. I prefer the Hornady powder drop system better than the RCBS version. Not much difference but it is easier to remove the powder measure from the Hornady drop die than the RCBS drop die.

Besides the Hornady L-N-L and RCBS Uniflow powder measures, I have a Redding 10-X modified to work with the Hornady case activated powder dies.

I have not seen the new RCBS PTX tubes as I have a set of custom made drop tubes that I use with the powder measures. I made the custom tubes with the idea that I would not have to adjust the powder die when changing cartridges and therefore would only need one powder die. It did not work as planned. But with the Hornady's bushing system, adjusting the powder measure for full stoke is easy when using Dillon lock rings.

Besides the Hornady and RCBS presses, I use the powder measure drop system on my Dillon BL550. It is a very versatile system.

 

[Paladin7]

Slightly of the subject: Lots of discussion/argument on LNL vs Dillon and occasionally Lee, RCBS is rarely mentioned. I know nothing about the RCBS progressive other than it isn't popular.

Moderator Action: This started in another thread
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...load-auto-progressive-reloading-press.817619/

I have an RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme (Great Single Stage Press) and converted it to the RCBS Piggyback 3 System a few years ago. I have loaded thousands of rounds using this system and it was nothing but problems. And yes, I'm an experienced Handloader. The APS Priming Strips were always hanging up and basically unworkable (hence the re-design no doubt), the stupid paperclip case retention system on the first stage was always a problem and so was the spring steel retention system on the other stages. The paperclip case ejector was an exercise in futility, no matter how tight I made it, it would always come loose and hang up cases, failing to eject. The die plate would routinely unscrew itself during loading, which was a major frustration. I also found that there was a lot of slop in the die plate assembly that made it very difficult to get accurate seating. The last thing to mention is the index ball bearing (yeah, you heard that right) and spring that sits under the shell plate (are you f'ing kidding me?). Every time you change shell plates you have to be really careful not to let the ball bearing, which sits over the spring, fall off and roll down into the shell plate screw hole. You also have to be careful when you tighten down the shell plate screw so you don't over compress the ball bearing and spring and tie up the shell plate. Idiotic design. Overall, it was a Rube Goldberg invention, way over complicated and I have since ditched it in favor of the Hornady Lock n Load AP, where I have none of these problems. The Hornady Press has been flawless, and is a very simple design.

Before purchasing the Hornady, I looked hard at the Pro-Chuckers, mainly due to the 7 station capability, but saw a lot of the same Rube Goldberg crap and over complications carried over from the Piggyback System. No, not for me. The ProChucker series appears to still retain the paperclip shell holder on the first stage, spring steel clip shell holders, ball bearing and spring shell plate indexing system, and still has a die plate that has some slop, although less than on the Piggyback. I did notice that RCBS has a different shell plate retaining nut design and that may or may not eliminate the problem with shell plates unscrewing themselves during loading... Compare all this to the simplicity of the Hornady system.

I don't think you can go wrong with the Hornady Press and the price, when on sale is awesome, especially with the free bullet deal they offer. I will not be sinking money into another RCBS Press anytime soon.

As for my Rock Chucker Supreme, it is still awesome and I have converted it over to use the Hornady Lock n Load Bushing System, which makes this press even better. Set your dies up once and you are good to go...

On a positive note, RCBS Tech Support is awesome, and they need to be awesome, because their product needs it.

 

[RealGun]

I have an RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme (Great Single Stage Press) and converted it to the RCBS Piggyback 3 System a few years ago. I have loaded thousands of rounds using this system and it was nothing but problems. And Yes, I'm an experienced Handloader. The APS Priming Strips were always hanging up and basically unworkable (hence the re-design no doubt), the stupid paperclip case retention system on the first stage was always a problem and so was the spring steel retention system on the other stages. The paperclip case ejector was an exercise in futility, no matter how tight I made it, it would always come loose and hang up cases, failing to eject. The die plate would routinely unscrew itself during loading, which was a major frustration. I also found that there was a lot of slop in the die plate assembly that made it very difficult to get accurate seating. Overall, it was a Rube Goldberg invention, way over complicated and I have since ditched it in favor of the Hornady Lock n Load AP, where I have none of these problems. The Hornady Press has been flawless, and is a very simple design.

Before purchasing the Hornady, I looked hard at the Pro-Chuckers and saw a lot of the same Rube Goldberg crap and over complications carried over from the Piggyback System. No, not for me. I don't think you can go wrong with the Hornady Press and the price, when on sale is awesome, especially with the free bullet deal they offer. I will not be sinking money into another RCBS Press anytime soon.

As for my Rock Chucker Supreme, it is still awesome and I have converted it over to use the Hornady Lock n Load Bushing System, which makes this press even better. Set your dies up once and you are good to go...

Seems to be a conflict between your first and last paragraph, sort of a love/hate paradox.

If we stay with our Hornady's et al., we will not enjoy the capabilities and conveniences of more than 5 stations.

 

[Paladin7]

Seems to be a conflict between your first and last paragraph, sort of a love/hate paradox.

If we stay with our Hornady's et al., we will not enjoy the capabilities and conveniences of more than 5 stations.

Yes it's definitely Love/Hate with RCBS for me. Love the Rock Chucker, Hate their Progressives.

If you can deal with their over complicated and problematic design that 7 Station feature is really great. I wish I had it on my Hornaday, but will settle for problem free simplicity...

 

[GW Staar]

I have both a Hornady L-N-L and an RCBS Pro2000. I prefer the Hornady powder drop system better than the RCBS version. Not much difference but it is easier to remove the powder measure from the Hornady drop die than the RCBS drop die.

Yes it is easier to remove the Hornady P.M. due to the slot cut in the bottom linkage hole. You only have to loosen the bolt rather than unscrew it. Been tempted to cut the bottom hole in RCBS linkages and turn them into slots. Probably take 5 minutes....just need to get a round tuit. The other annoyance is similarly fixed.......the stiff linkage spring. I noticed that midway sells the lighter Hornady spring for 3 bucks.....or one can find a similar one at Ace Hardware. Sometimes its the little things that annoy most.

I sure don't find my Pro 2000 overly complicated. Any press is I suppose, until you get to know it. APS and preloaded strips I love! The learning curve was only 1 day.....okay, so I forgot to attach the second strip to my first strip and I loaded 25 .45's with no primers! Bullets pulled, powder & bullets were retrieved and reused....not a big deal.

 

[higgite]

Yes it is easier to remove the Hornady P.M. due to the slot cut in the bottom linkage hole. You only have to loosen the bolt rather than unscrew it. Been tempted to cut the bottom hole in RCBS linkages and turn them into slots. Probably take 5 minutes....just need to get a round tuit. The other annoyance is similarly fixed.......the stiff linkage spring. I noticed that midway sells the lighter Hornady spring for 3 bucks.....or one can find a similar one at Ace Hardware. Sometimes its the little things that annoy most.

I had forgotten about the screw hole on the RCBS linkage. I cut a slot in the linkage on mine with a Dremel awhile back. Five minutes well spent. Here's your round tuit, now do it. You'll be glad you did.