Recommendations on a House Dog...

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FPrice

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A lot of THRer's have dogs for various reasons and possess a lot of knowledge about the care of "man's best friend". I am looking for a recommendation for a house dog (don't have a lot of room for an outdoor dog) that would be good to help for self-defense.

Specifically I am looking for the largest dog which is not susceptable to hip problems like many large breeds seem to be. Maybe something in the 50-75 pound range. When I retire in six months I'll have the time to take care of and train this dog (hopefully) properly.

I currently have a 100 lb German Shepard - Blue Tick Coon Hound who is a good burgler alarm but she is getting up in years and is showing signs of arthritus and stiff joints.

What recommendations do you have?

Thanks.
 
Dogs

Now we're talkin'! Gotta admit that I'm partial to Collies. They're
prone to hip dysplasia only if they're not well-nourished during the first year of life. Two words...Purina and Science diet Large Breed. Yiu can
buy a more expensive dog food than Purina, but it's hard to find a better one. Tge Science Diet is specifically blended to strengthen the hip joints and connective tissue. The mixture of the two keeps costs low and doesn't
promote overweight dogs the way that the SD alone will. Kibbles and
Chunks and Beneful are two good ones that dogs go for. Suppliment
it with a a little Alpo Select Cuts for good urinary tract health, and be
prepared to get outwitted regularly. Most Collies are smarter than many
people that I know.

Collies are extremely alert and watchful...part of the herdinginstinct. They
also won't hesitate to sound off when the even think that the house is
being approached. Mine see a friend of mine 3 times a week...and they
still won't let him in until I tell'em that it's okay.

Not aggressively protective, Collies are naturally wary of strangers and
will bite if provoked, though they don't want to. Their warning is two
steps backward and a high head posture angled slightly to one side
and the tail is up, but doesn't wag. That's Colllie talk for. "I've backed
up as far as I'm gonna go. Don't come any closer." That's the only
warning that anybody is likely to get.

The females are naturally protective of children and all things small. They
will often raise and mother pups not their own, or abandoned kittens. My
girl brought in an orphaned squirrel, and mothered it to maturity. She
was convinced that our ferret was also hers, and even tried to let it suckle
when she was raising her litter of pups.

The males are more aloof, but also protective of children, especially those within the household, but aren't as tolerant of small dogs. They'll chase cats, but don't hurt them when the catch'em...They just want'em to stop
and turn around. Herders to the end.

Height/ weight will vary from 18 -26 inches at the back and 65-90 pounds for males...50-75 pounds for the gals.

If you're convinced...please try a rescue organization. Most of the dogs that they have are housebroken and completely evaluated. You can visit
with the dogs and pick one that is right for you...or rather let yourself BE
picked. Unless you're familiar with the traits of the breed, I advise a female
for a first Collie, and teach small children not to run from the dog. Sometimes they will nip at what they perceive to be a runaway from the flock....and they'll also drag a child away from the street without being trained to. They understand the danger instinctively, and will be vigilant to
keep a child away from it....but sometimes teeth find skin instead of clothing.

Luck!

Tuner
 
I'm partial to Labradors but that breaks your weight limit. A full grown lab will weigh at least 90lbs. Mine weighs 105. (he's chunky). He also has a very deep scary growl/bark. He's "stealth" in that he won't bark before going after something/someone who is unexpected. He'll run up to them first, then start barking/growling. I don't know if that would work in your situation, we live on a remote hill behind a locked gate behind a No Trespassing sign, so any unexpected visitor probably does not have good intentions.
 
Labs!

Labs...ANother of my favorites. Love Labs!

Labs tend to go from one extreme to the other. They either wait and lunge without barking or growling, or they bark furiously, invite an intruder in and offer him a beer. I have two...The female stops barking as you approach and will back up from the lot door to let you in...gettin' out is another matter. The male typically loves everybody and wouldn't hurt a worm.

Luck!

Tuner
 
Have you ever heard of a Karelian Bear dog?

The Karelian Bear Dog has a good sense of humor. It is sensitive, independent, intelligent, skillful, tough on itself, and energetic. A robust, persistent, and powerful dog, it is willing to take on virtually any game animal. This dog is very loyal to its owner's family and makes a good household companion when it is extensively trained. This is not a breed for the casual pet owner, the Karelian Bear Dog is a hunter of unyielding bravery and determination. It will put a bear to flight or attack it with great pugnacity. The true outdoors enthusiast and dedicated hunter can look to this hard-working breed with delight and utter satisfaction. Owners must be capable of handling this very forceful canine. Proper training and socialization are absolute musts. It may try to dominate other dogs and are perfectly willing to fight. This dog needs a handler with natural authority. The training should be very consistent with both a firm hand and affection. This is not a breed for inexperienced dog owners. They are affectionate towards people and will announce both welcome and unwelcome visitors. Visitors the dogs knows well will get an enthusiastic welcome while strangers may be treated coldly. This breed is very protective. They will protect you with their life. The Karelian Bear Dog can live with other household animals if the training and socialization is properly handled. This breed has a small appetite for its size.

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/karelianbeardog.htm

about 45-50 pounds
 
I like Labs too. But my chocolate is up to 115 lbs and he's not fat. He's a monster. He has a big bark but I seriously doubt he has a bite. As a breed they still have hip issues.

Do you want some real protective ability? My next dog might be a Staffordshire Bull Terrier. Not the AmStaff ("Pit Bull") but a better-tempered relative. About 35 - 40 lbs of serious muscle and a protective nature. I don't think they require as much exercise as Collies or other herding dogs (Border Collies require a nutty amount of run-time).
 
I think a KBD will be bored out of its mind and become destructive if its cooped up in a house.

Certain dogs needs lots of exercise and outdoor space. Others don't.

You could try the yahoo web pages, do a search on dogs, and they have a nifty little web-apps where you rank various attributes you want in a dog, and they also tell you what the dog would need.
 
Pit Bulls

Pits don't generally make good guard dogs, and can be ruined
for human contact trying to train them to be. Properly raised
and handled, they're as gentle as kittens, loyal, and fiercely
protective when it comes to a direct threat to the master...
and completely goofy during human contact if they haven't been
messed with or trained to guard. That confuses their instincts to
trust people, and results in a time bomb that's not a matter of IF
it will blow...but when.

Pits can't be trusted around other dogs, especially of the same sex. Pits
don't fight because they're trained to...They fight for two reasons. Because
they sense a challenge, and because they like to fight. They don't need to
be trained to fight...That's natural for Pits. They have an undeserved rep for being naturally vicious. The problem comes from improper handling and
lack of understanding of the breed. A vicious Pit is an aberation rather than
representative and should be destroyed. The power in their jaws is
unbelieveable, even when it hasn't been developed by hanging onto tires and such. An adult male pit is capable of crushing a man's wrist like a pretzel. Pits are great dogs...Just read up on'em and learn their quirks
before considering a Pit.

Woof!

Tuner
 
Boxer

My wife and I got our boxer about four years ago and he has been a wonderful pet. He is an indoor dog. Once we got through the initial training, he has never been a problem, even when we have had to leave him in the house for long periods. We also crate-trained him so penning him up is an option when necessary.

Intelligent breed. We have a two-year old daughter and he has always played to her level whereas he will rough-house with me for as long as I let him. We have also had other children to the house and he also plays to their level.

People tend to be afraid of the power of their jaws, but I taught him since he was a puppy that I can take whatever is in his mouth away from him.

I read in a few places that boxers are the breed used by law-enforcement in Germany. He has always been quick to learn stuff from us. One of my favorites is to have him turn off the bedroom lights from the wall-switch.
:)
 
I was going to suggest a Boxer, but I'm not familiar enough with their activity level.

John
 
Boxers

Boxers are friendly, smart, playful, loyal, and can be high-energy dogs that require a lot of exercise and will get as rough in their play as you can stand. They're also clowns! One of the most entertaining dogs that I ever knew was a Boxer. He belonged to a friend that I grew up with. The dog has been dead for over 35 years now, and we still mention him whenever we run into each other. Unforgettable dog.

Love dog threads!

Woof!

Tuner
 
Chow Chow Chow!
I've had Punkin for almost nine years now.Like most of her breed she is a bit aloof around approved strangers.They are basically a one or two person dog.Small children are viewed with the same suspicion as adults-have to be careful.The long hair requires a fair amount of upkeep.She is a bit small for her breed,only around seventy pounds.I know one of her brothers is a bit over a hundred.(think black fuzzy ottoman w/a curled up tail :) )
As far as guard dog ability?Well,she'll still hit the door pretty hard & between the black muzzle & poofed up hair she can look enormous.There isn't a doubt in my mind that she'll bite.(neighbor woman proved that for everyone-another story)
On the flip side she's just a regular love bug.
One "problem" w/chows is that they can be a bit stubborn.
With lots of patience I have probably the best furry friend I'm lickely ever to have.
[oh yeah,forgot that that black tongue is like 36grit:))
 
Man we just got a boxer a few weeks ago and I love this dog!! She is incredibly intelligent. She will learn new things and remember them long-term with just one teaching. She is a clown too. When she gets excited she runs around in circles full speed and then ends her run with a somersault. Because she is so smart she immediately learned that she's supposed to pee outside and what not to chew on. I couldn't ask for a better puppy. They DO like to jump though, that's for sure...Roxie sometimes hops around like a rabbit and when she get's excited she becomes a living, breathing pogo stick.

Here's a description about their watchdog abilities from the website that someone posted above:

"The Boxer's nature is to protect you, your family, and your home. Known visitors will be welcomed boisterously. They are always keen to work and play. Boxers need lots of human companionship. They can be rather boisterous and even in old age are still extremely athletic. Teach the Boxer not to be boisterous and especially not to jump up at people. Boxers LOVE to jump. This breed is noted for courage and makes great guard dogs. Boxers have a wide use in military and police work. Training should start young and be firm and consistent. This breed requires a dominant owner. An excellent watchdog, the Boxer will restrain an intruder in the same way a Bulldog does. "

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/boxer.htm

They usually weigh in at about 55 to 60 lbs full-grown. The only drawback is that they are very energetic and will need some exercise so that means lots of walks for you.

Roxie the Boxer:
191639.jpg


How could you not love that face....and that enormous noggin (it's not that big really...just a trick of the camera)?!

Today I found out that she doesn't like my lawn mower and she gave it an earful the whole time I was mowing the lawn. :)

brad cook
 
Aaah...whatta beauty. Maybe I'll have one, someday.

41, I don't like Chows much, sorry. They are quite likely to bite, and I've only met one in my life I thought was a very good dog. Most I've known have been cowards- even as a child (a small child), they wouldn't face me, but would come sneaking in to try to bite when my back was turned.

John
 
Chow Chow Chow!

Used to have a Chow Chow mix. Not exactly sure what it was a mix of but he honest to God looked like a Wolf with the Chow's tongue and hair. Used to be stray and he had some troubles but he was very friendly once he got to know you. Extremely protective dog. A family friend once came into the house unannounced and almost had his, uh, family jewels removed. The dog never actually bit but he came extremely close. But he was actually well-behaved. He was fine around our Terrier but that was a female. Most dogs with a reputation for biting only have it because people train them that way.

He was the best dog I ever had the pleasure of owning, with the exception a large Saint Bernard named Soloman. Big, slow and protective. He was extremely funny too. Ever seen a 100+ pound dog go over a fence by getting in the corner and climbing? He could also slurp(That is the only thing I can use to describe what he did) up several pounds of raw hamburgers in under three seconds.
 
Lots of great comments and information - THANK YOU ALL!

Some additional information. I will not be replacing my dog until after I retire so I hope to have enough time then to spend a lot of time with whatever dog I get. Also, like I alluded to earlier, we do not have much open space where we can exercise a dog or let it run loose. When THAT happens we may look at a larger or more energetic breed.

Gun and dog owners, what a wonderful combination.
 
JShirley,that's just the Chow Chow showing good tactics:) Suprise attack from the rear!
Now,they can "sense"that steroidal ginsu you have & want to avoid being hacked into pieces.
Keep in mind that Chows were raised for hauling packs,guard duty,use of their fur,& as a meat source.Most are smart enough to want to avoid the last.:D
 
Airedales

You might want to check out an Airedale. They fit well with the whole family and are just great watchdogs.

The two I've owned have been great with young children and the family cats. They are uncomonly brave and loyal.

Their main downsides are: (1) they can be very aggressive to other dogs. (2) They can be very high energy especially when young (not as bad as labs though) (3) like all big dogs, they need to be trained or they will be the one calling the shots not you. (4) They stay playful up to the day they die.

They don't shed, but need to be trimmed about four times a year.

Since they aren't a popular breed you chances of getting a good dog without spending a fortune are good. They also don't tend to have the bred-in defects so common with German Shepherds and Labs. They also don't pork up like Labs seem to do.

My last one, Ranger, weighted 65 pounds so they are in your weight and size class.



Joe
 
I've had Dobermans and Pit Bulls all of my life.Check out www.dru.org;they've everything from puppies to senior citizens in need of new digs.I gotta mildly disagree with 1911Tuner on one minor point;Pits (at least mine) can&have been used as watch dogs WITHOUT totally screwing them up;as he said it IS in training and upbringing.As a watch dog,I DO prefer the Dobies;as a matter of facxt my current house mate/couch pilot si yet another (female)Dobie; my second Doberman rescue League(dru)acquisition;like all the dogs I've been lucky enough to get,she's a joy to havr around and one HELL of a good deterrent/response system.
BTW,the onl;y reqason I prefer Dobies over Pits for solo watchdog duty is that in the case of my dogs,the Pits(three pure breds&one half pit/half Ridgeback)over the years wereprotective of ME,but were more inclined to be friendly/playful with strangers unless they were REALLY obvious in their ill will/intentions.Might have just been individual quirks.Of course ;where I was lucky was that even when I did'nt get a dog as a puppy I did'nt inherit someone else's problems.As far as the prresence around other dogs goes,ALL: terriers are "terrier-like"(combative even when playing).Whenever and whereever possible early socialization/training is a must with all dogs but especially with Pit Bulls.
WTH,I also have wierd taste in music:D
 
JC,

Welcome to THR. Glad to have you.

41, maybe you missed this part: even as a child (a small child), they wouldn't face me, but would come sneaking in to try to bite when my back was turned.
I didn't carry a knife at seven, and I've always been at the bottom of the healthy growth chart.

Not to mention that most of the ones I've encountered seemed at least somewhat deranged, just "off". I'm glad you have one that works for you, but it
does not seem very responsible to recommend one for others.

Potentially aggressive breeds:

* Llasa Apso: can be cranky with kids
* Toy poodles: bite out of self defense
* Dachsunds: not very patient
* Rhodesian Ridgebacks: very dominant breed
* Miniature Pinschers: "big dog" mindset in little body
* Pekinese: intolerant
* Chihuahuas: prefer adults, not tolerant of kids
* Chow Chow: one-person dogs, bite without warning
* Giant Schnauzers: very dominant breed, will even challenge adults
* Old English Sheep Dog: very protective of owner
* Cocker Spaniel: very protective of owner
* Rottweilers: very protective

The ten breeds involved in the most lethal attacks over the past ten years are pit bulls, rottweilers, German shepherds, huskies, malamutes, Dobermans, chow chows, St. Bernards, Great Danes, and Akitas.

While any dog can bite, the top biting breeds include:

* Pit Bulls
* Rotweilers
* German Shepherds
* Huskies
* Doberman Pinschers
* Chow Chows

Aggressive dogs (higher attack rate): (note: this site also includes a list of less aggressive dog breeds)

Bull Terrier
Cocker Spaniel
Chow Chow
Collie
Doberman Pinscher
German Shepherd dog
Great Dane
Pit bull
Rottweiler
Siberian Husky

Dog Breeds Which Frequently Bite:
Chow
German shepherd
Pit bull
Akita
Rottweiler
Doberman
Chihuahua
Dachshund
Terriers




Notice the Chow is one of 3 dog breeds on every "likely to bite" or "have bitten" list!

I'll include the "good guy list" here, too:

Good Breeds For Children:
Labrador retriever
Vizsla
Brittany spaniel
Newfoundland
Keeshond
German short haired pointer
Chesapeake Bay retriever
Old English sheepdog
Norwegian elkhound
Australian shepherd
Collie
Golden retriever
Bloodhound
Bassett hound
English bulldog

John
 
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As you narrow down your choices, you might check with your insurance company. Some companies don't care, but some insurers may not cover specific breeds.
 
Since you already know German Shepherds, why not look for one of the East German or other European dogs which are smaller than the American GSD's. The smaller GSD's go about 60#.

If you work the dog in Schutzhund and develop the control and discipline a Schutzhund rated dog must have, you'll have a great pet that will work well as a guard dog but that you can trust with children. Just another opinion.
 
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