Reliability of Your Home Defense AR

[mc223]

I use one of my ARs for Deer

I use another AR for long range target shooting. Actually two of different rifles in two different calibers.

I have an AR truck gun.

And I have a Home Defense AR


Of these the ONLY one that I need to be absolutely Reliable is The last one. It will go bang if I need it to. If the situation calls for multiple rounds it will do what I need it to.

I do not need an AR that will shoot 1500 rounds without stopping. I'm not going to go wear out my Home Defense AR to prove it will.

This thread is about the reliability of the AR that you would use to defend your home.

I dont care what brand you use. Please dont make this about my brand can kick your brands butt.


Can you without even the slightest hesitation say that you know you can count on Your AR when the chips are down.

And if you have a hesitation, what is the basis? Parts not to spec. Not a chart topper, remorse, etc.

And what parts could you change or add to your existing AR to bring your confidence up.





o

 

[General Geoff]

The only real way to gain confidence in a home defense rifle of any type, is to shoot it. A lot. Not necessarily abuse it, but definitely put a lot of rounds through it in whatever condition it would typically be in for home defense duty if/when you need it.

 

[BikerRN]

Over 5,000 rounds through my Colt 6920 with no malfunctions.

I'm pretty confident.

BikerRN

 

[madcratebuilder]

Malfunctions are almost always magazine or ammo related. Pay close attention when reloading or only shoot quality ammo. Keep your mags in tip top condition. You should have 100% reliability.

 

[benEzra]

Yes. I shoot mine in local carbine matches (an excellent way to reveal any shortcomings with your gear and skillset, BTW), and it shoots reliably even with Tula/Wolf steel-case, though my HD magazine contains Federal T223E. A LE armorer on M4carbine.net graciously torqued and staked my gas key screws for me (it's a Rock River and had a lame staking job from the factory) and I staked the castle nut myself. It does have a 5.56x45mm NATO chamber and a chrome lined barrel, and my HD magazines are PMAGs.

I don't clean it religiously, but it stays well lubricated (Mobil 1).

 

[Sport45]

Niether of my WOA uppers w/ RR lowers have ever failed to function with store-bought ammo.

But they play second fiddle to my 870 for HD.

 

[Tirod]

Most home invasion stats show a pistol is used, and less than three rounds fired. Other than keeping it safe, a decent proven quality magazine and ammo is about all that will be needed.

And like the OP, please don't drag out the one or two instances of when it was really different. Plan for the majority of circumstances and take care of them. Then, you at least have something to handle 85% of what could really happen.

NOT shooting 1000's of rounds thru it will keep it reliable, after a certain point, parts wear and only a proven schedule of Preventative Maintenance and replacements can insure it.

No handloads, off the shelf commercial defense ammo only.

Murphy will look to make his day, practicing action drills to get the weapon back in the fight will do more than finesse points in what money was spent. ANY weapon can fail for the stupidest reason, it always depends on the user to keep it running. Even duty backup guns jam from sock lint.

Training is more important that whether its a pistol, shotgun, or carbine - each has it's specific disadvantages, and "reliability" is a fleeting thing.

 

[Jeremy2171]

If you don't shoot it how will you know if it works or not??

All of mine work...if they didn't I would've fixed them the day they broke...

 

[txhoghunter]

I have the utmost confidence in mine. It has never failed in 1,500 rounds of different types of ammunition, and I am very comfortable in manipulating the gun should it ever malfunction.

My HD gun is loaded with 75 gr TAP HP's and the PMAGs I use have always run flawlessly.

 

[Robert]

I do not need an AR that will shoot 1500 rounds without stopping. I'm not going to go wear out my Home Defense AR to prove it will.

If 1500 rounds wears out an AR you, in the general sense of the term, need an new AR.

I trust my AR and my hand loads with out exception. I only have the one AR so it is my competition/ HD/ varmint/ plinking rifle. I have yet to have any issues with the rifle, my mags or my ammo. To my knowledge it has never had store bought ammo through it.

 

[RockyMtnTactical]

Your truck gun doesnt need to be totally reliable?

 

[Zerodefect]

Shoot your AR as much as you want. Not much in a GOOD Ar that can't handle aggressive use.

Just replace your bolt, cam pin, and extractor springs at the proper maintenance intervals. Which don't pop up too often. The rest can be checked out with a simple detail strip and cleaning. Clean the rifle good after a trip to the range. Simple common sense stuff. I wouldn't sweat it.

I have no worries about my Colt 6920 or BCM operating reliably. They've both proven reliable and have been cleaned and maintained religiously.

 

[mc223]

Didnt say I dont shoot it. Just not going to wear it out proving it is reliable.

My Ar does not need parts to make it more reliable. The question is about YOURS


RMT, I want my truck gun to be reliable. but it doesn't NEED to be. My family does not join me for excursions in my truck. And I pretty much live in the boondocks. So If my truck gun did fail and I missed ol Wyly Kyote, well, oh well.
This is also my plinker. Economy reloads is its steady diet.

Gus that was a just a meaningless number.

 

[Robert]

Gus that was a just a meaningless number.

Fair enough. But I have met a good many shooter who believes that shooting their rifle, or even training with their rifle will wear it out.

 

[kwelz]

Yes I have complete confidence in my HD rifles. I have this confidence for the following reasons.

1: I purchased brands known to put out quality products.
2: I know the problems ARs often have and was able to check for these issues.
3: I have tested and trained with my weapons. Thousands of rounds through each one in a short period of time prove to me that they are reliable.

Anyone who says you are going to wear out a quality AR by using it in training doesn't know what they are talking about. Government issued M4 and civilian examples like Filthy 14 show that they can stand up to the test of time and abuse.

 

[rjrivero]

My AR gets put through some paces. Three gun matches, carbine shoots, etc and etc. It's a Bushmaster XR-15. Has never missed a beat.

 

[Lakedaemonian]

Yes. I shoot mine in local carbine matches (an excellent way to reveal any shortcomings with your gear and skillset, BTW), and it shoots reliably even with Tula/Wolf steel-case, though my HD magazine contains Federal T223E. A LE armorer on M4carbine.net graciously torqued and staked my gas key screws for me (it's a Rock River and had a lame staking job from the factory) and I staked the castle nut myself. It does have a 5.56x45mm NATO chamber and a chrome lined barrel, and my HD magazines are PMAGs.

I don't clean it religiously, but it stays well lubricated (Mobil 1).

#1- Shoot in local matches is a good way to reveal shortcomings. Hit the nail on the head there.

#2- Your gas key wasnt properly staked... from ROCK RIVER?!?!?!! Yikes. Epic fail there. I'd expect as much of DPMS but never Rock River. Thats scary, as much as they charge for their rifles.

#3- Dont clean it religiously, but it stays well lubricated (Mobil 1)?!?!??!?!?!
I just got a mental picture of an oil funnel in the ejection port. Not all oils are created equal bub.

 

[kwelz]

#3- Dont clean it religiously, but it stays well lubricated (Mobil 1)?!?!??!?!?!
I just got a mental picture of an oil funnel in the ejection port. Not all oils are created equal bub.

A lot of people use Mobile one or similar oil on ARs. It is actually a very good way to lube a firearm.

 

[mshootnit]

I built an Armalite that I am pretty sure will go bang, but my home defense is mr. 870. And he will go bang.

 

[Zerodefect]

Gun lubes are rarely more complex than simple engine oil. Not that engine oil is simple anyways. Most are simple easy to find lubes with stuff added to make them seem/smell different.

If I hand someone my home brew: "You made this? I ain't trying this. Is this ATF and grease?"

My homebrew with weird stinky Marvel Mystery oil added. "Sniff.....Wow, can I try some of that. Hey it's like FP-10 and Tetra combined! And it smells cool. Who makes it?"

People are easy to fool sometimes. Sometimes it's as simple as the smell or color of the snake oil that fools them.

I don't want to point out what certain brand gun oils really are. I'll let someone else tackle that. I don't need the headache of some gun lube co. being miffed at me for outing them as el cheapo auto parts store ingredients.

And Mobile1 works fine in an AR. AR's aren't very picky. As long as it's slick, it lasts, deosn't evap under heat, and won't collect in the bore.....it should be decent.

 

[steven58]

My HDAR is 100% reliable and I would not hesitate to use it. Other than the furniture and trigger parts it is 100% milspec.

I have over 3,000 rounds of mixed steel, brass, surplus and civilian ammo through it with zero problems of any kind.

My "modifications" were not to increase reliability but to personalize the ergonomics.

Geissele SSA trigger

BattleComp brake

Magpul MOE stock, grip, handguards and angled foregrip.

Surefire light ElZeta mount.

Micro T1 RDS.

Oh, and it has run on Mobil-1 V Twin 20-50 since day one. I use it in all of my firearms because as everyone knows "Not all oils are created equal bub".

Seriously, that oil does exactly what it was designed to do: lubricate high speed high temperature metal surfaces without breaking down or easily cooking off while also protecting from corrosion and keeping carbon fouling and other contaminants in suspension from -42 to 214 degrees F.

 

[Davek1977]

I expect ALL my guns to function reliably. I won't own a gun that can't be counted on to do what its supposed to do. That said, i have no issues counting on my cheapie doublestar... while not mil spec or one of the "favored" brands like Colt....it has never given me any reason to doubt its functioning. Its not my primary HD firearm, but I have no doubt its up to the task if ever needed for that purpose

 

[ultradoc]

I would trust mine and my 870

 

[Tirod]

If you shoot your gun 5-10,000 rounds a year, it will eventually fail. Action springs, extractors, extractor springs, etc can and do wear out, need replacement, and get ignored.

If you want reliability, a maintenance program is more important than the brand name of the parts or even if they are milspec. As long as you replace that part before it's known mean failure point, you can run the cheapest crap on the market and the gun will be reliable. People do it with ink pens every day, not that many blow the money on a Waterman or Cross.

Problem is, we often don't have a clue if the part is really that good or bad - we depend on anecdotal word of mouth street talk based on some observation and a dash of marketing. About the only guideline we get is milspec standards, which are exclusively COLT TDP standards for the M4 as insisted by the DOD to meet taxpayer protection guidelines. You be the judge if they even meet your needs.

The OP seemed to ask what might improve reliability in the AR, and the subject of Mobil 1 use seemed to get dismissed out of hand too quickly. It's definitely better than Rem Oil, doesn't cost $32 a quart, and does the job as reported by more than a few shooters. Others have posted an analysis of other oils based on rust resistance, ability to stay on parts, etc. and with side by side comparisons, decided good old Dexron ATF is also good to go. It will be a source of discussion for a long time - and lines are already drawn in the sand. What I do see is that the AR is less stressful on oils than the internal combustion motor, even personal lubricants have been used and work. Don't drag out a high and mighty attitude about using motor oil when it's better and cheaper than Brand X's paid professional testimony.

Do the math - a lawnmower with a 1 quart crankcase runs at 1750rpm for 1 hour every ten days from 1 April to 1 October. That's 52,500 "rounds" of work just to cut the grass the first time, times the 18 times it gets cut over six months equals 945,000 "rounds," meaning ignitions of gas mix in the cylinder. And that's crap lubricant?

No wonder cars need engine rebuilds every year, right? No, not so much.

And we haven't even touched on the TDP standard for dry film lubricant, or nitriding, either. Nitriding alone is a huge longevity improver in high stress moving parts, reducing friction and surface hardening parts that otherwise would be subject to bare surface abrasion.

Reliability enhancers include chroming the barrel, chamber, and bolt, nitriding, running better grade materials than milspec, shooting full power ammo to ensure proper gas pressure to power the action cycle, keeping the gun stored in a dust free environment that won't promote condensation (truck guns get the worst of it,) and lots of practice. Regardless of the weapon, the operator needs to be reliable, too. Practice until you can't do it wrong.

Somebody using motor oil is at least trying to implement a solution, rather than complain about something they have no clue about. More shooters should do that.

 

[benEzra]

#2- Your gas key wasnt properly staked... from ROCK RIVER?!?!?!! Yikes. Epic fail there. I'd expect as much of DPMS but never Rock River. Thats scary, as much as they charge for their rifles.

Yup. It was staked in a way that can pretty much be described as "cosmetic." The metal was indented but wasn't really pushed into the gas key screws. It is possible it would have held up over time, but also possible it wouldn't have. Now I don't have to worry about it.

#3- Dont clean it religiously, but it stays well lubricated (Mobil 1)?!?!??!?!?!
I just got a mental picture of an oil funnel in the ejection port. Not all oils are created equal bub.

I know all oils aren't created equal. That's why I use a largely Group IV polyalphaolefin based synthetic lubricant with a known good additive pack instead of some bottle of rebranded unknown-mix machine oil from a department store sporting goods counter.

FWIW, PAO based synthetic lubricants have properties vastly superior to most midmarket "gun" oils---less tendency to dry out over time, better lubrication and wear resistance, higher shear strength, and better temperature stability. Only a few specialty gun oils (Militec, Slip2000) even come close.

Rem Oil
Pour point:...................??
Flash point:..................??
Viscosity at 100 degrees F:...25 cSt
Viscosity at 212 degrees:.....??
Transient operating range:....??
Viscosity index:..............??

Mobil 1 synthetic 5W30
Pour point:...................-65.2 F
Flash point:..................+446.0 F
Viscosity at 100 degrees F:...64.8 cSt
Viscosity at 212 degrees:.....11.3 cSt
Transient operating range:....511.2 F
Viscosity index:..............171

Mobil 1 synthetic 10W30
Pour point:...................-49.0 F
Flash point:..................+453.2 F
Viscosity at 100 degrees F:...62.0 cSt
Viscosity at 212 degrees:.....10.0 cSt
Transient operating range:....484.2 F
Viscosity index:..............148

MILITEC-1
Pour point:...................-45.0 F
Flash point:..................+455.0 F
Viscosity at 100 degrees F:...43.41 cSt
Viscosity at 212 degrees:.....5.63 cSt
Transient operating range:....500.0 F
Viscosity index:..............63

(Numbers are from this thread, courtesy of THR member Gun Slinger)

As far as application, I use a small squeeze bottle (old Rem Oil bottle) and Q-tips. It works very, very well. I just wouldn't use M1 on the outside of the gun, as it produces a thick, non-drying film. Great for lubrication, not so great for handling.