Reliably feeding load for a 1911?

oldschool45

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Ok so last year I bought the fiancee a Tisas 1911 as an upgrade for her 45acp. The barrel, frame etc. where it feeds looks to have followed John Moses's original 1910 specs to the letter. My other 45acp guns will feed bricks (or SWC's) if I can get them into the case. This thing is real finicky on feeding.
To be fair I've only been trying to run it with cast 200gr RNFP's. My guess is I will have to go to 200 or 230gr RN's FMJ? or can I get away with plated? and watch my OAL.
I appriciate your thoughts.
PS: I have polished the chamber, frame below the barrel and am using known good mags.
 
With feeding issues you may need to play with the OAL. All I shoot is SWC with just a thumbnail of shoulder above the brass. Which should put the OAL in 1.250" area. This works for any SWC bullet weight.

I find mags cause the most problems. Also check to see if pushing up on the mag helps or hurts. If helps there are mag catches that can raise it up.

Are you getting a 3 point jam? nose dive into ramp?
 
The Tisas will run RN FMJ's and plated just fine. I also have run a variety of JHP, which have the effective profile of a RNFP. I run a COAL of 1.230 or sometimes less, such as 1.220.
 
My 1911 will feed, fire, and eject any 45 ACP cartridge that will fit the magazine. Never tried full wadcutters or empty cases, but I've heard of some that will feed them. As Blue's post mentions, info on what kind of FTF you experiencing will help diagnose whether it's the gun, magazine, case dimensions, bullet shape or OAL. I have 3, 45 ACPs, a 1911, a Ruger P90, and a High Point carbine. The 1911 and HP will digest any handload with any bullet I've tried but my P90 chokes on 200 gr. SWC about 10-12 % of the time. Diagnosing a feeding problem online is difficult with many variables to consider and I'd start with ammo.. Plunk finished handloads, try different bullet shapes and OAL and different load levels (load levels can cause feeding problems. Too light load might not function/cycle the action).
 
I guess for me no reason not to just use 230 plated or even lead rn. If the gun can't handle them time for a glock.

Xtp's should also give you a good reliable feeding bullet.
 
In a Colt Combat Elite, the only profile I couldn't get to feed reliably was the 200g RNFP. No matter OAL, plunk test etc. pistol just didn't like them. You can see in my pic my top 3 favorites to cast/shoot.
 
Just curious, if mags are big issue how did it survive combat. Wasn't no fancy McCormick mags in 1941.
 
Before the magazine and chamber, check the extractor. The 1911 designs rely heavily on the extractor profile, tension and gap being correct. A new gun leaving the factory with an overly torqued extractor is not all that rare.
 
Just curious, if mags are big issue how did it survive combat. Wasn't no fancy McCormick mags in 1941.
I think the fact that there were very few manufacturers of 1911A1 handguns in 1941, and they all followed the same military specification. Now, 80 years later there are many 1911 makers, who are making changes to differentiate their product from others. There is enough variation between models that now the slight variations between magazines makes a difference.

That said, I run CMC (Chip McCormick) magazines successfully in 5 different brands of 1911 without issue. I don't know why, because to my untrained eye they look very similar to the other brands of magazines I have.
 
The average dog-faced GI wasn’t nearly as big a fan of the venerable 1911A1 as later retelling of history might indicate. My WW2 vet grandfather was not a fan. Neither was my Korean War vet uncle - the one who got me and all his boys started on single action revolvers. My Vietnam War vet uncle on the other side of the family hated guns in general then, still does, and didn’t carry one when there - he was a Navy Corpsman serving inland, detached to the Marines. Now, me personally, I like the 1911A1. But I keep revolvers around the house for protection and hunting. You’ve just got to go through the machine and make sure the monkey who assembled it put it together right. Not too loose, not too tight, but just right.
 
I'm mainly getting FTRB's, no stove pipes but...I've been shooting mousefart loads so it might be a power issue. I picked up a box of Blaser Brass factory ammo to eliminate the retared monkey standing in front of the reloading press. If it craps the bed with those its probably going to be used for a trade up.
If I have time before we hit the range tomorrow I'll load up some full power Win231 or AutoComp loads with the RNFP's or use the full power Hornady XTP's over Autocomp that I have here for socialwork.
I've been running Kimber/McCormick/Star mags that have been 100% reliable in my Kimber Compact Stainless.
It's possible that my reloading has gotten sloppy since my Kimber, Hi-Point Carbine & Sig320(45acp) reliably run anything I throw at them.
Edited to add; it does not like a longer OAL even in spec (fails the plunk test) makes me wonder if the area just in front of the chamber is a bit tight. It handles empty brass fine so the chamber isn't cust too short.
 
I’ve got a Tisas “Service” M1911.
It has a non-ramped barrel, but has fed everything including 200gr Semi wadcutters.
Round Nose, Truncated Conical (XTP’s) have fed reliably.
Mags don’t seem to matter…

I’d contact SDS, the importer who provides factory service to see if they can rectify the problem.
 
Tisas 1911 ... SWC ... 200gr ... OAL
200 gr SWC bullets are essentially 230 gr RN bullets with non-contact parts removed to reduce weight.

So if RN reliably feeds at certain OAL and SWC follows same/similar bullet nose profile/ogive, then contact point could be used to determine the SWC OAL that will reliably feed for the same pistol/barrel/magazine.

Take a look at comparison picture below of MBC 45ACP bullets and different nose profile bullets and weights to the right still follow the nose profile/ogive of the RN bullet on the left.

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Below are Lee 200 gr TL SWC on the left compared to typical 200 gr SWC nose profile on the right that both follow nose profile/ogive of RN.

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Most reloaders have found if we seat SWC bullets to where a thumbnail thickness of shoulders stick above the case mouth, SWC nose contact point more or less mimic the contact point of RN and feed more reliably. For MBC 200 gr SWC (IDP #1/Bullseye #1), that OAL is 1.240" which will reliably feed in railed Sig 1911 XO that has the tightest chamber and shortest leade I have seen along with Citadel 1911 that is target model of RIA 1911 with tighter chamber/shorter lead and tolerances (Same load reliably fed in SA/Kimber 1911 and of course in RIA 1911 Tacticals that have enlarged chamber mouths which feed even sloppy SWC reloads).

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For 9mm MBC SWC, it's 1.045"

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200 or 230gr RN's FMJ? or can I get away with plated?
For FMJ/plated RN, factory PMC/CCI 230 gr FMJ are shown on the left with Berry's 200 gr HBRN and HSM HP shown on the right.

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Edited to add; it does not like a longer OAL even in spec (fails the plunk test) makes me wonder if the area just in front of the chamber is a bit tight. It handles empty brass fine so the chamber isn't cust too short.
Even for my railed Sig 1911 XO with tightest chamber I have seen, adding .022" to the bullet diameter of .452" resulted in .474" taper crimp amount of case mouth which still allowed the SWC rounds to fully chamber and spin without hitting the start of rifling.
 
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Load em full power. At or near the top of load chart.
If you want softer shooting rounds get a faster burning powder.
Old people shooting powderpuff loads causes most of the cycling problems.

But feeding problems are usually magazine problems.
 
Load em full power. At or near the top of load chart.
If you want softer shooting rounds get a faster burning powder.
Old people shooting powderpuff loads causes most of the cycling problems.
But feeding problems are usually magazine problems.

The mousefart loads have 3 reasons; 1) we shoot plates and soon IDPA why screw with additional recoil 2) I like to indroduce new shooters and its a confidence boost to them to comfortably launch that honkin 45 downrange and 3)why waste the powder?
Yeah I keep 3 recoil springs around for my Kimber; regular, light and the one for bowling pin loads
 
Load em full power. At or near the top of load chart.
Bullseye match shooters go :eek::eek::eek: :D https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/loads-for-the-bullseye-shooter/99418

"A common benchmark is that the gun must be capable of a 10-shot group at 50 yards that is less than 1.5 inches center-to-center.

As you can see from the chart ... velocity ranged between 700 fps and 800 fps. High speeds are not required, and more speed means more recoil. Also, some shooters believe this speed range is the sweet spot for accuracy."​

Old people shooting powderpuff loads causes most of the cycling problems.

But feeding problems are usually magazine problems.
My "powder puff" load of 200 gr LSWC with 4.0 gr of Red Dot/Promo will reliably cycle all 1911s I have shot and M&P45, even when using new recoil springs (Factory and Wilson Combat/Wolff aftermarket).

And no feeding issues with factory Sig/RIA 1911 magazines along with 8 round Chip McCormick Power Mag and Wilson Combat 47D magazines through 12,000+ rounds out of railed Sig 1911 XO and 10,000+ rounds out of RIA 1911 Tactical.

And pretty accurate too (Groups shot after 7000+ rounds through Sig 1911) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...omo-reloading-range-test.578444/#post-9415802

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Anytime you deviate from the standard 230 gr round nose don't blame the gun, reloads, or mags. Not what the 1911 was designed for. If you deviate to SWC, different bullet styles, different bullet weights (like me) COAL can become important as mentioned. As little as +/- .010" can make all the difference in the world between a reliably feeding 1911 or a Jam-O-Matic. I own seven brands of 1911 mags. Some new and some very old. They all work no matter what flavor bullet I reload.
 
I'm mainly getting FTRB's, no stove pipes but...I've been shooting mousefart loads so it might be a power issue. I picked up a box of Blaser Brass factory ammo to eliminate the retared monkey standing in front of the reloading press. If it craps the bed with those its probably going to be used for a trade up.
If I have time before we hit the range tomorrow I'll load up some full power Win231 or AutoComp loads with the RNFP's or use the full power Hornady XTP's over Autocomp that I have here for socialwork.
I've been running Kimber/McCormick/Star mags that have been 100% reliable in my Kimber Compact Stainless.
It's possible that my reloading has gotten sloppy since my Kimber, Hi-Point Carbine & Sig320(45acp) reliably run anything I throw at them.
Edited to add; it does not like a longer OAL even in spec (fails the plunk test) makes me wonder if the area just in front of the chamber is a bit tight. It handles empty brass fine so the chamber isn't cust too short.

OK, you've gotten lots of good advice so far, and my not-inflation adjusted 2 cents is only going to add so much to the discussion. However, you HAVE to try more than just that one bullet type before giving up on and ditching the pistol.

First off, a failure to return to battery isn't an ammunition power issue, it's an issue with how your ammunition is feeding and fitting into the chamber. Without the pistol in hand to see, it's almost impossible to figure out exactly where the fit issue is. My Colt Competition will give the occasional FTRB if I reload a case with a particularly chewed up case mouth that doesn't get smoothed out. You might not be taking enough crimp out, you might be causing a bulge somewhere by taking too much crimp out, you might have a bullet with a shoulder catching somewhere. Many, many possible options.

Secondly, find some 230 grain round nose bullets of almost any stripe. Full metal jacket, plated, lead, powder coated, something, anything that looks like a factory round nose profile. While my Colt will have the odd hiccup with 200 grain semi-wadcutter reloads with rough case mouths mentioned above, it is as reliable as sunrise and taxes with 230 grain RN or FMJ bullets. I'd expect any 1911 (or .45 ACP for that matter) in factory configuration, feeding from good magazines, to just work with 230 grain RN ammunition.

Third, when setting up to reload lead bullet .45 ACP ammo, I recommend pulling the barrel of the pistol you're loading for, and do the plunk test while loading up some dummy rounds to set your seating die. While you can get away with using book values with certain bullets, say standard FMJ and similar profiles, you may or may not get away with the book values with other bullet profiles. By other bullet profiles, I'm primarily looking at Hornady XTPs, semi-wadcutters, pretty much anything deviating from the standard RN ball profile. The way I do this is to start by seating the bullet long, then gradually turning the seating stem in until the round fits the chamber with the case head in the correct position relative to the barrel hood. Make sure your crimp is backed off for this, because you'll need to keep pushing the bullet deeper, and pushing against a crimp will create other fit issues. Once you have the seating depth down, adjust the crimp to remove your case flair until the round "plonks" into the chamber. At this point I'm ignoring book value cartridge OAL and recommended crimp diameter, and making sure the final cartridge fits MY chamber.

Four, similar to point three, you're going to have to experiment a little with some of the different bullet profiles. My pistol has a short throat, and I have to load SWCs so there's just barely a fingernail or two worth of bullet shoulder sticking out of the case. It's a similar story with Hornady XTPs and other jacketed bullets with the same profile: I have to seat them so the parallel shank of the bullet is mostly in the case. Once I have the seating depth and crimp adjustment down, I'll make up 2 or 3 dummy rounds to check to be sure they feed properly. In a 1911 I'll do the feed test with the recoil spring removed, so I can feel if the cartridge wants to hang up somewhere on the way into the chamber.

Fifth, if you want the easy button, find some Berry's 230 grain plated round nose bullets, seat them around 1.25" OAL, and push them with 5.0 grains of 231. It's lighter than full factory spec 230 grain .45 ACP hardball ammunition, but reliable. I have a stash of this load hanging around in case I ever get to make it to some of the local practical pistol matches.

@Steve in Allentown thank you for the picture. That's the second time in the last few days I've seen a recommended case base to bullet shoulder length for a loaded .45 ACP semi-wadcutter round. The part that caught my attention is your suggested dimension is .940", the other suggested measurement I saw is .920", and the Missouri Bullet Company 200 grain SWCs I have loaded up for my Colt measure .930".
 
I’ve seen some new guns before be so tight that it took a bit of shooting to where they’ll reliably cycle. I’m not sure if your brand is in that camp or not.
You can also slowly cycle your gun and watch the steps as the cartridge is stripped and chambered. You can load dummies or just do this in a safe location with live rounds.

Edited to add; it does not like a longer OAL even in spec (fails the plunk test) makes me wonder if the area just in front of the chamber is a bit tight. It handles empty brass fine so the chamber isn't cust too short.

If the COL is too long, it’s not going to chamber. Find your working COL before doing anything else. I would also recommend a case gauge of some kind to check your finished ammo. It could be you’re not applying enough crimp to remove the bell and your chamber may be a bit tight. That combo will stop a cartridge really quick. I use a Shockbottle gauge and you may want to investigate that if you’re getting into competition.

The mousefart loads have 3 reasons; 1) we shoot plates and soon IDPA why screw with additional recoil 2) I like to indroduce new shooters and its a confidence boost to them to comfortably launch that honkin 45 downrange and 3)why waste the powder?
Yeah I keep 3 recoil springs around for my Kimber; regular, light and the one for bowling pin loads
Keep in mind IDPA CDP requires 165 PF. That isn’t a mouse fart in my book. I agree light loads are fun for a lot of reasons but too light and the gun doesn’t cycle.
 
PS: I have polished the chamber, frame below the barrel and am using known good mags.

All of these are known good mags but this particular 1911 doesn’t like some as much as the others. Testing them is not only free but easy.



If you find a mag that feeds empty cases 100% you can correct the rest with recoil springs down so low the brass lands on the bill of your hat.

Of course you can’t load ammunition that won’t physically fit the chamber, there is no reason to continue loading, without further adjustments if you haven’t completed proper die adjustments.
 
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