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Rolling trigger breaks compared to regular single action. Opinions sought.

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by peacebutready, Mar 26, 2020.

  1. peacebutready

    peacebutready Member

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    Different people have different opinions about how light a single action trigger can be before it is too dangerous for carry and home defense. The CZ 75 has a rolling trigger break, unlike the 1911. Does that mean a person can go for a lighter trigger in terms of pounds with the CZ 75 compared to say a 1911 while maintaining the same level of safety?

    How much lighter can the rolling trigger break be than the regular single action trigger?
     
  2. Otto

    Otto Member

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    The CZ 75 is double-action, 1911 is single action. Apples to oranges. Yeah, CZ's can be SA, but they normally aren't. Firearm safety is dependent on the person handling the gun.
     
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  3. peacebutready

    peacebutready Member

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    The CZ is only double action for the first shot, although it can be made single action for all shots if the hammer is back with the safety on.
     
  4. Zerodefect

    Zerodefect Member

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    I hate the long travel involved with DA/SA triggers. Although the CZ Shadow 2 was the best one I tried.

    Nothing's safer than a 1911. If you want light, convert your CZ 75 to a single action only trigger. The 75 has a lighter trigger than a 1911 then.
     
  5. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

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    Would you define what you mean by "rolling trigger break"?

    If you're equating trigger travel with "safer", I think you might be looking at it from the wrong angle. While I have felt CZ SA triggers that are very light, I wouldn't characterize them as being safer. I've found that lighter triggers tend to tempt shooters to slap through their triggers...which usually has an adverse effect on accuracy
     
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  6. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

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    As others have said, it would be helpful if the OP could expand on what he means by a “rolling trigger break.”

    “Rolling” the trigger (i.e., pulling a DA trigger in a continuous motion) is not the same thing as a “rolling trigger break.” SAO guns can have a rolling trigger break - it’s a description of how a sear/hammer interface feels during release.

    We need to know if the OP just means a DA trigger, a technique for pulling a DA trigger, or the very specific trigger feel of a gun with a rolling trigger break in SA.
     
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  7. koz4guns

    koz4guns Member

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    In bullseye a roll trigger is one that has some very smooth creep before the break, is this what you mean by rolling trigger?

    if I remember back when I had a CZ75 when the trigger was pulled the hammer would cam back slightly before the break with a slight amount of creep, I don’t know if this makes it safe to go lighter though.
     
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  8. kidneyboy

    kidneyboy Member

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    One of my bullseye 1911s had a roll trigger. Beautiful trigger for sport use when done properly.
     
  9. peacebutready

    peacebutready Member

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    The quote below by koz4guns describes is perfectly.


    Yes, perfect description. That "creep" was designed into the CZ 75. As you mention, the hammer cams back slightly.

    I was wondering if that makes it safer to go lighter than a single action trigger without that camming action.

    I read a review of a fellow's custom 1911. He had it built to have that rolling trigger break.

    Is a rolling trigger break common on bullseye guns?
     
  10. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

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    At very light weights, I would not say the rolling trigger is any less prone to AD/ND's than a similarly-light glass-rod break. The trigger is traversing a tiny distances during the smooth-creep/roll portion of the pull. If you're touching the trigger when you shouldn't be and get startled, it's not going to be any less prone to getting jerked straight through to ignition than if the sear and hammer had no slip before release.

    Now, without being worked over and lightened a lot, I would say most CZ's come with triggers that I would be comfortable carrying, including in a cocked-and-locked SAO manner.
     
  11. WVsig

    WVsig Member

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    Yet every high level competition shooter basically shoots fast and accurate "enough" with a controlled slap. Watch the top competitors and they all slap the trigger.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2020 at 7:45 PM
  12. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

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    The key word is High Level

    JJ Racaza?

    They all might do it sometimes (usually at close targets), but I don't think they all do it all the time
     
  13. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

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    At speed, I think almost all of them pull straight through. The very best are capable of modulating in the middle of a course of fire and prepping a particularly difficult shot. But they’re all “slapping” a good portion of the time in USPSA.

    bullseye is a totally different game... no slapping at high levels there.
     
  14. Otto

    Otto Member

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    Generally...no. As a rule of thumb:
    Rolling break for action shooting.
    Defined wall for bullseye.

    I like my triggers with a defined "wall" that break like glass.
    A great trigger is more than just a lite pull. Pre-travel and over travel play a big part as well. So does reset.
     
  15. Steve C

    Steve C Member

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    IMO it is a good idea to keep your trigger pull within NRA Precision Pistol rules. Such rules are there to provide safety while allowing for precise target accuracy. The minimum trigger pulls allowed in NRA handgun rules is 2 lb for rimfire, 2-1/2 lb for center fire under .45 cal and 3-1/2 lb for .45 ACP. By keeping the trigger pull within a recognized accepted authoritative rule one is less likely to be accused of wielding an unsafe hare trigger weapon. All these "minimum" trigger pulls are quite light in a handgun.

    The heavier the handgun recoils the heavier the trigger pull needs to be to avoid recoil induced inadvertent discharge. So you can go with a lighter trigger pull in a CZ75 9mm compared to a 1911 .45 ACP and have the same level of safety but if you go up to .45 caliber and recoil in a CZ 97 a heavier single action pull is needed. When one goes to the heavy magnums like the S&W 500 the recoil is heavy enough in DA revolvers to induce doubling AD's even with a quite heavy SA trigger pull.

    How many times do you read or see on TV where a person says "the gun just went off" when explaining why or how they shot another person. The thing is guns don't just "go off" if the shooter uses proper handling. Keep your finger off the trigger until you intend to shoot and regardless of how light the trigger pull is the gun should be safe.
     
  16. koz4guns

    koz4guns Member

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    I can’t say it is common because I don’t have one and personally don’t know anyone who does, but the only shooting sport I’ve heard of a roll trigger is Precision Pistol (Bullseye).

    If you read the Bullseye forum the roll trigger has a pretty good following, people usually love them or hate them, I would like to give one a try.
     
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  17. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

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    I would not agree with that. I know a handful of USPSA guys who have and like a “rolling break” on their SA triggers. Almost everyone prefers a “hard wall” glass-rod break with zero detectable creep. People do differ on what weight they want their trigger to be, especially in the SAO divisions where some people get their 2011 race guns well under 2lbs.

    I happen to like mine a touch over 2lbs. When it gets too light, the wall starts to feel vague to me. I’d rather have it 100% crisp at 3lb than vague at 1 lb 6 oz.
     
  18. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

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    The notion that cops, prosecutors, or juries are going to know about or be impressed by NRA Precision Pistol rules is pretty questionable, IMO.
     
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