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Ruger GSR - Can't Close Bolt

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Captains1911, Feb 3, 2012.

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  1. Captains1911

    Captains1911 Member

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    When cycling rounds, sometimes I am unable to move the bolt completely forward on a cartridge and lock it down. This happens sometimes when feeding from a magazine and sometimes when I manually place a single round in the chamber and then try to close the bolt. I was suspecting the the polymer magazines, but now I'm not so sure. It's as if the extractor claw is unable to get over and around the rim of the case and is rather being pushed into the back of it.

    I noticed when I cycle the bolt very slowly, that as I move it forward and it begins to strip the cartridge from the mag, it gets to a point where the magazine spring tension "pops" the round up out of the mag before the bolt is forward enough to allow the extractor claw to grab the rim. Is this normal operation? Sometimes when this happens I am still able to close and lock the bolt down, but sometimes I am not. I don't see how this is any different from manually placing a single round in the chamber and closing the bolt on it.

    I am not very experienced with bolt guns so any hep would be greatly appreciated.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2012
  2. HOOfan_1

    HOOfan_1 Member

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    With most mausers, you can't push feed them. That is likely your problem
     
  3. longdayjake

    longdayjake Member

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    Yeah, you can't push feed a mauser bolt. It has to strip one from the mag.

    Question. What kind of ammo are you using?
     
  4. HOOfan_1

    HOOfan_1 Member

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    CZ550 you can, not sure if there are others
     
  5. Captains1911

    Captains1911 Member

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    Interesting, because Ruger specifically mentions this type of operation as an option in the manual.

    The ammo is Federal 165gr from Wally World and Prvi Partizan 145gr. I have experienced the malfunction with both types of ammo, and I'm almost sure with the same 5rd polymer magazine and on the same (2nd) round of that magazine. Could this be mag related?
     
  6. 303tom

    303tom member

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    Have you tried lubrication ?
     
  7. HOOfan_1

    HOOfan_1 Member

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    Well then Ruger is like the CZ 550 then. I did a google search and apparently many other modern Mausers have adopted that system
     
  8. Captains1911

    Captains1911 Member

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    Of what part(s)? I have lightly lubed the bolt and action rails.
     
  9. dprice3844444

    dprice3844444 member

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    check for burrs on the extractor or dirt in it
     
  10. Captains1911

    Captains1911 Member

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  11. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    Ideally, the magazine spring should push the round up firmly and as the bolt starts to strip it from the magazine the case head should slide up the bolt face so the case rim slips under the extractor claw.

    If the round pops free before it slides up and under, it may end up in front of the extractor claw, not under it. If that happens, you're trying to push-feed the round (like a Remington 700 does) instead of "Controlled Round Feed" it (like Mauser-based rifles do).

    In a military Mauser, you generally should be able to still force the extractor claw to snap over the case rim in an emergency, but it isn't very good for it as a general practice, and shouldn't be necessary.

    Now, you're mentioning that this mostly happens when you work the bolt very slowly.

    DON'T. Learn the proper technique for operating a bolt and run it with authority -- smartly up, back hard, forward hard, down firmly -- as one continuous smooth motion. I'll bet your feeding problems will go away.

    Babying it along certainly could cause the rounds to release a bit early and end up in the wrong place.
     
  12. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    I don't think you have a problem.

    The photo you posted clearly shows brass tracks on the angle bevel on the extractor where it has, at some point at least, snapped over more then one rim.

    It takes a sizable amount of force on the bolt handle for that shallow bevel to flex the strong spring extractor enough to snap over the rim.
    It should not be easy.

    If you want it to snap easier, polish is so it isn't shaving brass and leaving brass tracks.

    BTW: Most German military Mauser's could not be closed on a round in the chamber.

    They could be easily modified to do so by grinding & polishing the bevel on the front edge of the extractor like your Ruger already has.

    Most commercial 98 Mauser's already have the bevel and can snap over a rim.
    As can the 1903 Springfield, Model 70 Winchester, etc.

    rc
     
  13. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    Ah...I was going off the Springfield. Can't remmber having tried it with a K98.
     
  14. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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    Controled Feed

    Rifle is Controled Feed, But can be loaded single shot. http://www.ruger.com/products/gunsiteScoutRifle/features.html
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2012
  15. HOOfan_1

    HOOfan_1 Member

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    actually as he pointed out, the manual specifically states you can drop a round in the chamber and close the bolt

    https://ruger-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/_manuals/gunsiteScoutRifle.pdf

    page 16 heading "To load and fire without magazine"
    point #4

     
  16. Captains1911

    Captains1911 Member

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    Just for clarification, the "malfunction" is not constant, but is somewhat frequent. Also, the only reason I was cycling the bolt slowly was to observe how it works, I realize it should not normally be operated in this fashion, however I will focus on closing the bolt quickly and see if that solves it.

    It's interesting how there are mixed opinions on whether or not a round should be chambered manually and the bolt closed over it. I would like to learn more about this. Thanks for the help.
     
  17. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Read page 16 of your owners manual.

    rc
     
  18. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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  19. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    If the manufacturer is advising that this technique is ok, then it IS! They've set up the extractor with the right geometry and finish (and quality and tempering of the steel) to be able to handle that kind of use without damage.

    It is going to feel different (harder, more resistance) to close the bolt that way than in the normal CRF method.
     
  20. Captains1911

    Captains1911 Member

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    I already referenced that info earlier in this thread, however there are people who still think it should not be done. When i try to load the rifle this way, it works smoothly sometimes but other times not at all, to the point where the force required to close the bolt is WAY more than I am comfortable with. I just don't understand why it's intermittent.
     
  21. jmr40

    jmr40 Member

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    With most modern Mauser type actions such as Ruger and Winchester it is perfectly safe to load directly into the chamber. On older guns it is not unless the extractor hs been modified.
     
  22. SharpsDressedMan

    SharpsDressedMan member

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    If using handloaded ammo, you can encounter .308 brass that has been fired in other guns, some with oversized chambers, and the use of small base dies might be needed to resize cases better at the base, as is necessary for use in some semi-auto rifles with tighter chambers. Your rifle might just have a tight chamber, too.
     
  23. Elkins45

    Elkins45 Member

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    While I agree with you that it's OK for his Ruger if they say so, I still think its a bad habit to get into just in case he ever owns a military rifle with an unaltered extractor. Better to just get in the habit of always feeding from the magazine and avoid the problem completely.
     
  24. Captains1911

    Captains1911 Member

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    I ran another 40 rds thru it today, all from mags, and operating the bolt quickly and with authority. Ammo was Prvi Partizan. I encountered one round this time that I could not close the bolt on. This problem always seems to occur with the same 5 rd polymer mag, and on the second round of the mag. I don't understand how the mag could be causing this, but it's too great a coincidence to rule out.
     
  25. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    Trust what you see. Diagnosing feeding problems in any repeating arm ALWAYS starts with the mag. If you remove one mag from the equation and your problem stops completely -- that's your answer. True for AKs, ARs, 1911s -- just about everything.

    Now, if that doesn't fix it, or doesn't completely fix it, let Ruger have a whack at it.
     
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