Should I trade a pristine Garand for this M1A?

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Father Knows Best

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I have a CMP collector grade Garand that I received from CMP about a year ago. It's a Greek issue SA manufactured in 1954. It appears to be in unissued condition. Everything is matching. The stock is beautiful walnut with the correct SA markings and cartouches. Even the cosmoline it was swimming in was probably original. I paid $1,400 for it.

I also have a June 1944 production Springfield "service grade" that I got at the same time for $500 or so. It has a replacement (RRA) stock, but it otherwise all original and is a good shooter.

Here's the dilemma. My dad works at a gun shop. A customer came in the other day and traded in a Springfield Armory M1A National Match package rifle. It has the 3rd Gen 4-14x56 Government scope (with illuminated range finding reticle), 3rd gen scope mount, and all the accessories (custom fitted Doskocil hard case; scope covers, filters and sun shade; 10, 20 and 30 round mags; original box and manual; etc.).

The shop gave him $1,600 for it on trade. My dad has offered to swap me my collector grade Garand and $200 for the M1A. It sounds like a great deal to me, and it shore is purty, but I honestly don't know much about M1As. I hear that they are great shooting rifles, and this seems like a fantastic high power/long distance package. Since I'm not shooting the collector grade Garand, anyway, and I'll still have my other Garand, I'm very tempted.

What do you think?
 
Hmmm, that's a hard choice. I'm tending toward the thought that the M1 is not too easy to replace, but the M1A is still available commercially. Equipped like that one, though, would probably cost more then the $1,600 being asked. I suspect that the all-original M1, even as postwar production, is probably worth more than $1,400 now.

I think I'd hold on to it as an investment, shoot the other M1, and save up to buy an M1A later.
 
CMP M1s with papers generally bring at least a couple of hundred dollars more on the secondary market than what they were sold for to the original purchaser.

On the other hand, $1600 for an M1A National match with scope, mount, and accessories doesn't sound too bad, either.

Just for the heck of it, ask if you can buy the M1A for $1600 cash . . . if the answer is "no" and you're quoted a higher price, then that's a good indication of what your Garand is actually worth.
 
I think I'd hold on to it as an investment, shoot the other M1, and save up to buy an M1A later.
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A gun isn't a good investment unless you plan on selling it. Realistically, if you won't sell that M1 now, will you ever? Most of the guns I get I intend to keep until I pass them on to my kids.

I think you should seriously consider the trade. You already have an M1 that you like, so get an M1A too. For the M1 Garand and $200, I would go for it.

Just for the heck of it, ask if you can buy the M1A for $1600 cash .
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This is a good point too. Still, even if you could get more for the Garand elsewhere, what are the odds you would just sell it? Probably slim. I say take the trade. To hold on to the Garand as just an investment is foolish because you are never going to sell it anyway, but just keep it until you keel over. Get an M1A and start enjoying shooting it instead of just letting the Garand collect dust. That is just me.
 
Are we talking raw economics, here? Obviously not, because you can do the math as well as any one of us. Also, note what El Rojo just said. Guns are investments only if you plan to or are willing to sell them. Otherwise, they are what they are- expensive things that make you happy by having them.

So, you're down to the non-monetary value of the items in question, and only you can know the value that you place on them.

Me? I would never part with that Garand, to get another modern-production gun. Think about it. SA has carbon copy M1A NMs rolling off the assembly line every day. The goodies are readily available. The only thing that varies is the price.

There are no more original M1s being made. If you actually have an unissued M1, with matching parts and an original stock, you hold in your hands a piece of history. If you value that, it is worth keeping. If you don't, just run the numbers and see if you come out ahead.

Mike
 
Keep your M1. The National Match SA is not much better than the Loaded, and the Loaded is not any better than a Standard M1A with a USGI barrel.

I bought a slightly used Loaded for $1,000 recently and an unused Standard with a TRW bolt and barrel for $1,150. This National Match is overpriced and Springfield optics and mounts are generally not well regarded...

Your collector grade M1 is a keeper...

All IMHO, of course...
 
Keep the Garand. You will always be able to find or build a match grade M1A/M14.

If you made this a poll, I'm pretty sure 99% of the voters would vote for the Garand.
 
If your dad really wants a collector grade M1 CMP still has them...

My thoughts on it are why get a collector that you are never going to shoot. I have several rack grades and I take them to the range every chance I get. They shoot better then I can and there is always someone at the range that has never shot one.

So I guess what I am saying is buy a couple of service grades and shoot them!!!
 
That Garand is sort of like a class III rifle: there aren't any more coming. The CMP might find two or three hundred more Garands like yours - MAYBE - but after that five years passes, CMP will probably out of Garands all together.

If you can get 1.5K or so for that Garand right now when anyone can go buy one at the CMP stores, imagine what it is going to be worth when the supply runs out and there isn't any easy way to get one.

All in all my vote is to keep the Garand, but if you decide to trade it, tell your dad to shove the extra $200 up his @ss....HE should give you the extra $200 in the trade...not the other way around. Like everyone else has said...M1A's are a dime a dozen and being made everyday.
 
I have a Garand and an M1A. I enjoy both very much but...NEVER would I sell my Garand! That would be a sin!

Jim
 
As the owner of a really, really nice Garand, and the past owner of a (greatly tweaked and modified) NM M1A, I have to agree- keep your Garand, save up for a more realistically priced M1A.

Garands are a finite resource. There are no more that will be manufactured, (at least real ones, not that SA abomination) and there are fewer available every day. If yours is as minty fresh as described, it's one to be cherished foreven and passed on to your progeny after you have carefully told them what it represents. If it were mine, I might even have reservations about cycling the action except in dire need.

If you want an M1A, you could find a representiative M14 type rifle for as little as $600 or as high as $3000 or more. To me, an M1A as you describe has liabilities- I have no love for those particular optics on said rifle. The case is nice, but what does it do that a $20 Plano case wouldn't? Mags, however, are always nice, as long as they're in good condition or better and USGI.

Fifteen years ago I sold my NM. I had a lot more than $1600 in it...in fact, closer to three times that, as it was essentially a hand built shooting machine that was my primary competition piece. You'd be money ahead to build one if you (simply) want one to shoot, unless you came across a Type 57/Norinco/Fed Ord and have it reworked for safety (and.or function). Of course, I did not recoup all my investment from my NM, but it did go to another shooter who used it for several more years before rebuilding it, thus perpetuating the line. I don't regret selling a rifle I can replace. My Garand, on the other hand, I shoot sparingly, because I bought it to shoot. It's not pristine, but didn't come to me as a museum quality piece- like yours.

Sell in haste, repent at leisure, to paraphrase an old cliche`.

Regards,
Rabbit.
 
"If its to good to be true, its to good to be true. why the M1A with all that gear so cheep ?"

My dad bought the M1A to turn it and make a few bucks. He showed it to me because he thought I'd like it. He knew I wanted to build a long range shooter, and offered to trade for the M1 I wasn't using because he knows he can turn either rifle around and make a few bucks.

"Just for the heck of it, ask if you can buy the M1A for $1600 cash."

Remember that this is my dad. He offered it to me because he knew I wanted the M1A and that I didn't have $1,600 cash. He probably would sell it to me for $1,600 if I asked, but I don't have the cash and I wouldn't ask even if I did. After all, I know his intention was to turn it and make some money on it. He thinks he can get $2,000 for it without any trouble. That's a profit of $400. If he gets my Garand and $200, then he would have $1,400 into the Garand (the $1,600 he paid for the M1A less $200 from me). He'd still need to sell the Garand for $1,800 to make the $400 he was expecting to make on the M1A. He's definitely doing me a favor by making the offer. It's no skin off his nose if I pass it up.

"Keep the Garand. You will always be able to find or build a match grade M1A/M14."

I dunno. CMP still has collector grade Greek Issue M1s available, at the same price I paid a year ago ($1,400). CMP says "Finish will show little or no wear and wood will have few or no handling marks. These rifles are in excellent condition and show little or no use." I could order 5 more like it tomorrow at $1,400 apiece, if I had the money. I find it hard to believe that these things are worth more than $1,400 on the market. A pristine, matching USGI WWII Garand would certainly be worth more than that, but a post-war Greek issue? I don't think so. Why would anyone pay $1,600 or more for a rifle they can buy 5 of direct from CMP for only $1,400 each?

Sure, new M1As are also available, but where can I get one like this at anywhere near this price? The rifle alone would cost me at least $1,500, and it has $800+ worth of optics and scope on it.

"If yours is as minty fresh as described, it's one to be cherished foreven and passed on to your progeny after you have carefully told them what it represents. If it were mine, I might even have reservations about cycling the action except in dire need."

I dunno. I'm generally not a fan of safe queens. I will never get rid of my WWII USGI Garand. It has history that means a lot to me, and I can take it out periodically and shoot it. The collector grade, however, doesn't have that history, and I can't shoot it. So what good is it? It's pretty, but that doesn't mean as much to me as the history behind the service grade rifle. If I pass them both to my sons, the service grade rifle would mean more. It's the one that an American soldier carried in WWII, vs. the one that sat in a warehouse in Greece for 50 years. It's the one that dad took out shooting, and that he taught us to shoot with, vs. the one that no one was allowed to touch for fear of destroying its collector value.

The service grade rifle has quickly become my favorite. It's an heirloom. The collector grade rifle is just an investment.
 
In the end, it sounds like you have a collector-grade 'just because', and not because you really wanna collect 'em. Given that, it would seem that the M1A would be more useful to you.

I vote that you do the deal. If you don't wanna collect, there's no sense in having rifles you don't shoot.
 
"Good luck to your father selling that M1A for $2k. I'm betting it goes for $1.7k tops."

See, that surprises me. I've been looking for an M1A for quite a while now. I've never seen a national match in new or like new condition with this optics package advertised at less than $2,500. New, this package would list for $3,000. The rifle lists for $2,100, and sells for at least $1,200 to $1,500 in this condition. The scope alone lists for $900, and I can't find it for sale anywhere at less than $700. The mount is another $130. The case and accessories (extra mags, ventilated guard, etc.) are another $100-200.

The only similar M1A I can find for sale online right now is listed at $2,000, and has obviously been well used. It lacks the case, extra mags and scope accessories, and has a broken hinge on the scope cover. This one is like new. The guy who traded it in says he shot it only a couple of times, and it looks like it. He's well known to my dad, because he spends a lot of money in the shop.

My dad has been in the business for 30 years now. He opened his first gun shop in 1975. He promoted gun and military shows in the midwest from the late 1970s until the late 1990s. He's retired now, but works part time in a buddy's gun shop in Georgia. I'm pretty confident that he knows what this gun is worth on the open market.

If anyone knows where I can find a national M1A LNIB with the 4-14x56mm 3rd gen scope and mount for less than $2,000, please let me know.
 
"If you don't wanna collect, there's no sense in having rifles you don't shoot."

I'm a bit of a collector, but nothing like a lot of guys. I like firearms with history -- with stories. My dad probably has a lot to do with that. He collects guns that can be documented to individual units, or even better to individual soldiers. He puts together very nice displays with photos of the soldiers/unit, their history, personal effects/letters, etc. He tracks down descendants of the soldiers, if he can, and gets photos and letters from their widows or children if they aren't still around. The items in his collections tell stories.

That's why the service grade rifle means a lot more to me than the collector grade. One was issued to a GI and probably carried in battle. I don't know who, but maybe someday I will. The other never saw anything but a crate and a warehouse. Sure, it's pristine, but so is a brand new Springfield Armory of Illinois Garand. Neither has any history.
 
That's why the service grade rifle means a lot more to me than the collector grade. One was issued to a GI and probably carried in battle. I don't know who, but maybe someday I will. The other never saw anything but a crate and a warehouse. Sure, it's pristine, but so is a brand new Springfield Armory of Illinois Garand. Neither has any history.
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+1.
 
Perhaps I said that because the SA NMs are just overpriced. You can get much better M1A/M14 from a match shooter that will have the same price, and then add the optics of your choice. I have seen a lot of SA NMs go for a good deal less than what we're talking about here because they just aren't as good and SA would lead you to believe.

Maybe this is a result of me expecting more from an M1A, or a result of the people in my circles not even turning their heads for a SA NM rifle. Maybe we're selling them to the wrong crowd or you should be buying from us! If you'd pay $2K for a SA NM with a scope, I wonder what you'd pay me for my Clint Fowler built gun...I think $3.5k would be a good starting point for you. After you buy it I'll find two more slightly used Fowlers for $1600 a piece and sell another one to someone who thinks a SA gun is worth that much.

Why didn't I think of this to start with?!
 
Keep the M1.

"Match Grade" means little in an M1A unless it had other work done to it:
Barrel replaced with a Kreiger or other true match barrel
Match trigger mods
Unitized gas cylinder
Reamed flash hider
Match bedding
Machined match sights, not the cast fakes from SA

Also, the SA scope and SA mount are not up to the task of hard duty use. If it were equipped with a Leupold and Brookfield mount it would be a different issue.
 
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