SamlautRanger
member
Ok, trying to decide between a Sig 220 or USP (either standard or compact) in .45 cal.
Would appreciate comparisions on reliability and accuracy. THanks.
Would appreciate comparisions on reliability and accuracy. THanks.
Sig 220 or HK USP
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Fumbler
Member
Reliability shouldn't be an issue with either gun.
The only time I've shot a USP in 45ACP was when I rented a USP compact. I couldn't hit a thing with that gun. I think it had to do more with the fat short grip than the actual accuracy of the gun.
I like the 220 more just because of the grip. It narrower, like a 1911, so it points easier and is easier for me to shoot. The USP 45 is double stacked and unless you have real large hands it might not fit you well.
The only time I've shot a USP in 45ACP was when I rented a USP compact. I couldn't hit a thing with that gun. I think it had to do more with the fat short grip than the actual accuracy of the gun.
I like the 220 more just because of the grip. It narrower, like a 1911, so it points easier and is easier for me to shoot. The USP 45 is double stacked and unless you have real large hands it might not fit you well.
HighVelocity
Member
I can't comment on the USP as I've never fired one but I do own a 220.
My P220 has gobbled up every brand of ammo that I have ever tried. Not one malfunction, ever. It's like the swiss watch of pistols and it's one that I would not hesitate to rely on in any situation.
My P220 has gobbled up every brand of ammo that I have ever tried. Not one malfunction, ever. It's like the swiss watch of pistols and it's one that I would not hesitate to rely on in any situation.
Black Majik
Member
Ooh thats a tough one...
For me, my personal choice would easily go to the Sig P220. The ergonomics and feel of the gun fit me better. I liked the way it pointed, the way the grip felt, and the gun actually as a very smooth trigger pull in both SA and DA mode.
The USP is a great firearm however. Its able to be carried condition 1 (cocked and locked) or in DA/SA mode. The trigger on it isn't nearly as good as the Sig, and for me I dont like polymer guns as much. Furthermore the reason I wont own a USP is because the front and backstrap feels like a cheesegrater. Actually holding a cheesegrater would feel more comfortable than the USP.
Both are accurate, both are very reliable, and both look good. Hold both of em' it'll be pretty evident that one will call your name out more than the other one.
Of the two, go for the Sig Sauer.
For me, my personal choice would easily go to the Sig P220. The ergonomics and feel of the gun fit me better. I liked the way it pointed, the way the grip felt, and the gun actually as a very smooth trigger pull in both SA and DA mode.
The USP is a great firearm however. Its able to be carried condition 1 (cocked and locked) or in DA/SA mode. The trigger on it isn't nearly as good as the Sig, and for me I dont like polymer guns as much. Furthermore the reason I wont own a USP is because the front and backstrap feels like a cheesegrater. Actually holding a cheesegrater would feel more comfortable than the USP.
Both are accurate, both are very reliable, and both look good. Hold both of em' it'll be pretty evident that one will call your name out more than the other one.
Of the two, go for the Sig Sauer.
SamlautRanger
member
Yeah, I am kind of leaning toward the Sig. For 2 reasons. #1 I am used to the operations of Sigs. I carried a Sig 226 for 6 months in Iraq. #2 I like how I can dress up the Sig with some nice exotic wood grips from Hogue 
Now the big question is do I get the regular Sig or the Stainless Version. I kind of like black guns better and do not care much for rails. But the stainless will last longer and the heavier weight will probably help reduce recoil and improve accuracy. I suppose I could always later, for looks, get the thing Kote coated in Black if I wanted. Don't mind it being heavier as will probably not be a CCW but more of a Home, Ruck, and truck gun. Got the P7s (best handgun ever made!) for CCW.
Now the big question is do I get the regular Sig or the Stainless Version. I kind of like black guns better and do not care much for rails. But the stainless will last longer and the heavier weight will probably help reduce recoil and improve accuracy. I suppose I could always later, for looks, get the thing Kote coated in Black if I wanted. Don't mind it being heavier as will probably not be a CCW but more of a Home, Ruck, and truck gun. Got the P7s (best handgun ever made!) for CCW.
That is tough choice, both are very reliable. I have a USP .45 f and a P220ST. Can't go wrong with either. The grip is much slimmer on the SIG, and I think it's more comfortable. Out of the box, the double action trigger is better on the SIG.
uspcompact
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i've got both in the family and id' echo some of the other remarks...
reliability is not an issue...both will fire reliably forever...
but...id' go with the USPf .45 any day of the week. i like the way it feels in my hand and i perfer the action. it feels a little more solid to me and it's deadly accurate. the recoil is reasonable and i got mine for a very good price (about $600 NIB). i'd say in my experience neither is clearly better than the other but i favor the USP. i love em both though.
reliability is not an issue...both will fire reliably forever...
but...id' go with the USPf .45 any day of the week. i like the way it feels in my hand and i perfer the action. it feels a little more solid to me and it's deadly accurate. the recoil is reasonable and i got mine for a very good price (about $600 NIB). i'd say in my experience neither is clearly better than the other but i favor the USP. i love em both though.
When comparing apples to apples, a standard 220 is a better money value than a standard USP.
Couple hundred dollars less if you find a 220 on sale.
I personally prefer the USP even at the higher value but that is me.
A USP Tactical, Expert, or Elite version will cost twice as much and make both the 220 and the standard USP look plain common.
Couple hundred dollars less if you find a 220 on sale.
I personally prefer the USP even at the higher value but that is me.
A USP Tactical, Expert, or Elite version will cost twice as much and make both the 220 and the standard USP look plain common.
Black Majik
Member
Yes or the P220 Sport or the P220 EL will make the USP and regular P220 look plain common also.
MikeIsaj
Member
Are you considering used? There seems to be a lot of used Sigs right now in my area. I just got a very good deal on a used 220. It's a first rate weapon.
TrapperReady
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I like the SIG P220 myself. My hands are on the small side, and the grip fits me better. Also, when I got mine I was already used to a SIG P228. Personally, I like the plain-jane version.
BryanP
Member
I own a used P220 and I love it. I've never fired the HK, just held one. As far as reliability and function go I'd call it a wash - they're both extremely reliable. You'll be well served by either one. My preference should be apparent.
This topic has surely been beaten to death several times.
No problem, I will answer. 220 is arguably slightly more accurate.
I've read from various gun range employees USP's have broken but none of their SIG's have. Also, the USP has one of those stupid integrated locks. SW integrated locks have been known to self-activate and render the weapon useless until it's unlocked again (if you remember to bring the key with you). If you ever made the mistake of cocking the USP with the lock activated I hear you can break your hammerspring too.
220 IMO is a better bet. Feels a lot better in the hand because it's single stack. The bad side is, you have less shots. But the gun is so accurate you won't need them.
No problem, I will answer. 220 is arguably slightly more accurate.
I've read from various gun range employees USP's have broken but none of their SIG's have. Also, the USP has one of those stupid integrated locks. SW integrated locks have been known to self-activate and render the weapon useless until it's unlocked again (if you remember to bring the key with you). If you ever made the mistake of cocking the USP with the lock activated I hear you can break your hammerspring too.
220 IMO is a better bet. Feels a lot better in the hand because it's single stack. The bad side is, you have less shots. But the gun is so accurate you won't need them.
10-Ring
Member
I had a P220 & sold it to finance my 1st USP purchase. Currently I have 4 USPs in various calibers & sizes (from an Expert to the compact) and no SIGs in the mix...I say, go w/ the USP 45 and don't look back!
I'm somewhat in the same quandry. I am trying to decide on my next .45. Its basically coming down to do I want to carry it or not. My choices are HK USP Tactical, Sig P220, Colt Ltwt. Commander XSE. All fine pistols. The Colt will carry the best followed by the Sig, but I just can't see carrying a USP due to its size. I am leaning towards the Sig, but I just don't know. Also, IDPA may be in this guns future. Thoughts?
S-Ranger,
Hello! I have each of the guns you're asking about. I actually like all three (P220, USP .45f and USP .45c)...
The USPf .45 is big. The grip is just a little too big (for me), to not feel as in control with it as I would like. It's not unmanageable, but is something to consider. (I'm 6" tall.) It is very reliable, though. I put the HK match trigger kit in mine.
The USPc .45 fits me a lot better. Slimmer grip and a smaller package (although not a real compact).
Personally, I hate gun locks. I wouldn't have bought the USPs, if I hadn't been able to obtain a small number of NON-locking "lanyard loop insert blocks". I replaced the offending parts and could then sleep better at night. (They're very hard to get, though.) A little german tinker absconded out of Europe to bring these parts to me. Many people died in the process... (Just kidding.)
I like cocked-and-locked, so the USPs have that appeal to me.
The P220. It's easier to carry than the USPf .45, but more on par with the USPc .45. I like it, too. Shoots good, points good and is super reliable. Mine is black. I had a SS model a long time ago, but didn't like the weight of it and sold it. I also prefer black or blue guns. I put a Sig short trigger in it and a piece of 3M non-skid tape on the frontstrap and it's ready for showtime. (The P220 has a smooth frontstrap, unlike the other P2xx models. The SS model does have some checkering on the frontstrap, though.)
I know you mentioned these wouldn't be for concealed carry, but for me, if it's in the car/truck, etc., there's a chance I may have to stick it in my waistband at some point, so it was a consideration for me. If you always have another CCW with you, that's not a concern.
I'm not a big DA auto fan, myself, but I've made an exception with my Sigs. (I prefer 1911s, BHPs and P7s.)
For putting in a truck, rucksack, etc., I like the USPs. They are more corrosion resistant than the Sigs.
I have to agree with you on the P7. It is one of the BEST CCWs. They are one of my very favorite pistols and carry very well.
Good luck with your decision.
Hello! I have each of the guns you're asking about. I actually like all three (P220, USP .45f and USP .45c)...
The USPf .45 is big. The grip is just a little too big (for me), to not feel as in control with it as I would like. It's not unmanageable, but is something to consider. (I'm 6" tall.) It is very reliable, though. I put the HK match trigger kit in mine.
The USPc .45 fits me a lot better. Slimmer grip and a smaller package (although not a real compact).
Personally, I hate gun locks. I wouldn't have bought the USPs, if I hadn't been able to obtain a small number of NON-locking "lanyard loop insert blocks". I replaced the offending parts and could then sleep better at night. (They're very hard to get, though.) A little german tinker absconded out of Europe to bring these parts to me. Many people died in the process... (Just kidding.)
I like cocked-and-locked, so the USPs have that appeal to me.
The P220. It's easier to carry than the USPf .45, but more on par with the USPc .45. I like it, too. Shoots good, points good and is super reliable. Mine is black. I had a SS model a long time ago, but didn't like the weight of it and sold it. I also prefer black or blue guns. I put a Sig short trigger in it and a piece of 3M non-skid tape on the frontstrap and it's ready for showtime. (The P220 has a smooth frontstrap, unlike the other P2xx models. The SS model does have some checkering on the frontstrap, though.)
I know you mentioned these wouldn't be for concealed carry, but for me, if it's in the car/truck, etc., there's a chance I may have to stick it in my waistband at some point, so it was a consideration for me. If you always have another CCW with you, that's not a concern.
I'm not a big DA auto fan, myself, but I've made an exception with my Sigs. (I prefer 1911s, BHPs and P7s.)
For putting in a truck, rucksack, etc., I like the USPs. They are more corrosion resistant than the Sigs.
I have to agree with you on the P7. It is one of the BEST CCWs. They are one of my very favorite pistols and carry very well.
Good luck with your decision.
SamlautRanger
member
Stevew13
I keep on hearing how much the 220ST weighs, but it seems to me to weigh no more than a full size standard 1911.
is the 220 ST a dull matte finish Stainless?? Alwyas hard to tell from the photos. I think some nice Rosewood or walnut grips from Hogue would look pretty nice on the 220ST.
Stevew13, BTW got the Kobra. Thanks.
I keep on hearing how much the 220ST weighs, but it seems to me to weigh no more than a full size standard 1911.
is the 220 ST a dull matte finish Stainless?? Alwyas hard to tell from the photos. I think some nice Rosewood or walnut grips from Hogue would look pretty nice on the 220ST.
Stevew13, BTW got the Kobra. Thanks.
I have a USP45. It's like holding a brick. Thought about selling it at one point. But it is so reliable and feeds everything effortlessly that I decided to keep it.
I also have a Sig 220ST. Nothing fancy. Just accurate and reliable. Put on some Hogues. They make it look better.
Oh, and you asked about the finish --- it's a dull & drab matte stainless finish. Built for function, not for looks.
I also have a Sig 220ST. Nothing fancy. Just accurate and reliable. Put on some Hogues. They make it look better.
Oh, and you asked about the finish --- it's a dull & drab matte stainless finish. Built for function, not for looks.
I guess when I think of the weight of the SS P220, I'm subconciously comparing it to the alloy frame standard P220. It seems most people with the SS P220 love it, so it may just be me. It's a fine weapon, I just like the alloy, black P220 better. Both of them are very accurate and reliable.
Moonclips - That P220 looks great. If I had kept my SS model, that's what I was going to do with it.
Oh, also - S-Ranger - If you happen to buy a used SS P220, be sure to get the newer model with the 1913 pic rail, rather than the older. The older rail has a proprietary Sig rail, that requires an adapter, if you ever use a light. (Of course, the HK rails are proprietary, though.)
I've long wished Sig would put some slight texturing on the front strap of the alloy P220. It is SLICK, with that hard plastic factory grip. I put the non-skid tape on mine, but it still feels like it needs it on the back strap, too.
Moonclips - That P220 looks great. If I had kept my SS model, that's what I was going to do with it.
Oh, also - S-Ranger - If you happen to buy a used SS P220, be sure to get the newer model with the 1913 pic rail, rather than the older. The older rail has a proprietary Sig rail, that requires an adapter, if you ever use a light. (Of course, the HK rails are proprietary, though.)
I've long wished Sig would put some slight texturing on the front strap of the alloy P220. It is SLICK, with that hard plastic factory grip. I put the non-skid tape on mine, but it still feels like it needs it on the back strap, too.
Gixerman1000
Member
I have a P220 and a USP45 Tactical, both have been totally reliable and very accurate, I shoot the Tactical a little bit better than the P220 but of the standard USP45's with out the O-ring I have shot, I would say they shoot about the same.
The P220 feels a little better in my hand and If I were going to pick one for a CCW it would be the P220 but the USP isn't bad and 12+1 rounds of 45acp and the option to Cock & Lock is real nice to have.
Get the one you like the most and best fits your needs, both will serve you well and are among the best service 45's you can buy.
Good luck
The P220 feels a little better in my hand and If I were going to pick one for a CCW it would be the P220 but the USP isn't bad and 12+1 rounds of 45acp and the option to Cock & Lock is real nice to have.
Get the one you like the most and best fits your needs, both will serve you well and are among the best service 45's you can buy.
Good luck
BryanP
Member
Can you document this somehow? I've never heard of this happening yet.
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