Similarities In Interview Techniques Panhandlers V. Muggers

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I must admit that he literally seemed to have come out of nowhere. Either my situational awareness was off at that particular moment, or he was genuinely following me in the parking lot.
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That happened to me at Walmart one night around 10PM. I had even scanned around before loading my stuff in the car. Darned spooky. Must have been behind another car and waiting for me to get distracted.
 
My answer is "I can get you help from the XYZ Police department", let me get them on the line here and they will send someone to help you (this starts most going 180 degrees). I can spot them across the parking lot and across the street for the one's that think I am the mark and they start heading toward me. I put up the Fence (Both hands palms toward them) and say "I have no information for you" and keep walking while moving my right hand closer to my CCW just in case.
 
Back in the day.... when it was more-or-less safe and legal to pick up hitchhikers... I spotted a guy with a gas can walking along the road.

So I picked him up since I was heading toward town for a class.

After we chatted awhile, I asked him what gas station he wanted, and I would drive him back to his car. What the hell, I could cut a boring class ("ditch a class," in modern parlance) just to help someone out, right?

Well, he hemmed and hawed for a minute, then came clean. The gas can was just so he could get rides more easily.

Dayam! Well, after I laughed for a while, I took him right to his destination.

So I went to class anyhow. Dayam. Boring.

Terry
 
Anytime I see a situation with a panhandler I first determine if there is any other person in the area that could be a part of a team. Virtually every time they will be working alone and are in fact simply panhandlers. I stop them at word one with "I can't help you, sorry" and they almost always move on to the next guy. If there is another suspicious person in the vicinity then I will go on high alert in an attempt to make sure they (assuming it's a team) understand that I will not be an easy target. I make eye contact with BOTH of them and it has never failed to work. Of course I guess it's possible that they were all just panhandlers.
 
I encounter panhandlers on a daily basis. I am respectful, but firm, I never give them money. I shake my head NO as soon as I see them, and no matter what they say I respond with a firm "NO THANK YOU" and move on. I really would not recommend getting too cute with panhandlers, many are substance abusers, and often carry self defense ( think: blade, screwdriver, cane, rock). 'Just say'n.
 
One of the guys said the panhandlers make about 40k a year. Well, back in the 70's, I would travel from the east coast to Milpitas California, up near San Jose. Every morning on the way to work, I would pass this guy standing on a corner with a sign that said "will work for food". One day I went into the plant and told the manager there to find a job for this guy, which he did. The next morning, when I passed the sign guy again, I stopped and said that we have a job for him. He asked me if it paid more the $37 per hour? What? I said no way would be pay that much. He then told me, "well, that's what I make here on this corner, and I don't even work all day or every day". I then asked him "are you hiring?" We both got a good laugh out of the response. This was mid 1970 or so. After that, we just waved to each other. True story.
 
There was a guy on the NE corner of Wadsworth and Colfax whose sign said, "Please Help. Need beer."

Next time I went by I deliberately stayed in the right lane so I could give him a buck at the traffic light.

You need a "beggar's license" in Denver and I was tempted to get one and try it out just as an experiment to see the reactions and gauge the potential income level. But since I'm enormously wealthy anyhow, I let that idea go.

There was a guy with a cardboard sign at the Kipling exit from I-70 pretty regularly and I was going to meet someone at a restaurant nearby. As it happened, it began to rain as I waited for the light, and he picked up his stuff and started to leave.

As I sat in the restaurant parking lot waiting for my buddy I saw the selfsame guy walk up to his fully-tricked-out brand new Dodge Ram, get in, and drive off.

Wished I could afford a truck like that.
 
I've seen multiple people at a local walmart parking lot with signs reading "just buried the last of my family need money for gas back to texas". My guess is it's a family of panhandlers.
 
I am so glad this sort of thing just doesn't happen where I live. Six months of winter keeps the panhandlers and feral hogs away.
 
rondog and skoro...

I am dying !!! Sad part is that I understand...:uhoh:

On a more serious note, does anyone else see a problem here. We are basically saying, everyone else is a threat and should be treated that way. How about the poor lost guy that asked me for directions at the end of my driveway last week? I am always wary..but I still helped him out. Okay, so I felt safer because I had sharp lawn sheers in my hand..lol

what I am saying is, have we reached the point that we won't let anyone into our space ? Or are we talking about the obvious - I DONT WANT THEM IN MY SPACE - spidey sense kind of thing ? Being a former NY'er , I have no trouble rebuffing those...talk to the hand..lol
 
ohbythebay said:
On a more serious note, does anyone else see a problem here. We are basically saying, everyone else is a threat and should be treated that way.
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No we’re saying that any unknown person that is trying to invade our space is a potential threat and should be treated accordingly

ohbythebay said:
what I am saying is, have we reached the point that we won't let anyone into our space ?
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Again, if I don’t know you I am going to be very leery about letting you in my bubble. As I think I mentioned up thread I’ve had people use these types of approaches to get in my space and they have attacked me.

That’s the kind of thing that really only has to happen one time to change how you look at people
 
There was a guy with a cardboard sign at the Kipling exit from I-70 pretty regularly and I was going to meet someone at a restaurant nearby. As it happened, it began to rain as I waited for the light, and he picked up his stuff and started to leave.

As I sat in the restaurant parking lot waiting for my buddy I saw the selfsame guy walk up to his fully-tricked-out brand new Dodge Ram, get in, and drive off.
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Where's my shocked face.....

Hell, I'm unemployed - maybe I should be a beggar! I need a new truck.
 
"On a more serious note, does anyone else see a problem here. We are basically saying, everyone else is a threat and should be treated that way?"


You're dealing with a group that has members who are holding a discussion elsewhere on the forum on the ideal *shower holster* so they are never caught with their pants down, so to speak.

Seriously?? :eek:

Willie

.
 
Another question might be;
At what point does a Mugger approach you like a panhandler?
You see the guy, he has his hands open to his side, requesting help; once inside your space and with no way out the tactics turn.
You want a handout or my wallet and keys?
You see I can't completely understand the difference until you're in my space.
 
They have a right to ask, and I have a right to rebuff. Pre-emptively. Profiling? You bet yer sweet left cheek. Hardnosed? You bet yer sweet right cheek. Experienced in this matter? Ayup.

Stainless steel guns in the shower? Different discussion.

Assorted evidence that it's a genuine problem:

http://denver.cbslocal.com/tag/panhandling/
 
Maybe it's because I don't live in a big city but I generally will stop and talk with someone for a quick minute. I make sure I'm aware of my surrounds and try to be careful but never really had an issue.

On a few occasions I've helped someone out with money, I'd rather give it to someone who maybe doesn't deserve it than to deny someone who might really need it.
 
<rantish but relevant to the course of discussion>
Oh, Ryanxia, don't get me wrong. I'm actually quite generous (at least before I retired) in cases where I know where the money is going. Not to brag, but I once bought a city lot next to my church for extra parking. But I knew where the money was being spent. And I often contributed to the church with instructions to transfer the money to a needy family I found out about or whatever without my name being involved.

But with panhandlers, I have short shrift. First of all, if they really need help there are (or were) plenty of agencies which can actually help them... like a local church, just as a f'rinstance. But more importantly, I've been around enough to know that about 80% (guesstimation) of the time, the money is not necessary for them, it's just a ploy to cadge free money (and no, most of the time they don't pay taxes on it.)

The problem is, even a polite refusal too often elicits a rather aggressive reaction from them and I've often (really!) been glad I've had either my cane or my gun on me. The theory "going around" at the time was that since they closed up so many of the halfway houses and other mental-help facilities, many unstable people were "let loose on the streets." Denver even felt it necessary, after many complaints and other incidents, to write a half-baked "aggressive panhandling" law, and other municipalites have tried to address this actual, real, no-kiddin'-around problem.

If you don't believe me, just take a walk down the Boulder CO Pearl Street Mall sometime, or around the Mission on ~23rd and Arapahoe in Denver around mealtime --an institution to which I have also contributed anonymously, by the way.
</rantish but relevant to the course of discussion>

So, good for you for being generous to the street people, but I refuse to be "bilked" out of loose change or cigarettes for what are too often false premises --even though the threat of violence on refusal is "substantial but not certain."

Terry
 
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I've given money to those in need as well. Usually the down and out type, shopping cart full of junk, wearing a winter jacket and hat in 80 degree weather, sitting on a curb just staring at their feet. All different types, the only similarity between them all?

None of then asked for money. In fact they may not have even needed it, I just gave it to them... Probably just to placate my ego.

Anyways, the techniques used by panhandlers and muggers are probably very similiar, just avoid all together. One thing to remember is that the mugger already has ill intent so the "interview process" may be left out all together and straight to action from an unseen angle.
 
"For me depending on the circumstances I don’t stop moving and I don’t engage, sometimes I don’t even answer but that can be iffy too because it can just escalate things"

It sounds like you have a good handle on these types of people. The way I see it they prey off of people's nice manners. I make it a point to come across as an anti social jerk, but not so disrespectful as to validate retribution. They seems to spot my non-conformity a mile away, only the most inexperienced try to approach me.

I don't have real experience with muggers. But, I would venture to guess their demeanor would likely be a bit more aggressive and paranoid.
 
They are skilled salesmen,,,

The way I see it they prey off of people's nice manners.
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Professional salesmen do this as well,,,
The tactics work so the pan-handlers use them as well.

The only statement that can stop a professional salesman in their tracks is,,,
An unqualified no.

Unqualified means the word no with nothing else added to the statement.

No thank you. means the salesman can "rebut" with,,,
I thank you for your courtesy,,,
So he's still on you.

No, I have no money,,,
His reply is, "Even a quarter would help."

Hey buddy, can I bum a smoke?",,,
No, I don't smoke anymore.",,,
Got any change then?

Hey man can you help me out?
No.

That "No" didn't lead him into a rebuttal,,,
And believe me, salespeople practice their rebuttals,,,
It's what allows us sales types to keep presenting and close the sale again.

The techniques of direct sales, pan-handling, and mugging are identical,,,
In fact this point was brought up in our initial sales classes,,,
Use whatever rebuttal you can think of to gain time.

The only statement that doesn't generate rebuttals,,,
Is an unqualified "No.",,,
Use it.

Aarond

.
 
Assessing how difficult a target is makes sense. A panhandler can move to being a mugger or close to it. Their mentality is probably a mix of the two.

While walking into the store to pay for gas, someone approached me stating he's going to help me. I told him I didn't need help and kept walking.

His demeanor changed to belligerence. I let him rant, staying silent while I kept an eye on him as I went about pumping gas. I believe my body language kept him in check.

It's important to fail these interviews.
 
After reading this thread I think it's safe for me to say that I simply DO NOT feel safe giving ANYTHING to ANY panhandler or anyone asking for money on the street. Not today, in 2014.

People today will do anything for the various hard drugs etc. etc. etc. that has caused some aspects of society to crumble. It is simply no longer safe to do this type of stuff, and any time anyone asks me for money on the street a firm "no" is what I give them. Each and every time.

Quite frankly I consider them a threat and react defensively. It's now become a part of my lifestyle. I wish it weren't this way, I really do, but it's almost impossible to tell friend from foe in some of these situations. JMHO.

YMMV.
 
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