Quantcast

Snakes in Fl

Discussion in 'Hunting' started by cleardiddion, Feb 22, 2010.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Mitch from LA

    Mitch from LA Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    142
    Location:
    Hill Country o' Texas
    You should document the next time you find a Copperhead that is over 5ft long as this would be a record length for the species. You could get a publication out of it. It would be wrong to keep such a meritorious scientific finding to yourself.
     
  2. BBBBill

    BBBBill Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2005
    Messages:
    2,252
    Location:
    Alabama and Florida
    I killed a 7' Timber Rattler on Fort Rucker in 97, so we do grow some pretty large ones in Alabama. That was the biggest I've seen. I really don't want to ever encounter another one. I don't automatically kill snakes when I see them, even poisonous breeds. I only kill them when they are around the house.
     
  3. jimmyraythomason

    jimmyraythomason Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2006
    Messages:
    7,430
    Location:
    Alabama
    There were 3 of them and the largest got away. This was near my ex-father-in-law's chicken houses where there were hundreds of rats for them to feed on. That was 35 years ago and the chicken houses have been gone since the '80s.
     
  4. jimmyraythomason

    jimmyraythomason Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2006
    Messages:
    7,430
    Location:
    Alabama
    I only kill the venomous ones but I kill all of them that I can.
     
  5. SHvar

    SHvar Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    648
    A quick note about sizes of reptiles.
    A good friend of mine and his now ex-wife used to run a reptile rescue, I helped them to teach educational classes about reptiles at colleges, schools, etc.
    Countless times we received calls that we went to pick up thousands of snakes, lizards, crocodilians, turtles, etc. In all but a handful of cases the size of these reptiles was not just slightly, exagerated, but wildly exagerated. Personally being a long time reptile keeper Im not sure how that happens, but the average size iguana we were called to pick up was said to be from 5-7ft, the actual size of the lizard when we got there was actually from 3-4ft at most, snakes (wow the exageration is just as bad), alligators were the worst (owners told you they were 5,6,7,8,9, 10 ft long, the actual animal in all but one case was 2-3 or 4 ft for one).
    I cant imagine how you mistake the sizes, maybe being used to handling a 9ft male alligator, and 7ft female regularly, a 6ft western diamondback, a 6ft cobra, 5ft canebrake, several 2-3ft copperheads, not including hundreds of nonvenous snakes.
    I agree with the common exageration of the 5ft copperhead, heard that one many times, the largest copperheads are around 3ft, a very very few rare examples have ever made it to almost 4ft.
    Lesson one on snake handling, snakes can only strike 1/3rd or less of their body length, so a 3ft snake can only strike 1ft. I have a claw thats 4ft long, its designed to handle king cobras, why the largest venommous snake in the world averages 9-12ft, so a 4ft claw puts you out of reach, if not just out of the longest of their reach.
    Also when I hunted snakes in the south, I killed rattlesnakes, copperheards, water mocs, you name it, and never fired as shot. I simply pinned the head, and either broke the neck, or cut the head off.
    Snakes are very very vulnerable to predators, in fact consider that a snakes entire body is backbone, and ribs, their ribs are soft, almost like soft fish ribs bones, in fact you can easily eat snake ribs when cooked. If a snake sustains a fall of even a few feet from the ground they break one of more ribs which cause problems for them. Consider that they cannot grab you with claws, they cannot scratch you, they have only one weapon, a mouth.
    The primary reason humans fear snakes is the shape which we dont associate with similar animals to us, its a ancient fear, automatic which causes us to see something bigger and worse than it actually is upon first sight. Spiders cause the same automatic reaction to all primates as snakes.
    For reference, heres my little girl at 6ft 9 inches, actually a bit longer than the average female komodo gets in the wild, but not as massive or heavy.
    Picture058.jpg
    If anyone is interested I can find loads ofpictures of other big creepies, and crawlies.
    Just be careful for falling, and drowning hunting invasive snakes in Fla, Id be more worried about alligators.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2010
  6. rswartsell

    rswartsell Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    2,092
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Uhh Huhh,

    Predatory reptiles invariably cause an instinctive reaction to all humans that experience them in the "wild". I have no problem whatsoever in agreeing with overestimation in size. I also think this is a natural reaction to the human perception of threat.

    A 3 ft copperhead can flat ruin your day and I don't for a moment believe the example previously posted was "asleep". Copperheads account for a large majority of venomous snakebite in the US due to their defensive habit of "freezing" as a rabbit will sometimes do and trusting it's camouflage, all the while tensed like a spring to strike. Reptiles are "simple machines" without complex reasoning.

    I think we have as humans instinctive "memory" or programming that cues us when in close proximity to predatory reptiles that great threat is imminent and that 3 footer becomes 5 or even 8. This is not wholly inaccurate as the real ability to do damage is in their volume and nature of venom, not length from nose to tail. Reptiles do not "waste" venom as it is their means of survival. A pit viper will need time to "load" venom either during the process of stalking prey or in response to perceived threat. Catch one truly "asleep" and get an immediate strike and you might get lucky enough to receive little venom or possibly none at all.

    Most begin life with full power venom and rapidly advance to the capability to produce volumes dangerous to humans and the record size specimens are often "old men" fading in their ability to produce large volumes of full strength venom.
     
  7. rswartsell

    rswartsell Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    2,092
    Location:
    North Carolina
    RE: Kingsnakes, a highly beneficial breed, vermin killer friend to humans. Looks way too damn much like Coral Snake (North American Cobra relative with some of the most dangerous venom on the continent). Going back to some hillbilly homilies about how to tell them apart. Reinforced by papaw's hiding me for killing a king snake and thinking I was a hero;

    Red touch yellow, kill a fellow-Red touch black, friend of Jack.
     
  8. jimmyraythomason

    jimmyraythomason Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2006
    Messages:
    7,430
    Location:
    Alabama
    I haven't exagerated anything. Cottonmouths are by far the most common venomous snake(I wont even bother telling you how big I've seen those) here with the Copperhead a close second. When you throw in chicken houses with their unlimited food supply (brown rats)predators can grow big. The two 5' snakes that were in fact measured 57'' and 56-1/2'' another that my dad killed in his feed barn MEASURED 42''(with the head and a couple of inches of body missing from dad's axe). This is why the locals have quit reporting cougar and black bear sighting here because the experts insist that it's not possible for them to be here(and do it in such a way as to incite ridicule to those reporting it). I have seen 3 cougars here myself in the wild (it is up to you whether you believe that or not). BTW,The length of the largest copperhead was in fact estimated but was longer that the largest that was killed.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2010
  9. jimmyraythomason

    jimmyraythomason Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2006
    Messages:
    7,430
    Location:
    Alabama
    Your scepticism is understandable. I am 56 years old and have traversed the hills and hollers of Blount County all of my life and have encountered a miriad of GOD's creatures. I have only seen 3 (those mentioned) copperheads that exceeded 4 feet in length and all 3 were within a half acre of each other . I have seen about <10-12 that actually exceeded 3 feet.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2010
  10. 22-rimfire

    22-rimfire Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2005
    Messages:
    11,749
    Location:
    TN
    I have no idea if the particular copperhead I referred to was truly "asleep" or not. I didn't try to pick it up to see. :) But it was coiled up like a rattlesnake and was so large that I took a minute to look for rattles. It had the body shape of a rattlesnake which is why I looked for rattles. I don't know how long it was as I left it alone. I don't kill poisonous snakes unless they are in my yard which would be a rarity and has never happened. I've never been bitten, but have had them strike at me from time to time and I don't mean strikes that I illicited by messing with them.

    Most copperheads that I have seen are 3 feet or under. A 3 foot copperhead is a large one.

    I've said this before. The only poisonous snake in the US that I truly dislike are water moccasins/cotton mouths.

    When I lived in Texas, you heard stories of big rattlesnakes that stretched from one side of a one lane road to another. That would probably be about a 6 foot snake. Never seen one that big.

    I believe there are cougars (large cats) in the wilds of the South and Southeast. There have been too many sightings for me to dismiss them as being reported by people who see a bobcat and say it was a cougar. Cougars have long tails if nothing else.

    It is very easy to kill a snake. You generally don't need a firearm. My earlier comment was for BIG snakes of the exotic variety. I honestly wouldn't want to get close enough to break its neck if I had a choice.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2010
  11. CoRoMo

    CoRoMo Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2007
    Messages:
    8,953
    Location:
    Californicated Colorado
    Here's a Florida snake for ya:

    I just got this email about the supposed 'record Eastern Diamondback'.
    Truth or BS?

     
  12. Mitch from LA

    Mitch from LA Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    142
    Location:
    Hill Country o' Texas
    Fiction my good man. You can find info that explains the snake is actually 7 ft 3 inches with a quick search.
     
  13. Myles

    Myles Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2007
    Messages:
    302
    Location:
    Western NC
    I have seen some big critters, and once measured a 14 foot alligator. He was huge - the head was in proportion and downright scary. I've seen cougars in both Florida and North Carolina, even though Game and Wildlife claim it's not possible.

    However, I was taught to take a claim of any animals size/weight/length with a grain of salt. Take the number, cut it in half, and add a 1, and it's generally closer to the truth.
     
  14. Mitch from LA

    Mitch from LA Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    142
    Location:
    Hill Country o' Texas
    I'm surprised someone in position of authority told you that it is impossible for cougars to live in Florida, as it is home to the Florida Panther Puma concolor coryi a highly endangered subspecies of Cougar (aka: Puma, Mountain Lion, Catamount). Unlikely perhaps, but certainly not impossible. Impossi There has been a big debate in recent years about whether or not it is ethical to shore up numbers of declining Florida Panthers by breeding them with Western subspecies.
     
  15. jimmyraythomason

    jimmyraythomason Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2006
    Messages:
    7,430
    Location:
    Alabama
    What I don't understand is why the FWS are SO adamant about it. What is it to them that they keep denying the existance (in a particular location)of an animal that so many people have seen?
     
  16. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2007
    Messages:
    59,076
    Location:
    Eastern KS
    Kansas F&G is doing the same thing, despite several confirmed sightings, game cam photo's, and even a road kill or two in the Kansas City Kansas I-470 loop.

    Rumor has it, F&G imported some cougars from Colorado several years ago to help control out-of-control deer populations around the more metro, eastern part of the state.

    Now, they don't want to own up to it if a cougar eats little Fido, or a jogger.

    My hunting pard saw one north of Tonganoxie KS about a month ago.
    And if he says he saw one, he saw one.

    rc
     
  17. Zip7

    Zip7 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    390
    Location:
    The South
    Snake Length - I killed a cottonmouth with a stick once that we measured at 48" long. I would have guessed more if I hadn't hauled him out of the woods and measured him. He was one of the biggest I've seen in the wild. I shot one off a log another time that I thought might have been longer, but he went in the water and we didn't pick him up.
     
  18. FenderTK421

    FenderTK421 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2009
    Messages:
    205
    Location:
    Alaska
    +1 to taking a buddy. If a truly giant boid were to actually get a hold of you, your odds aren't very good if your alone.
     
  19. Art Eatman

    Art Eatman Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2002
    Messages:
    46,364
    Location:
    Terlingua, TX; Thomasville,GA
    We're a tad loose about thread drift, here, but this has drifted too far out to sea...
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice