Squib Load?

[Panzerschwein]

It seems quite a few people overuse the term "squib load" when referring to any number of various ammunition problems.

To me, a "squib load" is a dangerous problem were a cartridge misfires but produces just enough energy to lodge the bullet in the barrel of the firearm. This can cause a bore obstruction and can be very bad if a second round is fired behind it.

I've read numerous reviews for ammunition, and many people will say things like "I had five squid loads in one box" or "I was getting a squib load after every other round" when their gun is acting up (light strikes etc) or they are shooting ammunition that has bad primers or produces hang fires etc.

I think some hear the catchy term "squib load" and just imagine it as any kind of misfire, not the one that I first described above.

So what is the proper term to use? Is a "squib load" indeed just a generic term for a misfire, or is it specific to the "stuck in the bore" type problem?

 

[kitsapshooter]

Squib is as you said, stuck in the bore at some point due to insufficient power. Everything else is lazy people who don't care enough to be correct in their spoken language.

 

[Jim Watson]

I am older. To me a "squib load" is one loaded for minimum noise and recoil for short range target shooting. Its Internet Mutation into a term for a negligently powderless load resulting in a stuck bullet is annoying.

 

[MARKMALL]

The NRA definition is: A squib load occurs when cartridge develops less than normal pressure or velocity after ignition. It can cause a bullet to lodge in the barrel. It can still be a squib load and clear the barrel.

 

[Archie]

Another example of language changing. Like Mr. Watson, I have a few years and remember when the term 'squib load' referred to a lightly loaded round - usually rifle round - used for practice without the recoil and muzzle blast of a full charge load.

Over time - forty or fifty years - the idea of 'lightly loaded' still remains, but now it's an unintentional loading which leaves the bullet in the barrel.

Someone using the term to describe a light primer strike or a non-functioning primer is not what I understand a 'squib' to be in any case. As Kitsapshooter mentioned, some folks are just too lazy to learn proper nomenclature or description.

It happens in all forms of disciplines.

 

[bayou5252]

This is not "legal" or "official", it's just my understanding of the terms, and how I've used them:

Squib = insufficient ignition to propel the projectile clear of the barrel

Hangfire = an unexpected and delayed ignition of propellant

Misfire = no ignition of propellant resulting in a failure to discharge the projectile from the case

 

[Jim Watson]

Well, Archie, we are outnumbered. A "squib" has become a stuck bullet usually due to inadequate QC. But we will always be reminded of the difference between "clip" and "magazine" at every pass.

 

[H&R Glock]

Bayou, you are correct in your definitions of the terms.
What makes me sick is to hear television and radio news people describe a shooting as a misfire. As an example: "An innocent southside girl was killed today due to a firearm misfire.......etc"

I can almost visualize the correct news item as being thus: "An innocent southside girl was killed today due to some idiot playing with a gun....etc."

I'd rather hear correct news or no news at all. It just shows the ignorance of media people to listen to them.

 

[DaisyCutter]

Internet firearms education, LOL.


One thing, I'm curious about is I used to always hear horror stories about squib loads occuring in competition, while shooting reloads, where a gun is damaged or shooter injured. Horror stories where other shooters are screaming "CEASE FIRE" so stop the shooter from chasing a squib with a full power cartridge.

I sometimes shoot competition.
I reload.
A lot of shooters reload.
I've found the lower pressure threshold where my autos tend to not cycle fully, and the projectile still had ample energy to clear the barrel.

I've seen guns jam from improperly resized ammo. I've heard a shooters report change from inconsistent powder charges. But I've never seen a squib, where the gun still managed to cycle, and the next round impacted a round still lodged in the barrel.

I used to dread this. But I honestly wonder whether most autoloading pistols are capable of cycling if the spent cartridge didn't even have the necessary *pop* to drive the bullet clear of the barrel.

Out of intense curiousity, I deliberately loaded a 44 Mag on top of a primer, without powder, and tried it. The bullet stopped at the forcing cone, which locked the cylinder, making it impossible to fire another until I rammed the bullet back into the cylinder, clear of the forcing cone. It probably wasn't wise, but it was a controlled experiment, and I presumed it couldn't damage my big Ruger. Plus, I wanted to know what would happen if I encountered a cartridge with no powder charge, so I could recognize it if it happened later. I don't endorse my test for anyone else, but I'm highly experienced stupid and was darned curious.

So my preliminary conclusion is that a squib that results in a bore obstruction AND yet either (1) completely cycles an autoloader or (2) gets past the forcing cone of a revolver, is a very narrow window of undercharge, if it's even possible. If a squib, it'll likely result in a stoppage. Maybe I'm wrong, it's not like my test was extensive.

Regardless, I'm highly meticulous with my handloads, and I've never had anything unanticipated occur.

 

[macgrumpy]

Well, Archie, we are outnumbered. A "squib" has become a stuck bullet usually due to inadequate QC. But we will always be reminded of the difference between "clip" and "magazine" at every pass.

The definition hasn't changed, you guys are the ones that were misinformed, even the NRA defines a squib as a light load that causes the bullet to stick in the bore. Since you call a light load in which the bullet clears the bore a Squib what would you call a light load in which the bullet doesn't clear the bore - a squib minus?

I've loaded since the 1960s and I was taught that a squib was a light load that allowed the bullet to stop in the bore.

 

[Jim Watson]

Daisycutter:

A misload that will stick a bullet AND cycle the slide of an automatic is extremely rare. The usual bad case scenario is a bullet that gets far enough down the barrel to allow the next round to be chambered by "immediate action" under time stress. If the range officer does not stop the shooter in time, a bulged or burst barrel results.

A revolver bullet stuck across the cylinder gap is a great aggravation, but is not going to cause any damage. But if it makes it down the barrel a ways, a bulged barrel is only a trigger squeeze away.

I have seen both.
I once saw a PPC shooter stick a wadcutter, knock it out of the barrel and finish the string of fire. I think it was during Match 2, 18 shots in 90 seconds at 25 yards.


macgrumpy

I did not start reloading until 1969, but my reading goes back further. I rely on Henry Stebbins, whose day job was English professor, for his discussion of squib loads in 1960.

 

[straightshooterjake]

I am an NRA instructor and I have just reviewed a recent Basic Pistol instruction booklet. MARKMALL is correct about the definition currently used in NRA courses. A squib has less noise or velocity than normal, and it MAY stick in the barrel.

Macgrumpy is also correct in pointing out that the best link on an NRA related website does not use the definition above. Oh well.

The current course teaching is that if the round sounds too quiet or feels too weak then it is considered a squib. At that point you must use safe procedures to check the barrel for obstructions.

 

[macgrumpy]

macgrumpy

I did not start reloading until 1969, but my reading goes back further. I rely on Henry Stebbins, whose day job was English professor, for his discussion of squib loads in 1960.

I don't understand how referring to an English Professor in a firearms matter is supposed to prove anything, it seems to me that referring to a firearms expert would make more sense.

For the people that think a squib is just a low powered load I would like to know what words you use to discriminate between a low powered load that pushes the bullet out of the bore vs a low powered load that leaves the bullet in the bore.

If a squib is defined as a low powered load that leaves the bullet in the bore and a light load is a low powered load that pushes the bullet out of the bore, then it becomes easier to understand what someone means when they discuss their cartrdge load. If you use squib to describe either kind of load then the conversation becomes more vague.

 

[Jim Watson]

For the people that think a squib is just a low powered load I would like to know what words you use to discriminate between a low powered load that pushes the bullet out of the bore vs a low powered load that leaves the bullet in the bore.

I say "stuck bullet."

The NRA now has to deal with the lowest common denominator in legal firearms ownership. I concede that a single word none of them has heard of before probably serves the purpose better.

Oh, by the way, a squib is also the little powder charge a special effects man uses to fake bullet impact. Or used to, before pervasive cgi.