Standard Pressure, Heavy .45 Colt Question

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I have a batch of .45 Colt range brass I do testing with, and will load a couple of things up before the weekend, and shoot them over the chrono then.
 
If you need the Trail Boss, let me know. I have to go to Montgomery tomorrow for work. Looks like I have 9 oz.
 
My 45 favorite bullet is the MBC 255 Keith style. 18.0 gr 4227 or 9.0 gr. 800-X.
As for heavy bullets for SAA, John Taffin does not go past 260 gr. Good advice, IMO.
http://www.sixguns.com/tests/tt45lc.htm
Step up to Blackhawk loads and John shows several for bullets over 300 gr. Most use H-110 or N-110, clocking north of 1,100 fps.
 
Walkalong said:
Yea, saw that, but it is slow and I wonder if it will burn well in that application, since I have tried it in other similar apps at higher pressure. Years ago I ha a stout .44 Spl load using a cast 240 Gr, but wouldn't shoot many of them figuring they were a bit stout and stopped doing it, plus it left some unburned kernels.

Might be the cats meow though, I have that on the back burner.
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I know, this is an apples to oranges comparison but I think it is something to explore.

I have a 1890's vintage 32-20 Model 1873 rifle and have fiddled with some loads with accurate 5744. I got some promising results. But I needed to make some repairs to the tubular magazine and I have not gotten back to experimenting since I fixed the magazine.
 
WrongHanded said:
2400 isn't a bad place to start, given the criteria. With a heavy for caliber bullet, it might burn better than expected, and it's a pretty forgiving powder. Where to start is the question.

If it were me, and I had a strong enough gun to test it, I'd try 12gr of 2400 under the 320gr bullet and see how it shoots.
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If I were to try and accomplish what the OP wants, I'd probably start with the starting load of 2400 and walk it down until I got the power level I wanted or encountered accuracy issues.
 
Walkalong said:
Good points, but yes I will go to the trouble, and he will appreciate whatever I come up with. I too had the thought....why...but am willing to try it.

I have a 265 Gr LSWC load with True Blue that shoots very well, but is over 14K a little bit. That pressure limit is going to make it more difficult with heavies, no doubt.
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I agree, the caveats of heavy with standard pressure is the problem. The lack of any published loading info for anything even close is telling.

JShirley said:
I have lots and lots of heavy .45 Colt and actual .454 loaded cartridges ready to go for my BFR. I want some standard pressure loads for my Model 25 4".


John bought loading components worth hundreds of dollars towards the end of his last deployment, but never got around to loading them, and it's been 8 years. John now has a great work opportunity but it will involve a move out of state...so John gave all of the loading components he had (less a couple oddball calibers) to his closest good friend who reloads. That friend offered to help a buddy out, because he's a good guy. Does John "need" a standard-pressure .45 Colt with a heavy bullet? Probably not. But it would be pretty cool. :)



John
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Thanks for the explanation John and thank you much for your service. Yes, Walkalong is a good friend to give it a try. Still, even tho the components are "worth hundreds of dollars", don't mean they will be worth a hoot withing the parameters you want him to work with. As I've said twice now, the lack of any real legitimate published load recipes is obvious an it's not because folks do not load heavy and slow for .45 colt or that it is not handloaded very much. I'm thinkin' as long as .45 Colt has been around and the amount of folks loading it, something similar to what you are attempting has been attempted before. I wish both of you luck with the endeavor, but as always IMHO, using good powder and primers in the attempt to throw inappropriate bullets downrange in a manner than has no purpose or accuracy is just making noise. I hope that isn't the outcome here.
 
I agree the published no 5 300 L load data posted looks like what you are after with a 7.8 MAX at 13212 and 818 FPS. You should be able to test speeds with a 7 gr load and work up to get to 750-775 FPS with a little heavier lead very safely. Seems like 7.4 should do the trick?

If Walkalong would make my loads then I could sell all my equipment! LOL I can't crimp as cleanly/precisely as he does, but I'm still trying.
 
murf said:
here's an article that gives loads/pressures for heavy bullets: https://www.johnlinebaughcustomsixguns.com/writings/dissolving_the_myth.htm

john linebaugh is, by far, the best source of info when it comes to heavy bullets in the 45 colt.

/
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That entire article is about what can be done with extra strong Ruger actions. I have hundreds of 260-grain .45 Colt HPs at 1200 fps, and at least 200 .454 loaded rounds for my BFR: I need Colt loads close to SAA strength for my S&W.
 
buck460XVR said:
The lack of any published loading info for anything even close is telling.
.... As I've said twice now, the lack of any real legitimate published load recipes is obvious an it's not because folks do not load heavy and slow for .45 colt or that it is not handloaded very much. .
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Respectfully, there was a standard pressure load 75 grains heavier than I'd like to be able to use published in this thread. No matter how many times you've said it.
 
gotboostvr said:
Being that it's being shot in a 454, I'd just pick any Ruger only 45 Colt data to work down from. I'd grab my lyman #49 and quote it, but it's out in the garage.
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I've looked through the my copies of Lyman 50th, the 4th Edit. Cast book and didn't see any data that would fit. Perhaps they chose not to include it. Or maybe I'm looking in the wrong place. Either way, I'd be interested in what the 49th has if you find the time to post it.

And I do agree, that if there is such data available, working down from a starting charge would be preferable.
 
gotboostvr said:
The Original Poster said they'd be shot in a 454, my concern with a M25 is can you even fit the heavies in the short N frame cylinder?
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There was some confusion there, but they are definitely for a Model 25.

... That's a valid concern.
 
JShirley said:
There was some confusion there, but they are definitely for a Model 25.

... That's a valid concern.
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Just a quick look tells me it's gonna be a tight fit. Buffalo Bore 300gr ammo is 1.69" and the N frame cylinder is 1.71". Using standard pressure loads and a good firm roll crimp you shouldn't get much bullet jump.

I'd inquire about OAL from the bullet manufacturer before investing in a few hundred to make sure they'll fit.
 
gotboostvr said:
The Original Poster said they'd be shot in a 454, my concern with a M25 is can you even fit the heavies in the short N frame cylinder?
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Yep, I assumed it was for his .454, my mistake.

I load 99% standard pressure .45 Colt for my 25-5.

Have long since sold my Blackhawk .45 Colt.
 
In that case, I think a bulky, fast powder would be best. Then starting low and working up. Something like Reddot.

Not a whole lot of data out there though unfortunately.

I don't know if someone with Quickload software would want to help with a starting point.
 
JShirley said:
Respectfully, there was a standard pressure load 75 grains heavier than I'd like to be able to use published in this thread. No matter how many times you've said it.
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You are correct sir........with all of us, looking at all our multiple sources( I have 6 load manuals beside me now, including the one with the aforementioned recipe. I'm sure Walkalong has more than me, then there's all the rest that have viewed this thread) we have come up with one published load of a significantly heavy for caliber bullet loaded to standard .45 Colt pressures. One. And that was not one of the three projectiles you are looking to have loaded. Respectfully, IMHO, that is the definition of "lack of published loads". Completely lacking information would mean no information. Lacking information would mean deficient and inadequate. Again, to me, this is telling.

Ain't trying to be a jerk or condescending, just realistic. Not trying to say one can't load those bullets to standard .45 Colt pressure, just questioning if it is worth the attempt, and if the powder, primers and time used to create it, is being used wisely. I truly hope Walkalong will prove me wrong. The M25 is a classic firearm deserving of classic ammo to keep it in classic condition. Again, JMHO.
 
Brian Pearce's article in April-May 2007 issue of Handloader shows a 14k psi list of loads for a 285 grain lead, from which I think some intelligent extrapolation could be taken as starting points. For example, he shows 8.0 gr Unique at 924 fps, all loads developed to achieve 14k psi (max), but he does not say how that was measured or calculated. Another load is a powder I like better for pushing to the edge, Power Pistol, also at 8.0 grains for that bullet, running at 915 fps.
 
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