CapnMac
Member
And, yet, they still have "gun crime" somehow . . .
None so blind as those who will not see.
Still Yet Another "I Argued With An Anti" Thread
- Thread starter jakemccoy
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None so blind as those who will not see.
Deanimator
Member
Whenever this drivel comes up in discussions of women's self-defense against rape, I ALWAYS say, "Here's a news flash: Xena, Warrior Princess was NOT a documentary."
Most 110lb woman vs. 210lb man encounters end like the Officer Tony Abbate vs. Karolyna Obrycka bout seen on YouTube by most of the world. I've said and truly believe that some of these curs don't mind if a woman defends herself against a rapist, so long as she's ultimately defeated, and is seriously injured in the process. More than a couple of them appear to consider a savage beating "foreplay".
Years ago in usenet, there was an Englishman who was very aggressively vocal about how women shouldn't be allowed to carry guns because he was "afraid that he'd be mistaken for a rapist and shot". My next words to him were, "How is it that you typically act around women that you expect to be 'mistaken' for a rapist? I suggest that you put down that butcher knife, pull you your pants and go home. You'll be just fine." And yes, there are more than a few degenerate beasts who say that a woman should let herself be raped rather than seriously harm a rapist. I derive a special satisfaction from publicly humiliating filthy wretches like that.
sm
member
Antis.
Sometimes I gotta wonder if Anti's are not wired more "wrong" than criminals.
Being honest, I would rather listen and learn from a criminal, than a Anti. In fact I have learned some valuable street tips from ex cons, and other criminals.
Did I ever share about the time I was with a ex con, and this anti fella is mouthing off about "anything mini is bad..."
Ex con pointed to some good looking young babes in mini-skirts, grinned, and then when the light stopped traffic, we crossed the street, leaving the anti just standing there looking like an idiot.
Sometimes I gotta wonder if Anti's are not wired more "wrong" than criminals.
Being honest, I would rather listen and learn from a criminal, than a Anti. In fact I have learned some valuable street tips from ex cons, and other criminals.
Did I ever share about the time I was with a ex con, and this anti fella is mouthing off about "anything mini is bad..."
Ex con pointed to some good looking young babes in mini-skirts, grinned, and then when the light stopped traffic, we crossed the street, leaving the anti just standing there looking like an idiot.
When I argue with antis, I usually approach the issue from the other direction. "Suppose all guns were banned, and everybody actually does turn them in, now the strong and vicious people will rule society."
Or something along those lines. The point being that guns are the only things that allow the weak to be on equal footing with the strong.
Or something along those lines. The point being that guns are the only things that allow the weak to be on equal footing with the strong.
RDCL
Member
I always try to avoid arguing with the anti-gun folks, but if pressed I will. I also feel kind of sorry for them in that the world of guns & the shooting sports presents a joy and fascination they will never know or understand.
I'll usually state that a gun.....any gun (even LOADED)....is a harmless piece of steel until a human being picks it up.
I've always been sick & tired of their use of the word "need".....as in: "Why do you NEED a gun"? I'd respond that "need" has nothing to do with it!
"....I WANT a gun and thats all you NEED to know about it" Same thing with full-auto.....hell no I don't NEED full-auto.....but I WANT it.
With the current state of anti-gun rhetoric, and where we are going....it is truley sad. Somewhere in the wild a bald eagle weeps real tears for us.
Yeah, yeah.....corny, but I believe it.
Russ
I'll usually state that a gun.....any gun (even LOADED)....is a harmless piece of steel until a human being picks it up.
I've always been sick & tired of their use of the word "need".....as in: "Why do you NEED a gun"? I'd respond that "need" has nothing to do with it!
"....I WANT a gun and thats all you NEED to know about it" Same thing with full-auto.....hell no I don't NEED full-auto.....but I WANT it.
With the current state of anti-gun rhetoric, and where we are going....it is truley sad. Somewhere in the wild a bald eagle weeps real tears for us.
Yeah, yeah.....corny, but I believe it.
Russ
rojocorsa
Member
I do not get chances to argue that much. Only time I did was when I talked to some lady who believed the myth of Glocks being undetectable in metal detectors. She believed it because she said she had read it in an article written by some laudable journalist.
Everything ended when I informed her that all glocks have steel slides, barrels, internal parts, etc.
Everything ended when I informed her that all glocks have steel slides, barrels, internal parts, etc.
Rocksurly
Member
I love using this quote on them
"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."
Sigmund Freud, General Introduction to Psychoanalysis (1952)
"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."
Sigmund Freud, General Introduction to Psychoanalysis (1952)
Eustachius234
Member
Just leave the left coast & avoid the North East, and you'll run into a lot less weenies ...
Duke of Doubt
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RDCL: "I've always been sick & tired of their use of the word "need".....as in: "Why do you NEED a gun"? I'd respond that "need" has nothing to do with it!"
Intellectually I'd agree. But I finally got tired of making that case. About fifteen years ago, I had had enough. When a nice but socialist friend started in on the need versus greed thing, I announced, a little menacingly, that I needed a yacht. He started trying to answer that I didn't really "need" a yacht, but all your normally longwinded correspondent did was repeat, "I need a yacht," in a vaguely intimidating tone. A little light bulb finally went incandescent over his cranium, and he never used or, I believe, thought in terms of "need" again.
Intellectually I'd agree. But I finally got tired of making that case. About fifteen years ago, I had had enough. When a nice but socialist friend started in on the need versus greed thing, I announced, a little menacingly, that I needed a yacht. He started trying to answer that I didn't really "need" a yacht, but all your normally longwinded correspondent did was repeat, "I need a yacht," in a vaguely intimidating tone. A little light bulb finally went incandescent over his cranium, and he never used or, I believe, thought in terms of "need" again.
A broadhead arrow from a 75 pound-pull bow has more stopping power than a .308.
Anyone can make a shepherd's sling http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sling_(weapon) , and Wikipedia reports that they are still being used in the 3rd world, where people don't have access to guns.
Anyone can make a shepherd's sling http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sling_(weapon) , and Wikipedia reports that they are still being used in the 3rd world, where people don't have access to guns.
This has worked for me in the past. Probation of any type has never worked in this country. When Americans are told they can't they will to prove they can. By doing this do we not create more criminals, that were once honest, with guns. Even if all guns are gone will criminals not use something else? A gun helps honest people defend themselves against someone that is stronger or the many that intend to do harm.
Because people infected with the make it a "perfect world" and "moral superiority" mindset are simply impossible.
I accepted that line for a good portion of my life and guess what? The world doesn't work that way. Never has. Never will. I accept that. And conduct myself accordingly with capability and restraint and some serious firepower.
I accepted that line for a good portion of my life and guess what? The world doesn't work that way. Never has. Never will. I accept that. And conduct myself accordingly with capability and restraint and some serious firepower.
Anti GUN talk...
This TO ME, is simply a case of it being impossible to legislate values and morality INTO criminals as well as impossible to legislate guns out of the hands of criminals.
The fact is that any gun control law will only be obeyed by law abiding citizens and NOT criminals. The thugs are not walking into a gun shop, filling out the paperwork and buying the firearm legally and legitimately. So making it impossible or illegal for law abiding citizens to do so takes the firearm out of their hands and does nothing to keep it out of the criminals hands. If legitimate firearms totally vanished, which is an impossibility. Criminals would make zip guns! So then the ammo would need to be banned. In fact certain criminal elements are noted for using "ball peen hammers" to inflict terror and kill their opponents. So let's ban all ball peen hammers! And didn't Al Capone use a baseball bat to kill one of his foes?? Well let's ban baseball bats...
This TO ME, is simply a case of it being impossible to legislate values and morality INTO criminals as well as impossible to legislate guns out of the hands of criminals.
The fact is that any gun control law will only be obeyed by law abiding citizens and NOT criminals. The thugs are not walking into a gun shop, filling out the paperwork and buying the firearm legally and legitimately. So making it impossible or illegal for law abiding citizens to do so takes the firearm out of their hands and does nothing to keep it out of the criminals hands. If legitimate firearms totally vanished, which is an impossibility. Criminals would make zip guns! So then the ammo would need to be banned. In fact certain criminal elements are noted for using "ball peen hammers" to inflict terror and kill their opponents. So let's ban all ball peen hammers! And didn't Al Capone use a baseball bat to kill one of his foes?? Well let's ban baseball bats...
KarenTOC
Member
I think some anti reasoning goes this way:
"Yes, criminals will always have guns. There's nothing we can do about that. But, if guns are banned, then the millions of law-abiding folks who die each year in gun cleaning accidents, and domestic disputes, and heat-of-passion arguments and negligent discharges will be saved. If one child's life is saved because he didn't play with his daddy's gun, then it will be worth it."
The idea that criminals will still have guns isn't the issue.
ps: I bought into that for years.
"Yes, criminals will always have guns. There's nothing we can do about that. But, if guns are banned, then the millions of law-abiding folks who die each year in gun cleaning accidents, and domestic disputes, and heat-of-passion arguments and negligent discharges will be saved. If one child's life is saved because he didn't play with his daddy's gun, then it will be worth it."
The idea that criminals will still have guns isn't the issue.
ps: I bought into that for years.
i think antis, deep down, just want less violence, gun crime and death, but don't know any other way to get that done besides making gun laws.
without thinking, they just think, hey ban this type of gun, and we are that much safer. put it to a vote saying, " hey you want to protect your kids from guns?" of course you do...so blindly people will vote with their hearts and not minds.
i do have a problem when the antis bring up school shooting scenerios though. a kid, who normally would not have access to gun, and would not have the ability or means to go out seeking illegal guns, or making them on their own, and wouldn't try using a weapon like a knife or club...take their parents legal guns and use them for evil.
of course they want to stop this from happening, we all do. but logically there is no law that can be passed to prevent this. the only thing (which would be crazy) would be to have some kind of gun owner inspection to see how you keep your arms stored. locked and unloaded at all times, except for the one "emergency" type gun with some kind of quck release lock, fingerprint type lock so you could open it in an emergency. any gun owner failing these suprise inspection would be heavily fined etc.
please don't pick apart my agument, because i myself could do it. i know the flaws to my "crazy" plan above.
rather i put it to you, the gun supporters....are there any gun laws or ways to prevent this type of action? i think, at its core is to identify the type of PERSON or CHILD that would steal the gun and use it for evil. the problem with that is you get the recent scenerio of the teacher calling the cops on the kid writing the pro gun essay in college:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,504524,00.html
so what do you think? any ideas?
without thinking, they just think, hey ban this type of gun, and we are that much safer. put it to a vote saying, " hey you want to protect your kids from guns?" of course you do...so blindly people will vote with their hearts and not minds.
i do have a problem when the antis bring up school shooting scenerios though. a kid, who normally would not have access to gun, and would not have the ability or means to go out seeking illegal guns, or making them on their own, and wouldn't try using a weapon like a knife or club...take their parents legal guns and use them for evil.
of course they want to stop this from happening, we all do. but logically there is no law that can be passed to prevent this. the only thing (which would be crazy) would be to have some kind of gun owner inspection to see how you keep your arms stored. locked and unloaded at all times, except for the one "emergency" type gun with some kind of quck release lock, fingerprint type lock so you could open it in an emergency. any gun owner failing these suprise inspection would be heavily fined etc.
please don't pick apart my agument, because i myself could do it. i know the flaws to my "crazy" plan above.
rather i put it to you, the gun supporters....are there any gun laws or ways to prevent this type of action? i think, at its core is to identify the type of PERSON or CHILD that would steal the gun and use it for evil. the problem with that is you get the recent scenerio of the teacher calling the cops on the kid writing the pro gun essay in college:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,504524,00.html
so what do you think? any ideas?
Superlite27
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- Nov 29, 2007
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- 712
Hmmmm. Yeah, I guess you people are right. I have always believed that the Second Amendment was worth fighting and dying for. However, there aren't too many everyday opportunities for me to risk life and limb in defense of this noble idea. So I've always said to myself, "Self...since I work a 40 hour week, there isn't really much time for me to be as active in support of the 2A as I would like, so the least I can do is to make some small attempt to change the minds of those who oppose it whenever the chance arises."
I always thought the tinyest little sacrifice was still a worthy thing, no matter how small. I've never felt that my attempts to persuade those opposed to firearms freedom were a waste of time, because I don't think anything done in the name of freedom is ever a waste of time.
But you have all convinced me. I guess you're right. Actually taking a stand and attempting to show people the truth is "useless". As a matter of fact, pointing out the futility of arguing in support of the Second Amendment to those who would hasten its demise has convinced me. I will no longer participate in using my voice to defend the Second Amendment against those who would do it harm. You have all convinced me of its pointlessness.
KarenTOC
Member
I think the OP was talking about useless arguing with a close-minded anti. Debate and discussion are totally different, and definitely not pointless. Please, continue to debate and discuss. We all should.
Baba Louie
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- 3,831
Old saying... "For some, no explanation is required. For others, no explanation will suffice."
Jeff Cooper's quote, "An unarmed man can only flee from evil and evil is not overcome by running from it" (or words to that effect) comes to mind also.
One can point to the UK where now, knives are on the chopping block (as it were) once guns were eliminated from the law abiding.
Utopian, starry eyed, ivory towered sycophants will continue to believe what they feel is best, is best for all. The (false) assumption that if one is nice to people they will always be nice to you. I am reminded of John Lennon (Imagine), he who was killed by an obsessive and deranged fan (short for fanatic), an incident as loaded w/ tragic irony as is his song Come Together, with its whispered "shoot me" lurking in the background. (how prophetic)
Pragmatic realists see the world a bit differently perhaps. Smiling at everyone they meet, listening to their very interesting discourse, acknowledging when they are right, knowing full well that one is prepared and equipped to... deal with whatever evil comes your way, and they, perhaps less so.
C'est la Vie. No?
Jeff Cooper's quote, "An unarmed man can only flee from evil and evil is not overcome by running from it" (or words to that effect) comes to mind also.
One can point to the UK where now, knives are on the chopping block (as it were) once guns were eliminated from the law abiding.
Utopian, starry eyed, ivory towered sycophants will continue to believe what they feel is best, is best for all. The (false) assumption that if one is nice to people they will always be nice to you. I am reminded of John Lennon (Imagine), he who was killed by an obsessive and deranged fan (short for fanatic), an incident as loaded w/ tragic irony as is his song Come Together, with its whispered "shoot me" lurking in the background. (how prophetic)
Pragmatic realists see the world a bit differently perhaps. Smiling at everyone they meet, listening to their very interesting discourse, acknowledging when they are right, knowing full well that one is prepared and equipped to... deal with whatever evil comes your way, and they, perhaps less so.
C'est la Vie. No?
jakemccoy
Member
Hi Superlite,
Check out my Youtube channel below to get a sense of how I'm spending my free time more productively.
Instead of arguing, I'm inviting people to browse my Youtube channel.
People are more likely to accept information if I step back and allow them to digest information comfortably on their own.
Regards,
-Jake
Check out my Youtube channel below to get a sense of how I'm spending my free time more productively.
Instead of arguing, I'm inviting people to browse my Youtube channel.
People are more likely to accept information if I step back and allow them to digest information comfortably on their own.
Regards,
-Jake
flyboy1788
Member
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- Oct 31, 2008
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- 317
I find it ironic that all of these "educated" individuals are the ones who most lack common sense.
Triphammer
Member
Quote"rather i put it to you, the gun supporters....are there any gun laws or ways to prevent this type of action?"
Maybe we could make it illegal to murder, injure or cause mayhem?
Maybe we could make it illegal to murder, injure or cause mayhem?
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