Teens lucky BB gun victim didn't shoot back.

[S&W620]

Noxx, I think you are spot on my friend.

This is an issue that parents would have handled 30 years ago with some good, old fashioned "leather love".

As far as your point about boys needing physical punishment to "get the message", I recently had this conversation with female friend with children and said the exact same thing. Most, and I say most because there are a few boys who respond to simply verbal actions, need to be put in their place from time to time during adolescence.

 

[Gord]

Sharing a prison cell with 40 year old felon with multiple convictions over the course of 20 years? No.

While the pros and cons are debatable, I certainly know that getting to spend a weekend with a creepy, smelly, hobo-looking old loser who'd tell me stories about being in and out of prison since he was 20 would set me straight pretty damn quick.

I don't see juvie as "real" time - it's probably by and large a bunch of teens just like them, who think they're invincible and worship the thug life. It might end up doing more harm than good if they get their heads filled with ideas from other, nastier people their own age.

 

[v35]

v35, where have I said that the kids aren't responsible or shouldn't be held responsible for their actions?

You didn't. That's why I said your arguments "seem to advocate" that fact.

We seem to agree punishment is in order, but I'm unwilling to absolve them of any responsibility due to their tender young ages. I'm just as unwilling to absolve their parents of responsibility for their evident failure to socialize their children. They learned this behavior somewhere, and it should have been corrected years ago. If it's not corrected now, in years hence it will only become more difficult.

 

[Samuraigg]

14 and 15 is more than old enough to know right from wrong. Charge them the same as if they were adults. This man could have suffered SERIOUS damage because of these guys.

You know what's really terrible about this story? I know antis will read it and say "See its a good thing the man wasn't carrying his gun, there would be two dead teenagers right now if he was. Guns only serve to escalate the situation etc etc." And whats frustrating is I can't really think of anything to refute that first point. If the attorney was carrying his gun, I bet that kid would be dead.

 

[jerkyman45]

These idiots knew what they were doing was wrong and against the law, or else they wouldn't have ran and the BB guns. They should be punished severely, they committed a crime. They are criminals and should be treated as such.

 

[frank23185]

A 15 year old who has just maliciously shot someone with a projectile weapon, has ceased to be a "kid", and is now a combatant. He is lucky to be alive. Time to pay the piper.

 

[Mannix]

These kids did something VERY STUPID, which very easily could have ended up with them being some of the youngest recipients of the Darwin award, and they need to be held responsible for it. All of us should be able to agree about that. This debate is over what is the proper amount of punishment for a 14 year old in this situation. My personal view is that they need some community service, and a good 'ol fashioned parentally administered butt whoppin'.

The kids did something stupid, something they KNEW was wrong, and some punishment is in order, but I just can't see throwing kids in "grown up" jail where they'd have no hope of getting out in one piece without becoming a SERIOUS danger to society. On the other hand, they need to be corrected and shown that this type of behavior comes with (painful and humiliating) consequences.

 

[cpttango30]

Why on earth should the parents be prosecuted? Because they bought the kid a BB gun?

#1. They offered up a firearm with out any hint of training for these two.
#2. They allowed the punks to have unfettered access to a firearm without adult supervision.
#3. They did not teach there kid right or wrong.

It is not that hard "Shoot at a target = good" or "Shoot at human = bad" Like another post it is so simple a caveman can do it.

They are lucky to have meet a CCW holder that did not have his gun on him. Or this could have turned out very bad for all parties.

 

[cnorman18]

the smirks are key

My father never hit me while I was growing up; he didn't have to. He told me he would if I screwed up, and I believed him.

I was raised on the
4 Rules, and if I had done this--well, I'd have been in less trouble if I'd slapped my mother.

In any case, I was a middle-school teacher for 26 years, and I can guar-an-dam-tee you one thing; the reason these kids did this in the first place is that they've never been significantly punished for anything before.

The smirks tell the story. The smirks say, "We know we're doing wrong, but we don't care; it's fun and nothing is going to happen to us, because nothing ever has." if they ever HAD been punished for anything, they wouldn't have been wearing smirks; they would have had that wide-eyed, "Uh-oh, we're in trouble" look.

I promise you; give them a good stern talking-to from a judge and a few hours of community service, and they'll leave that courtroom with the same smirks they walked in with.

"Harsh"? Oh, yes. Their punishment SHOULD be "harsh", because they need to LEARN something--and that something is FEAR, fear of the consequences of irresponsible and evil actions. If you pat them on the head and let them off with, essentially, nothing, you're not doing them any favors--nor society, either.

Children should love their parents; but if they don't fear them, too--fear their anger when they do deliberate wrong--then the parents aren't doing their jobs. And you can tell that's what's happened here from the smirks. If those kids, and their parents, too, don't complain about how "harsh" and "unfair" their punishment is--well, then it isn't nearly "harsh" enough.

The appropriate response to that kind of smirk is the old classic: "I'm going to wipe that smile off your face so hard you'll never have it again."

 

[lloydkristmas]

Seriously, I wish the guy was carrying so that we wouldnt have to have this discussion about punishing these two kids. Nothing like a few hollowpoints to the chestal region will keep even the toughest of "rogue teens" from offending again. Not to mention the parents get to sit back and think long and hard about the decisions they had made over the past 14 years. Alas, they got off lucky, so I'd say lets charge them with Assault with a Deadly Weapon and lock them up for half a decade.

 

[jefnvk]

They offered up a firearm with out any hint of training for these two.

They had $30 in stolen candy, I'd be half willing to bet the BB gun wasn't legal either.

They don't need to be charged with felonies, but a few weeks in jail probably wouldn't hurt. If there is hope of turning them around, it really doesn't make any sense to lock them up for 10 years, which would probably have more of a negative impact on them anyways.

Anyways, serious question: The guy came after them after the first shot. The way I understand it, as soon as he starts to run them down, he loses claims of self-defense. Am I wrong in thinking this?

 

[Crunker1337]

Morons like this make all teens look like irresponsible idiots.

 

[Bazooka Joe71]

Granted, these kids shouldn't spend 20-30 years in big boy prison, but they should be off the streets for quite some time...I agree with a previous poster when they said that it was a stupid-childish prank when they shot someone with the BB gun, but then they unloaded it on the guy, trying to cause harm...Thats not a childish prank.

I bought my first pack of cigarettes when i was 14 or 15(only smoked one or two and gave them away). I was 6'1 or 6'2, 195-200 lbs and most certainly did not look like a kid, nor did I act like one(ish ). However, I had couple of friends that did pull these type of stunts and now they are in and out of jail, with absolutely nothing going for them...This may be because back then they never got in caught...If they would have, maybe their lives would be different. But maybe not either...One thing is for certain, whether a stiff punishment straightens these kids up or not, they are headed down the wrong path right now and something harsh needs to be done.

But a couple days later the girl's dad ran me down in his car while I was on my paper route. Put me in the hospital for two weeks with a cracked kidney. He was charged and went to jail.

HOLY $***!!!!

That was totally retarded of you to throw a firecracker, but a grown man ran you down in his car???

Wow....thats....just...WOW.

 

[40SW]

This irritates me to no end!!!!!!!!!:banghead::banghead:
"When the teen pulled out the BB gun, Breczinski said there is no guarantee he would have known it wasn't a real gun."
Real "GUN"!!!!!!!!!
Airguns are dangerous and the same cardinal rules of safety APPLY!
The latest models from Gamo shoot a .177 at 1250 FPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You get one of those in the eye, you're history!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
These punks are very lucky to be alive. VERY LUCKY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Oregon Street]

we were not arrested/charged. we were handcuffed, stuffed in seperate squad cars and taken to the station, where our folks had to pick us up. the girl's mom did not press charges.

but the dad who ran me down said it was an accident and just wanted to scare me, but couldn't stop in time. witnesses said he tried to drive off but my bike was jammed under his car. so he got out and pulled my mangled bike out and then checked if i was ok.

 

[YardVarmint]

Try the punks as adults and be done with it.

They are lucky they didn't get their butt's kicked or worse.

Why is it our fault that their parents are Moron Farmers?

 

[Regolith]

Assault charges? Quite frankly, attempted murder might not be so much of a stretch.

BB guns aren't toys. They can kill you just as dead as a cartridge gun.

When I was 15, I damn well knew that pointing a gun at someone - any gun, even a BB gun - was WRONG. And that wasn't really all that long ago, either.

Quite frankly, these two need to be punished hard. I knew a bunch of kids like those two when I was in HS, and they haven't changed much since then. Last I heard, one was spending time in jail for drug possession with intent to sell. Same ****, different age. That guy had the same problem these two likely had: piss poor parents who justified anything wrong they ever did and never punished them for anything. I doubt these two would change their ways without a serious wakeup call.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

I know of a whole lot of squirrels that have died from being shot with a $40 bb gun. Airsoft is one thing, bb guns are real weapons that can kill quite easily if the shooter does their part.

 

[insidious_calm]

The last couple posters beat me to it. BB guns ARE lethal force. Recall the thread of the teen who killed his knife wielding mother with a single shot to the chest with one. They should be tried for aggravated battery at the minimum. Try them as adults. They are lucky they are not dead!

I.C.

 

[amper]

Deliberately shooting an unsuspecting person with a firearm is *not* a prank. It is an act of premeditated and unjustified violence that should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

Whether that means prosecuting the teenaged offenders or their parents, or both, is a matter for some debate, but responsible firearms rights advocates simply cannot condone incidents like this or allow incidents like this to occur without the harshest penalties being exacted in response.

I am not, in general, an advocate of treating juveniles as adults in the criminal justice system, but when the juveniles in question knowingly employ potentially deadly force against an unsuspecting, unarmed victim they have displayed a willful and criminal disregard of human life and decency, and should be punished accordingly.

 

[kurtmax]

I would definitely respond with lethal force if shot at with an air rifle. Those things are powerful, and might as well be firearms.

This leads me to wonder: Why aren't air rifles considered in the same category as firearms? IE, lethal force if you shoot somebody with them...

These kids need to be jailed for a long while. At least until they are 18. I can't fathom how even a kid could find such behavior as acceptable. Hopefully they will be grateful they weren't turned into swiss cheese and learn a good lesson over the next few years...

 

[oldcop1971]

Under Alabama law...

an air gun is classified as a firearm, same as any cartridge gun. Depending on the make/model, they can be just as lethal as a cartridge gun. Fourteen is plenty old enough to know you dont point a weapon at another human being and pull the trigger just for 'grins and giggles'. They were lucky not to have been shot. They should be held fully accountable, not excused.
oc71

 

[wideym]

My cousin (16) is in a juvenille halfway house and will be there for another 4 months min. He and his buddies started taking perscription drugs and moved on to dealing them to other students to support thier habit. He had been in trouble before but his mother would always find a way to keep him out of jail.(At the expense of his two younger sisters) He never wanted for anything, mom bought him the latest cell phone, PS2, truck, and nauseum. I over heard her begging him to act right and I was dumbfounded. I had never heard of an adult begging and negotiating with a child to behave. When I confronted her later she was enraged that I would question her parenting skills and forcefully told to but out.

A week later a very drunk and high 16 year old son almost put her through a bedroom wall. She call my uncle sobbing to help her, he called the cops and had him arrestted. It was the best thing that ever happened for him.

A local juvi-drug rehab-halfway house seems to have really made a difference. He is confined there 24/7, there are NO vidgames, sodas, candy, phones, and only 1hour of PBS/local news. They also attend school in house. After two months he was allowed a 12hour home visit for good behavior. He seems to be a changed person, when I asked him what was the biggest impact he said before he had no fear of being punished, now he knew what punishment was like and that it could get worse. Hopefully it will stick, only time will tell.

 

[Warren]

Isn't this the sort of thing that would be best punished by a week in the stocks in front of city hall or some other well traveled public space?

Maybe a few lashes as well, before or after their time in the stocks, their choice.

 

[thorn726]

Stretchman, you can't be serious. You honestly want to try a 14 year old kid as an adult and charge him with 2 felonies for shooting someone with a BB gun? That's a bit much don't you think?

not even close to being too much.
if they had taken out this guy's eye would you feel the same way?
anyone crazy enough to brandish a weapon for no reason, and worse fire it at a random innocent??

should say goodbye to many rights immediately and permanently.

they were obviously well old enough to know what they were doing.

us Scouts knew the right way handle a gun by the time we were what, 8?

not charging minors with felonies for this ridiculous assault wil only serve one purpose-
to teach these idiots they will get a slap on the wrist for serious crimes.
slap them hard enough they hit the floor, they won't forget it, and might end up with probation that is supervised to the point it actually does keep them in line long enough to grow up./