Terrorists At The Mall ?

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David

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As if we don't already have enough self-defense reasons to carry our CCW while mall shopping, here's another:

From cnn.com:

Officials Concerned About Holiday Terror Threat
No Plan to Raise National Threat Level Despite Increased Activity

Kelli Arena, CNN.com NewsWire

(Dec. 5) - As the holiday season approaches, recent intelligence has counterterrorism officials increasingly concerned about a possible attack against soft targets, such as shopping malls.

"As recently as two weeks ago, the intelligence community was telling the Homeland Security Department that this felt a lot like the summer of 2001," said Roger Cressey, a former counterterrorism official with the National Security Council. "[We're] seeing lots of data, lots of information coming together that paints a very disturbing picture."

Lacking specifics, Homeland Security officials say that there is no plan to raise the national threat level unless they receive more concrete information.

It is far from certain, but if the al Qaeda terrorist network does hit the United States, some officials continue to expect the attack will be much bigger than recent strikes overseas.

"The terror movement will always reserve the biggest and the most spectacular attacks for the U.S. and for U.S. interests," said M.J. Gohel of the Asia-Pacific Institute in London.

At least one senior U.S. official stressed there is usually increased threat information including Web site activity before and during several key holidays. The problem is separating the legitimate intelligence from the rest.

There were several warnings of possible attacks in the U.S. in October, but those never panned out. Also, officials say the terror movement is more scattered and harder to track.

"Each of these groups are autonomous with their own leadership, with their own funding, their own personnel," Gohel said. "And they have their own plots, as it were. But they're all bonded together by a common ideology."

Also, an al Qaeda video -- which appeared this week on a Web site affiliated with the terrorist network -- shows the two planes hitting the World Trade Center towers on Sept. 11, 2001, that sources in Washington said was videotaped from an angle they had not seen before.

According to CNN's translation of the tape, the video is a tribute to Abdul Ilah, identified as "one of the fighters of jihad" who was killed by Saudi special forces on Nov. 26 in his Saudi hometown of Hay al-Suaydi.

FBI officials only said they were aware of the video. It is not clear how al Qaeda obtained the Sept. 11 video.

The speaker on the video says Ilah fought against U.S. forces and their "collaborators" in Kandahar, Afghanistan, before heading to neighboring Pakistan.

Ilah was taken prisoner by U.S. "secret police" in an unidentified Arab country, according to the narrator.

"What was his crime? That he fought against the Christians," the speaker said.

The video shows al Qaeda training camps inside the Saudi kingdom, while praising Ilah's actions.


12/05/2003 05:05 GMT-5

© 2003 Cable News Network LP, LLLP. A Time Warner Company. All Rights Reserved
******

By the way, here's a photo from the above article showing 2 NYPD officers (what type of rifle is shown in the photo?):

:uhoh: :what: :scrutiny:
 

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Here is the photo again (it did not post correctly above):

A side note: There appears to be a bit of difference in the "tactical" readiness between the NYPD officer to the left as compared to the officer on right in this photo!

;) :p ;)
 

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Well, we have to keep in mind that the terrorists are LOW TECH kinda guys. I doubt if we'll see a monster bomb, or nerve gas, or bio warfare visited on a shopping mall. What I suspect we'll see, should they do it, is a similar situation to what they did in that Moscow theater. Entry of the mall, then a mass hostage situation, or possibly a mass execution situation. I can also see a situation where a semi-load of an explosive could be driven into one, but that, while impressive, wouldn't produce as high a casualty count, due to dispersement of victims. Large high-density gatherings scare the hell out of me.

Personally, I'm gonna do my best to stay away from malls, especially single-level malls (easier to control), for a while. At least until Missouri gets its CCW status resolved.
 
The last time I saw Johnny Law dressed up as Joe Tactical in person, I took a very close look @ the cartridge deflector.

It was pure virgin. The gun had never been fired.
 
I'm really surprised we haven't had a PLO/Hamas style suicide bomber at the malls the last two Christmases. Perhaps even a few truck-bombs in the parking lots set to go off 5-10 minutes later to catch maximum colateral damage in the traffic jam as everyone evacuates. The day after Thanksgiving some of these stores and malls are literaly shoulder-to shoulder. Everyone loaded with boxes and bags that you could hide anything in...

If you think about it it's a triple whammy:

- Basic Anti U.S. terrorisim.

- An attack on non Muslim religions this time of year Christianity and Judisim.

- An economic attack since holiday shopping is anywhere from 25 -90% of many retail businesses income.

Can you imagine what 5-10 bombers could accomplish at the 5-10 most prestigious or largest malls in the U.S. the day after Thanksgiving?

Could you imagine having going to the mall be like going to the airport?

It seems so obvious, and such a soft target, that it hasn't happened might be a credit to the .gov. If they've been breaking up suicide bomber cells and rings, perhaps they've been keeping the intended targets quiet so as not to suppress the economy.
 
I disagree with the idea that the terrorists are "low-tech." Explosives and poisons are too easily manufactured or obtained to make that assumption. They serve as very effective force multipliers. One cell of 6 or so might be able to control one store, but one mall would be too difficult. However, 6 individuals carrying explosives, gases, etc., can do significant damage to 6 malls. Say, hang around the Santa area in order to kill a large number of children. Typical of what the Palestinians are doing.
 
Part of the plot of Tom Clancy's latest Teeth of the Tiger novel.


Not a good read--but interesting how the terrorist were going to make simultaneous attack in mall across the US.

Remember he had an attack with a 747 ramming into the US Capitol Building years before 9/11...
 
It seems to me that the Sept. 11 attacks set the bar pretty high for the enemy in terms of inflicting casualties. Much of what I read on the subject indicates that they really want to duplicate that casualty count, at a minimum. Our side seems focused on stopping those kind of attacks, and rightly so.

But if you read Bin Laden's original declaration of war against the US, he exhorts his followers to kill in all manner of ways and in all manner of places - shooting kids at playgrounds comes to mind. And the training tapes that were recovered in Afghanistan show rehearsals of such low-casualty operations as shooting a homeowner answering the door, golf course assassinations and others.

At some point, the enemy is going to conduct such operations here at home. I think they haven't yet because they are fixated on one-upping Sept. 11, and don't want to risk losing people in lesser operations. The longer they go between major strikes, though, the more pressure is on them to do *something*.

I live less than four miles from the Mall of America, and I can tell you that during the holiday season the place is mobbed all the time. A couple of bad guys with AKs could kill a tremendous number of people.

Of course, the Mall is posted against carrying, so I'm sure there's nothing to worry about.
 
I'm really surprised we haven't had a PLO/Hamas style suicide bomber at the malls the last two Christmases

So am I. It's so obvious, and the damage to the economy would be tremendous, although internet sales would probably increase as a result. The only real defense you have against them if they use suicide bombs is a good investigation.

The government can't possibly defend even a reasnoable fraction of all the "soft targets" in this country. Maybe this will encourage more CCW, or maybe it will lead to a reduction in our freedom of movement. I hope we don't end up like Israel, with people getting blown up in nightclubs and school buses.
 
And the training tapes that were recovered in Afghanistan show rehearsals of such low-casualty operations as shooting a homeowner answering the door,

This time of year, how hard would it be to fake up a UPS or FedEx truck and drive around, shooting people with a suppressed pistol when they answer the door? Low casualty, sure, but they could spread a lot of panic with relatively low risk of getting caught.
 
These guys _are_ low tech. Why build a cruise missile when you can steal one? They don't need to build a truck bomb - they can steal a propane or gasoline tanker. Nerve gas/biowarfare is expensive to make and cumbersome to transport/use, and is actually more of an "area-denial" weapon than strictly a terror weapon. Same for nuclear stuff. Most single-level malls could be assaulted/controlled with a force of a dozen committed martyrs. If control isn't deemed necessary, they could cause a tremendous casualty count, and possibly evacuate before police could arrive.

On our side is that the folks tend to not train well (why worry about marksmanship if allah is going to guide your aim?), but that may change over time.
 
That weapon appears to be..............one that I would not like to MESS WITH:eek: . The cat holding the weapon looks pretty mean too. Either way I wouldn't want to be around when that guy decides to "cut loose"
 
I've fired more rounds and in more "tactical" situations than that cop has.

I'd bet my life on it.

Having him in a mall "protecting" us is terrorism to me.

YMMV

I don't feel ANY better/safer.
 
Why do you think that one NYPD cop in the photo has the typical "soft" uniform -- a ballcap and a navy blue windbreaker jacket, while his partner looks like he is ready to be an "uber-SWAT tactical guy" in the next Bruce Willis "Die Hard" flick?

The SWAT-type cop is even wearing sunglasses AND goggles!

They are sort of the "odd couple" of the police world.

Weird if you ask me!

:rolleyes: :eek: :rolleyes:

Just my 2 cents...
 
I'd probably rather go at with the tactical guy.......all show and no go.....an NYPD cop.......if he has a plunger.......you're in trouble:D
Seriously tho ,the regular cop is probably more realistic than MR.Tactical(although he LOOKS cooler)...I know some regular,older cops.....they aren't to be messed with.....:cool:
 
To think of the possibilities for terrorists in soft targets within the United States and other free countries is astounding. Two dozen or so terrorists within a crowded suburban mall could pretty much be the Grinch who stole Christmas.

Not only could it paralyze citizens, but the economy as well. Of course, if the terrorists were ½ as brain dead as Illinois politicians, they would pull off their plan in Chicago (not even law-abiding citizens can legally own handguns) and the surrounding suburbs (no CCW). Heck, I would think the unarmed security guards in malls like Woodfield (Packed with thousands from Thanksgiving through Christmas) would be the first out of the building. 12 terrorists, 1000 rounds each...they could clear the mall single handedly...and almost without worry of retaliation. I'm glad to see our lawmakers allow us to defend ourselves. :rolleyes:

And as someone else stated, not only is this 'Jihad' good against citizens (Infidels) and the economy, what better than to attack a Christian holiday?

Merry Christmas!
 
Move the scenario from a mall to a school and I think you have a winner.

911 was about a spectacular hit for the Arab consumer as it was against US interests. The worst thing that could happen is for islamofascist terrormongers to begin thinking like Americans and stop thinking like Arabs. When that happens Wall Street, NY and DC cease being all important. Peoria, IL and Manhattan, KS become all important because those are the heart of the mythical middle America.

A hit on middle America will do more psychological damage than another hit on NY. Want to screw up the American economy? Film the launch of a man portable anti-aircraft missile at a US flag jet then distribute the footage to all cable networks. We will be treated to endless video loops of missiles homing on passenger airliners.

The damage we will endure will be as much from our irresponsible media as it will be from the islamofascist terrormongers.
 
As someone above already stated, I'm not worried - all the malls around here forbid weapons. They even have signs that say so! Why, with that kind of protection, no terrorist can dare think of bringing a weapon in such a place!:confused:
 
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