maybe not but its up there. I like guns that a overbuilt and durable. Those MK23 are pretty phenominal in that area. thanks for the tips. I dont mind waiting for the right opportunity. I thought they were ussually selling for around $1,700 or so.... was pretty shocked to see the prices on GB. Magazines are not cheap either... even for HK.
The BEST of the BEST....
- Thread starter Hokkmike
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maybe not but its up there. I like guns that a overbuilt and durable. Those MK23 are pretty phenominal in that area. thanks for the tips. I dont mind waiting for the right opportunity. I thought they were ussually selling for around $1,700 or so.... was pretty shocked to see the prices on GB. Magazines are not cheap either... even for HK.
I like them as well. Never had a misfire and they are accurate. Probably my favorite magazine design ever. They are pretty brilliant for what they are. An ultra high quality volkspistole or camp pistol. nothing ever breaks. They will digest everything. Trigger designed for a MAN!
Mark_Mark
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For the Performance and value! CZ all the way, Great Bullet proof mags, proven design
here’s a thought Grand Power! P100 series
CZs are too heavy, double action is too long, and the slide is too hard to grasp. Thats what all the sissyboys use to say anyways.
you never hear about grand powers anymore. I was checking the other day and it looks like the 10mm is still out of production. Sucks because I wanted that one once they figured everything out. I thought those were the perfect attempt of a modernized Bren Ten.
CZ needs to get off their ass and beef up the Cz 97 for full power 10mm. Call it the Bren Czen. Instant massive hit.
CZ Custom does make a 97B in 10mm
Hangingrock
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Handguns are simply tools. Nothing more or less. My EDC is a S&W Shield 9X19mm which is a cost-effective tool. Some individuals treat handguns like a status symbol all most an indicator of personal wealth.
crestoncowboy
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Lol. Look up a recoil spring assembly. When I replaced mine it was 90 bucks. Probably higher now. I keep several Glock recoil spring assembly in stock... about 5 dollars but Glock will just give you one if you ask. I have 3 USP. Fine gun but terrible ergonomics and feel (especially the comically large mk23) stupid priced parts that HK doesn't even stock, lack luster triggers.. EVERY time I've needed parts for an HK they have been out of stock and I had to get them from an online place. Lol. Great guns though. Also with the company having such issues in Germany who knows what the future holds for them. They have always bordered on a boutique company anyway
Sig makes some fine guns but the company sucks. If your sig breaks you have to pay shipping back. No other company does that. Also the finishes on any sig i own made after the 90s are awful. They just scratch off. No problem, it's just cosmetic. They also tend to lie about their issues and use customers (even le) as test vehicles. They don't have issues, they have mandatory/ voluntary upgrades that are used from that point on with all the new guns... not recalls... not a fix.... since they never had a problem though. Lol. They finally decided to try to copy Glock a bit with the 320. Yet one of the parts they didn't copy was a failure and could have got people (with butter fingers) killed. That should tell people something. They should have just done like smith and copied the entire Glock instead of mucking up the Glock design. In my opinion Sig died when they crossed the ocean. Were on life support after the great guns like the p220/226/229/210 etc etc. Now they make wannabe Glocks and ar copies. Doubtful i ever buy another new Sig, I'll stick to the old p series. My last new ones were two 320. A 40 and a 45. A decent gun. But just that.
FN doesn't impress me either. I own two models. An fnx tactical, and a couple five seven. I also own one rifle but it's an AR... just like every other AR made now. They tend to run fine. Unlike the early 00s when there were many AR that were just trash. The fnx did nothing special. Feels ok. Shoots good. The reason I have one is that back when it came out there were almost no guns set up from the factory as a suppressor host. High sights, threaded etc etc. The five seven was neat and I've had no issues with it but the round itself it just mediocre at anything and mags/ parts/ ammo etc are just too high. I think the round is doomed personally. They make good guns.
Glock makes the finest police/ military/ defense handgun ever made in my opinion. However that is all they make. ONE handgun. For 40 years. They bore the hole out. Change the recoil spring. Cut off or add length. They add or subtract finger grooves every ten years. When they really want to blow the minds of Glock fans every 20 years they may even do something earth shattering.... like take a full size slide and put it on a compact frame... or mill a slide for an optic like People have been doing in their moms basement for 20 years. They make AN excellent handgun though. Tough, simple as a gun can be made. Ive rebuilt revolvers that had as many parts as a Glock. New mags for 10-15 bucks. Most parts are under a dollar straight from Glock. Ive never needed a part that wasn't in stock. I don't think a modern gun can be made any simpler and therefore cheaper and more reliable. For that reason I think Glock is probably going to be the king of the arena. I own guns from most any manufacturer. From a hi point (was a package deal. Lol) up to Nighthawk. I carry a Glock most of the time.
Smith has floundered about for so long I can't imagine they will ever be good again. My last three revolvers didn't even work out of the box. If they can't produce a working 800 dollar revolver, something they pioneered and have made for over 100 years, then why bother buying anything they make now. The last good new smith design was designed by Glock and landed them in court.
Beretta was the flagship of the gun industry right up until the 80s and 90s. Since then they have done nothing good. I have more Beretta than any other brand. I actually collected Beretta for years. For a company founded in the 1500s and known for evolving though.... they sure have stuck in one spot. Their most sold guns are (excellent) double barrels, not exactly a new concept. And their 92 series which is an older design than most readers here. And it was an evolution of a gun made before any reader here.
Ruger is a company that I have expected to do something good for years. They haven't. They make good product. They are known for simplifying a design and making the production as affordable as possible. They have made decent semi autos that absolutely nobody wanted for 40 years. Lol. My wish is that they would make a decent handgun that our military could field. Get us away from a frigging Austrian/ German or Italian designed gun. It's embarrassing. We can't even design our own gun anymore
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Wow.. had to look it up before saying you are full of it. You are dialed in though. This one slipped right past me. Hopefully these become a regular line production once they get everything worked out. 6" longslide version would be the cats meow... or better yet the Lions Roar! 2.5-3k is a pretty good chunk of change. Not really a street price either being a custom gun. Its deffinitly on my list of guns to keep an eye on... its a short list.
Not for everyone. my personal belief is that the firearm is the greatest invention ever made by man. I am not a gun snob either so the status symbol stuff is out for me. I will talk up cheap little ravens and hipoints as much as I will berettas and Hks. Good is good and more often than not design trumps price.
Shield is a good pistol. I liked the 45 the most. Reminded me of a lightly built patriot with a softer trigger.
crestoncowboy
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A 10mm is not a good choice for a company to make a huge production item. Ive been on this sight preaching about how great the 10mm is for many years. I have them from an old bren 10 and an early blued delta up to a new delta, 6 inch Glock, and a sig 220 hunter. Ive wanted a mk23 in 10mm for 20 years lol. But they just don't sell many 10s. I'm shocked that Glock has kept the 10mm as a production item the entire run. At one time Glock and kimber were the only two 10s you could find. Witness made limited runs. I love the 10 but if I were over manufacturing id make it a limited run thing. Maybe annually.
Lol. Hi point makes a reliable gun. Heavy. Awful ergonomics, nobody wants one. But they do work. Ive used them a good bit. Ive won lots of money with a friends 9mm betting against poor shooters with high end guns. Same for my Ruger p97. It shoots as good as any handgun and people just arrogantly bet against it. Ive also used their carbine a good bit too. It is ugly, bulky, bad ergos, flimsy cheap safety, just a bare minimum gun. Ive never had a hi point jam or break. Never had one come to me broke either. I had one come to me in a pile to put back together but not broken.
I've owned several Raven/Jennings guns. Ive never had nor seen one that didn't jam. Often. I used to frequent a store that sold Jennings for 54 dollars around 2000 or 2001. You could watch people buy them, take them to the range with a box of 50 rounds and break them. Lol. I wouldn't put them (or Lorcin, or Bryco, or clerke,...) in the same class as hi point. And that's a pretty darn low class already.
I pretty much agree with everything you state overall. Some minor details. I will start with Beretta for this post so its not too long.
Beretta has had tons of good designs besides the 92. They just dont ever seem to catch on like the 92. 8000 series is excellent as is the PX and APX. Nano and pico are quality as far as modern goes. Even the 9000 was an excellent pistol in 9mm. beretta just screwed up the frame with a rubber overlay that disintegrates if you beath on it. So beretta has sales duds but they pretty much always hit the mark on design and function.
crestoncowboy
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Much like Ruger. They are decent guns too but do nothing better than others. So they drop them and move on to another ho hum design. Lol
Zerodefect
member
The obsolete versions of the newish FN striker pistols were marked down to $250 a couple years ago. I missed out because I needed to stock up on ammo instead, before prices inevitably climbed. They were basically Glocks.
I am typing one handed so its hard to keep up with you haha. raven/jennings are same design as hipoint. none of mine ever jammed as long as they have not been abused or lubed with glue. J22s can need work sometimes but that is the nature of rimfire in pocket autos. The design is sound though. Some of the larger calibers are underbuilt.
P97 is a great pistol. Pretty much all the ruger p series are the apex of ruger semi auto pistols... IMO. My belief is that the p85 would have been a better military sidearm than the 92 or p226 but I put a major emphasis on durability. Ruger just needed a little more time.
stanard 1911 is just a lousy platform for 10mm unless you are willing to beef it up like a LAR grizzly. locking system is just not adequate. Might be possible with a rotating barrel system. You can help it a little by adding mass but it really neads a different type of delay.
Military trials and testing is not everything anyways. Its a niche. Kind of like Lorcin. You be a street hustler with low funds and need to keep your girls in line.... hard to beat a smooth bored golden lorcin that can be tossed in the river without guilt. Nobody was tossing that P7m8 in the river back in the 90s. Everybody has their niche. Rugers and others problem is they cant decide wjat niche they want to fill. The whole industry is basically ADD when it comes to the big manufacturers. They are making money but not a whole lot of advancement going on.
10mm is in good shape right now. Everyone just needs to go buy a few. Same goes for automags and other hand cannons. 9mm worship from hipsters has stalled things to the point everyone has to mount tvs on their slides to stay interested. Once these guys outgrow skinny jeans and start growing into men they will want 10mm. If they start working out and eating meat we will be right back to 45 win mag and 50AE. Its just a mAtter of time.
Also... once these blue haired vegitarian snarky phone heads start having kids they will want that booooom recoil at the range. Its a great stress reliever to pop off hand cannons and blow stuff up. Each bullet becomes a red pill to years and years of feminization. Before you know it men will be back to wearing cowboy boots, tucking in their shirts, and arm wrestling contests to decide who gets to take home the blonde sheela for the night.
Well in the end they are all just particle accelerators or projectile launchers. To the average non gun enthusiest there is very little difference between a hipoint 9mm and a Beretta 92. They just need a bangstick to defend themselves. The only real uncharted territory is to open the registry and everyone to start producing their own version of the beretta 93r. Handcannons and raw power will most likely make a comback because they have been neglected for so long. Revolvers wont be coming back so that leaves the big boys.... big beautiful thunder guns that shake the heavens and part the seas. autoloaders powerful enough to take down an elephant or a giant saltwater crocodile if the situation arises. Even double stack is possible. 15 rounds of 45 winmag devestation at the tips of your fingers.
I will say I do like the modern steel chasis movement. It only took 30+ years! Polymer is a lot easier to accept when its just a grip that can be replaced for 30-40 bucks. Anything new should incorperate that feature IMO.
triplebike
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Should have sent the melted blob back to Hi-Point explaning a house fire. Knowing their customer service they might have sent you a new firearm.
100% true. I think sccy is similar. A lot of the little startups will go out of their way for you.
Mark_Mark
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I want to sccy with the CT red dot. i like reddots and the CT dot has a auto on/off and lifetime warranty
sccy is basically a p11. Thats a very fast and violent action. I am not convinced yet that the optic can take it as I have seen some cracked screens. Also... p11 is more of a modern day autoloading DAO hi cap 9mm j-frame. Not really a long range target gun.
might look at the new striker fired version if you are going the optics mount setup. That would help you milk every bit of accuracy out of the platform possible.
Personally I love the double strike dao sccy/p11 trigger but I look at them more as defensive weapons than I do race/range guns. I do like lasers on them for nightime carry. My jogging guns all have them.
crestoncowboy
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Then you still have a varmint round. Lol. I have two 5.7 and I used a 5.7 carbine a bit. There is great reason why nobody anywhere uses the 5.7 for any serious use. And it's not because civilian ammo sales are limited because I'mnot talking about civilians. There is also a good reason why 22 caliber is the foremost varmint round. There were 10x as many departments and forces that used 10mm than there were 5.7.... and there were still next to none
If there was ever a niche round is the 5.7. I bought into it early. I have cases of ammo i paid 19 bucks per 50. I would still choose a 9mm for duty over it. And I only own 1 9mm...twice as many five seven
for what reason?
The way it came from the factory about once every one hundred rounds the last round in the magazine would feed all the way through the pistol & out the ejection port without chambering. I sent it in. S&W said they polished the barrel if I recall correctly. After that instead of feeding all the way through & ejecting the last round in the mag would stovepipe. Operating on a hunch I contacted S&W & requested new magazine springs. They did send me two. After I received them I took one of the old spings & cut it in half & nested it in the new spring. The last couple of hundred rounds-no malfunctions. However this is a known issue & instead of upping the tension on the magazine springs S&W gives people a song & dance & doesn't resolve the issue. The did change the tension of the springs once but they still left them too light. I understand the whole point of the pistol is for it to be easy to operate but maybe they should just include a magazine loader instead of underspringing it to the point it doesn't work properly.
If you do a search on 380 EZ at the S&W forum you can learn all about it.
Edited to add: From what I have read I do not believe the 9mm version suffers from these issues. I believe they changed the magazine design before it entered production.
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Pre recall or post?
(My wife owns one. admitted she will never shoot a high number of rounds)
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