The BEST of the BEST....

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A) Reliability and ruggedness.

B) Decent DA trigger and should be DA/SA.

Single exception: the DAO Sig P229 I tried had a trigger so Very smooth (little stacking-or not apparent) that you might not suspect that the pull is 7#.
I would take such a P229 over most DA/SA handguns.

tarosean: If your HK in .45 has an improved DA trigger pull (vs. the stock pull), then I would love such an HK, and the chambering would not matter.
* The small "antler" symbol shows that it was proofed in Ulm Germany (CA=2020), ironically the home of Walther (my P99 AS).
 
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Jonny2guns said:
Did you really use Hi-Point and reliable in the same sentence? Reliable isn't a correct way to describe Hi-Point, cheap yes.
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I'm gonna throw that one back at you. Have you owned and shot one? (Or more?) For those of us who have, maybe 1 of 1000 has had problems with them. I'd bet most of those could be attributed to operator headspace and timing.
Would I carry a Hi-Point? No. But it's not for lack of reliability. They are boringly reliable with ball ammo. My .45 ACP even worked with most hollow points. But the safety on them is not good for a carry gun.
 
entropy said:
I'm gonna throw that one back at you. Have you owned and shot one? (Or more?) For those of us who have, maybe 1 of 1000 has had problems with them. I'd bet most of those could be attributed to operator headspace and timing.
Would I carry a Hi-Point? No. But it's not for lack of reliability. They are boringly reliable with ball ammo. My .45 ACP even worked with most hollow points. But the safety on them is not good for a carry gun.
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Hi-Point is on my list of must have gun. So much hype and cool gun guy lure…. got get one!
 
entropy said:
I'm gonna throw that one back at you. Have you owned and shot one? (Or more?) For those of us who have, maybe 1 of 1000 has had problems with them. I'd bet most of those could be attributed to operator headspace and timing.
Would I carry a Hi-Point? No. But it's not for lack of reliability. They are boringly reliable with ball ammo. My .45 ACP even worked with most hollow points. But the safety on them is not good for a carry gun.
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BEST of the BEST, but you would Not carry one. Ball ammo isn't defensive ammo, doesn't matter if the gun will shoot it all day. A safety that is not suitable for carry. Kinda sounds like the only selling point is that it's cheap. Nothing about that says BEST of anything.
 
Jonny2guns said:
BEST of the BEST, but you would Not carry one. Ball ammo isn't defensive ammo, doesn't matter if the gun will shoot it all day. A safety that is not suitable for carry. Kinda sounds like the only selling point is that it's cheap. Nothing about that says BEST of anything.
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The fact they are massive and heavy is enough to make them not the best of anything, except being massive and heavy. But I think when you said hi point and reliable don't go together, people took offense. And in my experience they are reliable too. People like to hate on hi point and throw out unreliable, as if there isn't enough wrong with the gun already that they need to reach. They would be pretty much my last choice for anything serious. Id describe them as accurate and reliable but otherwise pretty terrible. Either way I agree that it's laughable to be in a best of the best thread
 
crestoncowboy said:
The fact they are massive and heavy is enough to make them not the best of anything, except being massive and heavy. But I think when you said hi point and reliable don't go together, people took offense. And in my experience they are reliable too. People like to hate on hi point and throw out unreliable, as if there isn't enough wrong with the gun already that they need to reach. They would be pretty much my last choice for anything serious. Id describe them as accurate and reliable but otherwise pretty terrible. Either way I agree that it's laughable to be in a best of the best thread
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That's my point, this was Best of the Best. As far as reliability, Hi Point will not run with Glock and M&P when run hard and dirty (actual test).
 
Jonny2guns said:
That's my point, this was Best of the Best. As far as reliability, Hi Point will not run with Glock and M&P when run hard and dirty (actual test).
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Are you sure? Or just because they are a pot metal, heavy, ugly, cheap gun are you assuming. They are a straight blow back action. Not a lot to go wrong. No locking lugs to shear, no tiny frame ears to break off. Never heard of a "hi point bulge". Nor did they have to do a voluntary but not voluntary recall but not recall because the hi point would shoot you if you looked at it wrong. Lol

I'm not saying they will. I'm just not going to say they won't. Ive fixed several broken Glock and M&P, Beretta And sig. And even a few H&K. I have spare parts for all of those. The only parts I have for a hi point us a scope rail that a guy wanted removed and thrown away. I kept it. Even the scope rail is a cheap POS. Lol. Came off a 9mm carbine. Never had a broken hi point though. I'm aware they aren't likely to be shot much. I'm also aware they sell in numbers far lower than the others I've named too. Some of those others weren't either though. With everyone who owns one ashamed to use it at the range id guess most are like new. Lol.

Either way we agree they aren't the best at anything. Not even close. IMO they are the cheapest POS gun id depend on if for any reason I lost every decent gun I have. They are just as just above the "never" line with heritage. Lol. Lorcin and the like are under that line.

20190402_142701.jpg

In my opinion i fired the best of the best on that day pictured. Assuming one is ok with a larger gun. One of those would get my vote. I wouldn't even be concerned with which one
 
Let’s everyone get a High Point and embrace American Made!

I’m buying one and spay painting it camo
 
When I think best of the best, SVI is above anything one could get off a shelf mass produced.

I suppose for the same reason I wouldn’t pick a car you could get from a dealership and compare it to purpose built racecars.

I guess the best question would be to ask “best at what?”, then add qualifiers like price, not custom built, etc.
 
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jmorris said:
When I think best of the best, SVI is above anything one could get off a shelf mass produced.

I suppose for the same reason I wouldn’t pick a car you could get from a dealership and compare it to purpose built racecars.
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I bought a few STI and the Glock guys out shot me. My lesson, “You can buy Skills”
 
Mark_Mark said:
I bought a few STI and the Glock guys out shot me. My lesson, “You can buy Skills”
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You can certainly buy skills, you are taking the wrong classes if you are stagnant as far as improvement. That’s with any gun that runs.

What you can’t do is just go buy the same revolver as Jerry Miculek and think that’s all you need to shoot like he does.

A better shooter is likely to beat lower skilled shooters, even with inferior equipment.

This is why business that make inferior equipment for gun games pay the best shooters, to shoot them in matches, in hopes they can still win without the best or most competitive equipment and sell more of them.

I bet you don’t remember what brand ping pong paddle Forest Gump used to beat China but might remember the “Flex-o-light ping pong paddle” he was payed to peddle afterwards…fiction based upon reality.
 
jmorris said:
You can certainly buy skills, you are taking the wrong classes if you are stagnant as far as improvement. That’s with any gun that runs.
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100% agree.. The best of the best all hold training classes.

Heck I still own a VHS of How to Shoot Fast and Accurately but havent owned a VHS player in a decade or so. lol

jmorris said:
This is why business that make inferior equipment for gun games pay the best shooters, to shoot them in matches, in hopes they can still win without the best or most competitive equipment and sell more of them.
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Orrr the fan boys ignore short comings in certain classes.. :eek: (Glock cough cough)
 
Mark_Mark said:
Let’s everyone get a High Point and embrace American Made!

I’m buying one and spay painting it camo
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you can buy them like that. 40 and 45 are the most trouble free due to magazine and bullet case. The 40 magazine are heat treated..... at least thats what the techs will say. The magazine issues are mostly a 9mm thing. The 380 benefits from a spacer and new spring and follower. stabalizes things a bit.
 
Ignition Override said:
tarosean: If your HK in .45 has an improved DA trigger pull (vs. the stock pull), then I would love such an HK,
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Are you talking about the stock USP trigger/Variants or their Match trigger? I have 3 HK's 2 with the Match trigger and 1 with the LEM. I wont own any of the V* variants.
The Match trigger is better than my D sprung Beretta 92's if that is a comparison you're familiar with?
 
starling said:
I will take the CZ from your stack. If not the USP expert will work.
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It definitely out shoots everything in my safe, including guns that cost 5 times its purchase price. Butttttt its too big to carry and 22 rounds of 40 is not light either.
 
tarosean said:
It definitely out shoots everything in my safe, including guns that cost 5 times its purchase price. Butttttt its too big to carry and 22 rounds of 40 is not light either.
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Ha... nothing is to big to carry. You can walk around with an UZI if you have an old diaper bag. I get what you are saying though. Seems like it could do all right in a vertical shoulder rig....a nice one. Seems like CZs alway outshoot other guns. Even my CZ99 outshoots the Sigs. I Think they sprinkle magic dust on them at the factory. CZ40b is my most accurate 40 s&w. Cz82 and 52 outshoot the russian guns. As much as I boost Beretta and HK... cz may be the most consistant over the last 50 years or so. Not sure about the Cz100 though. I missed the boat on those. One of these days I will track one down.
 
starling said:
you can buy them like that. 40 and 45 are the most trouble free due to magazine and bullet case. The 40 magazine are heat treated..... at least thats what the techs will say. The magazine issues are mostly a 9mm thing. The 380 benefits from a spacer and new spring and follower. stabalizes things a bit.
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I like .40 cal… anybody else?
 
Mark_Mark said:
I like .40 cal… anybody else?
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one of the best.... unless you are a girly man with girly hands. Its a powerful and violent round. Most pocket 40s are not so great. The guns just get to beat up too fast. Some of these new steel subframe guns might be able to handle it though. I would bet money the Nano/Apx carry was made with 40s&w in mind because they are so overbuilt for 9mm.

most of the mid and fullsize 40s are pleasant shooters.
 
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