The VPC has stolen a picture of Oleg

[Orthonym]

Welcome, gundam007, but

could you explain a bit more discursively just what you meant there? (Oh, BTW, new members must buy ammo for the rest of us )

 

[gundam007]

I will get as many realistic look alike fire arms as i can, take a pic of me holding them like rambo, post it so they use it so i can sue [/ my evil anti-gc plan]

 

[Brian Dale]

Ummm, gundam, publicly writing that you'll "post it so they use it" beforehand might kinda toss your chances of winning that lawsuit out the window, neh? Fun to think about pitching in, though.

Oh, and make mine 12ga., target loads, if you please.

Seriously, though: Welcome!

 

[Combat-wombat]

any updates so far?

 

[Oleg Volk]

Talked to Henry Bowman, he's not sure we can sue and win. Also talking to Rich Lucibella and others. Shold have an update in a few days.

 

[Bill Hook]

Class Action?

 

[Oleg Volk]

Here's a copy of VPC response. Suggesions?

 

[Moparmike]

Sounds almost threatening at the end.

Unfortunately, I dont think there is much you can do except grumble unless you have a lawyer on the "tip-top" of his game in the world of copyright infringement.


While this may turn out to be a "lesson learned" type of situation, you may be able to prevent it in the future. Can you place a "gate" page on your site where "terms and conditions" are agreed to before you enter the site? One of those being that you (The Webpage Viewer) are expressly forbidden to copy any images and use them without express permission from one Mr. Oleg Volk?

Just an idea. Its a shame that we have come to that point in our society.

 

[Oleg Volk]

Hmmm...currently, that injunction is in he FAQ. I could add the copyright info to the bottom of every web page. Current options include raising funds to hire an lawyer, turning over the site to a new owner who would sue or doing nothing (which woul dlikely open me up for future violations with inaction in regards to this one as a precedent)

 

[Jeff White]

Oleg,
I think I would put a users agreement page that you must click on to get into the site. I'd also put the reason why you now have to sign on to access the site right on that page.

Jeff

 

[El Rojo]

Well I think that is good enough. The VPC lawyers had to waste their time and resources putting that all together. That means the VPC will have to keep paying that lawyer to write such letters. If it is pro-bono then still that liberal's time has been wasted. Overall, anything to screw with them is time well spent in my opinion.

 

[Bill Hook]

All aggrieved parties should write cease and desist letters.

Oleg should get his models releases done in such a way that they retain all rights to their images when not used by him, such that they become party to the suit.

 

[geekWithA.45]

I'm not surprised they didn't roll over at all.

My suggestion:

Recall general orders regarding capture and escape:

"If captured, it is an officer's duty to escape. If escape is not possible, officers should conduct themselves such that the enemy must expend the maximum resources possible"

To that end, whatever can be done on our end for cheap that costs them more to respond to, the better.

The tone of the letter sounded pretty standard to me: "Behold my might, that none can stand against", which is yer basic tactic: make your opponent believe your position is unnassailable.

Whether it actually is or not is beyond me to determine, but requires a copyright lawyer.

As I understand fair use, it only applies to criticism or review of the work.

In this case, I think it's pretty clear from the context that Oleg's art is incorporated into an entirely new work, and is NOT a review or criticism of A Human Right .com, and the assertion that they are making the opposite point doesn't make it a critique.

I'm also thinking that because one of the images is Oleg himself, you'll have additional leverage.

 

[voilsb]

Here's a copy of VPC response. Suggesions?

Well, it basically reads as "even though it is expressly in violation of the terms with which you make your images available, we are in the right because we're criticizing your viewpoint and the images are only displayed for a second at a time."

Depending on the time and money involved, I would try to take it farther with them. Maybe go on the defamation/libel side of it, and also with the expressly written limit on who you're allowing to use your works.

Also, they make an exception that since your sight in informinative, it's not art. Unfortunately, although the site content is informinative, the photography is very much an art. Anybody can take pictures and come up with witty phrases. Your photography goes well beyond that and into the realm of Art.

 

[Bruce H]

Well first trying to do everything all legal and proper got you absolutely nowhere just as they new it would. They know most don't have the time and recources to argue and fight with them. By this reasoning they can get away with just about anything they want. Witness their past actions with lies and inuendo pointed at various people and situations. All that is left is plan B, stomp them. Make them afraid to breathe. Hunt them down and thrash them severely. They have to learn actions have reactions.

 

[Devonai]

I agree with El Rojo. No matter what the outcome, VPC was forced to address the issue via their attorney. Most likely they will avoid using images belonging to Oleg from now on. If only there was more weight to the current issue.

 

[jimpeel]

Basically, there is an express prohibition in your website that forbids the use of your images by any entity that is in opposition to the website. there is no caveat saying "Unless, of course, you are using my images under the Fair Use Doctrine". The prohibition is specific and unambiguous in its language. There is an implied contractual agreement to any who enter the site and use its images.

Could you go after them for a possible breach of contract?

You should send another "Cease and Desist" demand with that fact pointed out in big capital letters. Also send the C&D to their ISP.

Regardless of their use of the Fair Use Doctrine, they are in violation of the terms of use of the images on the site.

 

[PATH]

Well I am willing to contribute a c-note to any fund being set up.

 

[Geech]

I'm reasonably certain that the fair use doctrine supercedes any "Terms of Service" you have. This isn't just Oleg, here, there's a lawyer involved and he seems to think the VPC put up a pretty good argument.

 

[Boats]

I'd prefer to fire back personally had I the technical talents.

Parody their entire effort. Such a parody in part caused Handgun Control Inc. to change its name. Get images of their leaders, make up preposterous fake study titles, get plenty of images of sheep, and cows being led to the slaughter, and make your own flash movie about their underhanded stupidity.

Fair use and all that claptrap. Begin with their "V" logo.

 

[cordex]

Oleg, if you know a lawyer that thinks they can take this to the next level, I'll contribute what I can to help offset their fee. I bet plenty of other THR members would do the same.

 

[Sportcat]

Doesn't it say on the front of your site that the images can be used for PRO -RKBA sites?

 

[gun-fucious]

Oleg,

Eugene Volokh expressed some interest in the issue
when i emailed him when this first cropped up.

http://www1.law.ucla.edu/~volokh/

Eugene Volokh teaches free speech law, copyright law, the law of government and religion, and a seminar on firearms regulation policy at UCLA Law School. Before coming to UCLA, he clerked for Justice Sandra Day O'Connor on the U.S. Supreme Court and for Judge Alex Kozinski on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit.


i would send Eugene the .pdf

 

[Henry Bowman]

Sorry about being "radio silent" for so long. It has been necessary.

Folks, it is not that VPC'c attorney has made good arguments (much could be debated or refuted). An important factor to consider in filing a copyright infringement lawsuit is that, unlike most other civil litigation in the U.S., copyright infringement has a "loser pays winner's attorneys fees" rule. Also, most proponents of the 2nd Amendment respect the 1st Amendment, even if the reverse isn't true.

All for now. I am continuing to work with Oleg on this.

 

[Oleg Volk]

Eugene Volokh has other things on his plate right now.