Thinking about .38 Super

[Raz]

I've got two Kimbers ... an Ultra Carry and a government size Eclipse. I've always been happy with the little guy, but the ol' Eclipse just hasn't cut it for me.


Anyway, I finally decided to trade the Eclipse, and instead of getting another .45, I've decided to get a pimpin', nickel plated Springfield .38 Super.

I went down to my favorite gun store here in Alexandria and discovered the gun has not been put into production yet ... at least they were not shipping any at this point. So I told the folks down there to let me know as soon as one becomes available. I should be able to get one for around $950 ... before my trade.

http://www.springfield-armory.com/images/pistols/PB9114LLarge.jpg

I know it's a bit "fancy" ... but I've been drooling over this fairly unique pistol for a while now. It's a simple, stripped down, mil-spec with clean lines and shiney nickel. Plus I think it would be cool to carry something that has a history (been around since 1928), powerful enough for defense, and fairly uncommon.

What do you all think about it?


-Raz

 

[BigG]

You should be able to get a pimpin nickel Colt, used but like new for around $300 less. And, it has REALLY been around since 1928, unlike SA. Potomac Arms or Clark Bros will hook you up. Good people.

 

[Sean Smith]

You want "history," buy a Colt. SA doesn't have jack squat for history except for a name that they bought to put on Brazilian 1911s.

Colt has an entire line of flash 1911s floating around out there whose names start with "El".

 

[Raz]

yeah ... you guys are absolutely right about the Colt history thing ...


Originally I looked at the availability of a new Colt .38 super, and I found that they are probably almost impossible to get right now. I may have inaccurate info, but it's my understanding that I may end up waiting a year. The Colt would certainly be the ideal. Plus, another upside to a new Colt (besides being the original) is that they list a little cheaper than the Springfield. It really suprised me.

Of course If I could find a gently used anitique ... well, that's a whole 'nother matter altogether!


As far as Springfield is concerned, I have nothing negative to say. I sometimes carry an XD9 that I absolutely love.

-Raz

 

[prisoner6]

I know that some of the Springfield Armory nickel .38 Supers have shipped. Theres one in the case at local shop here and its been there over a month. May want to have your folks check again.

 

[pogo2]

Polished Stainless?

As an alternative to the SA nickel 38 super, you might consider a polished stainless gun like the following Colt on auction at Gunbroker:

GunBroker Colt 38 Super

I think the polished stainless might hold up better to scratches than the nickel finish, and you can buy the pearl grip panels if you don't like the wood ones on this gun.

 

[BigG]

Like I said, let the guys at Clark Bros or Potomac Arms know what you want and they will scare one up or I miss my guess. Usually Colt Govt Models and Goldcups are tenderly cared for and come in used with no finish wear, etc. for a good price.

 

[Raz]

Like I said, let the guys at Clark Bros or Potomac Arms know what you want and they will scare one up

Yeah, BigG, Potomac Arms is actually where I went here in Alexandria. I don't know how he would feel about me mentioning his name, but I gotta say that guy Ross down there is great. I've done a lot of my gun business with him and have little doubt he'll come through, if anyone can. One of the most professional, easy going, and down to earth gun-mongers I've ever met.

Just for fun, though, I'll try and look up Clark Bros ... I've never been there (or heard of them) before. Worth a shot.


That stainless Colt you pointed me toward looks sharp, pogo2. That's the one I originally considered.


-Raz

 

[Flashpoint]

I plan on getting a .38 super to compliment my 9mm and a 10mm to compliment my .40 cal.

 

[faustulus]

Unless the Colt you get has a ramped fully supported barrel, I would go with the SA. It has been my experince that non-ramped Super 38s are prone to misfeeds and I won't even go into the unsupported barrel issues.

 

[BigG]

Misfeeds, ha ha. The 38 caliber Colts do not misfeed nor do they need a ramped bbl unless somebody is trying to overfill the cases with powder for IPSC or something. Raz's post doesn't mention anything about building a racegun.

 

[faustulus]

No he doesn't mention building a race gun, but he does mention carrying the gun, which I assume means hollow points. Most of the Super 38 defensive ammo is pretty hot (Cor-Bon rates theirs at 1450 fps at 115 gr) and I know that the non-ramped barrels on many 1911s do not like some hollow points. After all the gun was designed with FMJ in mind. That is why 99 percent of new 1911s chambered in anything other than 45 come with the ramped barrel. But the decision is entirely up to Raz, I was just letting him know problems that some have faced.

 

[Raz]

Thanks, faustulus.


That info is good to know...

- Raz

 

[Tamara]

That is why 99 percent of new 1911s chambered in anything other than 45 come with the ramped barrel.

FWIW, neither of my non-.45 1911's (a 10mm and a .38 Super) have a ramped barrel. Both function fine with factory hollowpoints, including Cor-Bon.

 

[BigG]

99 percent of new 1911s chambered in anything other than 45 come with the ramped barrel.

Some pistol smith can chime in but I've been shooting Colts continually since 1970. I've had a pair of Delta Colts in 10mm Auto, a 38 Super GM, a 9mm Commander, a 40 S&W, a 10mm/40 Convertible, innumerable 45 ACPs both Govt and Gold Cup, and a 22 LR. Only the 22 LR had a ramped bbl and that was because the hole was so far up from the frame feed ramp. If you are stoking ammo so hot it needs a ramp, it probably won't pass muster at SAAMI, if that means anything to anybody. My IPSC buddies have raceguns shooting 9mm/.38 bullets at about 1800 fps to make major. If they fired that in a standard bbl they might be holding a hand grenade. I don't know.

A ramped bbl in a Colt/Browning type has some advantages but it also introduces some new problems, as in TANSTAAFL. Cutting the frame at the critical juncture where the slide smacks into it under recoil can help introduce cracks. I know ParaOrd uses ramps on their bbls, but who else? Not Colt.

 

[Sean Smith]

and I know that the non-ramped barrels on many 1911s do not like some hollow points.

You know wrong. Or more precisely, the ramp or absence thereof is not the deciding factor in 1911 feed reliability; actually the opposite can be true. The main advantage of the ramp is that it better contains higher pressures, which typically only matters if you are overloading high-pressure cartridges. And that assumes that the ramp geometry results in more case support, which isn't always so (see a Glock for details).

 

[BigG]

The main advantage of the ramp is that it better contains higher pressures,

This is my understanding also.

I also have a LAR Grizzly 44 Magnum, an Uber-1911-type that has, you guessed it, a standard Colt/Browning frame ramp and bbl interface. Whoda thunk it?

 

[RepublicanMan]

Not sure how relevant this tidbit of personal experience might be to this discussion but........I have a .38 Super Series 80 MK IV that absolute WILL NOT reliably feed Cor-Bon hollowpoints.....it is completely untouched and will be making a trip to the smith shortly to have some polishing work done that should resolve this issue.

 

[faustulus]

Why does everyone get emotional over this? I didn't say it was the case all the time, I didn't say that it would happen. I said it was something that others have encountered in the past and I have worked around guns long enough to know it to be true. I think both guns would be fine, I really don't care which one he chooses, I have owned and shot several 1911s both with and without ramps in several calibers and I didn't mean to suggest that your gun does not work or will not work. So for the record, your gun is just fine, if i insulted your gun I am sorry. But I stand by my statements as they were meant, which was to give the post writer some information on two guns he was considering.
One of these days I will understand the cults of the 1911 and glocks.

 

[Sean Smith]

People weren't getting worked up, your were called on a factual error about ramped barrels and 1911s.

 

[faustulus]

steve,
So your theory is that all things other factors being equal a smooth ramp offers more resistance than a two piece with a horizontal break in the middle? Interesting. I respectfully disagree. I understand that it is not a problem for all guns, but I think you would be hard pressed to find a modern firearm that used the same method. I never said it was a deciding factor only one that could contribute to possible problems.
So I really don't see the 'factual error'