Marshall
Member
Actually no. It's "The High Road" or, TheHighRoad.org
This is the HIGH ROAD isn't it????????
- Thread starter GRB
- Start date
- Status
mindwip
Member
Or AKA THR
Cosmoline
Member
Yup. And when they started "waging war" on us "civilians." I guess the fellow who started this thread equates criticism with criminality. Only criminals and druggies would dare to question the thin blue line or the bold social engineering schemes they've set about trying to stuff down our collective gullets. I'll be interested to see Glenn's followup.
SoCalShooter
Member
I disagree, I dont think its anti-government such as "lets overthrow the government" but I do think a lot of people want LESS government overall.
As for anti-leo I have not seen it, I believe in most cases people on here respect cops, they just dont trust everyone they run into, sometimes in the media police are portrayed poorly same things with movies, and for sure a lot of people who have little or no experience with LEO see this and dislike cops.
dragongoddess
member
Well as I watched the press conference on the lady that was killed in a raid I could not help but come to the conclusion that the Police Spokesman was not telling the truth. His body language totally was opposite of what he was saying. In fact he was so troubled that he had problems reading the prepared statement.
So why don't we trust Police 100%. Simply because so many of us have know Police officers who had problems with the truth. After all they are people too.
Rember what Regan said. Trust but verify.
So why don't we trust Police 100%. Simply because so many of us have know Police officers who had problems with the truth. After all they are people too.
Rember what Regan said. Trust but verify.
Marshall
Member
Glen,
Seriously, in regard to your first post, I "think" I understand your point. Most of us are well able to see the types of posts you're speaking of. Honestly, if you leave them alone, they'll get bored and go away. Or as pointed out, speak your mind and police them in a manner indicative of The High Road and it's values.
You might watch flaming in general though, it's tough for folks to understand over the internet whom you might really be speaking of.
Seriously, in regard to your first post, I "think" I understand your point. Most of us are well able to see the types of posts you're speaking of. Honestly, if you leave them alone, they'll get bored and go away. Or as pointed out, speak your mind and police them in a manner indicative of The High Road and it's values.
You might watch flaming in general though, it's tough for folks to understand over the internet whom you might really be speaking of.
fjolnirsson
Member
I have seen anti gov, anti leo posts here. Matter of fact, depending on who you ask, I fit the bill. I AM, in fact, anti LEO. I AM pro peace officer. There's a difference. I paid my own way through the CA police academy with the intention of fulfilling a lifelong dream to be a cop. To help people. To stop people from hurting innocents.
What I saw and learned in that academy eventually turned me away from that dream. Corruption is rampant in LEO today, because(at least in CA) it is taught as gospel. Us vs them is the mentality. Cops today are(in my experience) indoctrinated to believe that hurting innocent people is simply the collateral damage of a days work.
As far as govt, I take the libertarian/classic liberal/traditional conservative view, which is to say, less government is better. I work for my local government, trying to make changes at the local level to allow folks more freedom.
When I see an obvious abuse of LEO power or failed tactics(such as the Cory Maye case), or what I believe to be such(the Atlanta PD Vs 93 year old woman case), I speak out.
I don't use drugs beyond caffeine and alcohol, and never have. Yet I believe people should put what they choose into their own bodies. To believe otherwise strikes a blow at self-ownership, and thus property rights, and causes the foundations of our republic to crumble.
We have many fine posters and moderators here who are cops, and I believe them to be good ones, or they wouldn't stay here long. Jeff White, Lawdog, IIRC, Glenn Bartley, Bartholomew Roberts, to name a few. I may not always see eye to eye with them, but I believe them to be good men.
I, like many others, see the "War On Drugs" as a primary cause of many poorly thought out laws, and as a primary factor in the erosion of our rights.
What I saw and learned in that academy eventually turned me away from that dream. Corruption is rampant in LEO today, because(at least in CA) it is taught as gospel. Us vs them is the mentality. Cops today are(in my experience) indoctrinated to believe that hurting innocent people is simply the collateral damage of a days work.
As far as govt, I take the libertarian/classic liberal/traditional conservative view, which is to say, less government is better. I work for my local government, trying to make changes at the local level to allow folks more freedom.
When I see an obvious abuse of LEO power or failed tactics(such as the Cory Maye case), or what I believe to be such(the Atlanta PD Vs 93 year old woman case), I speak out.
I don't use drugs beyond caffeine and alcohol, and never have. Yet I believe people should put what they choose into their own bodies. To believe otherwise strikes a blow at self-ownership, and thus property rights, and causes the foundations of our republic to crumble.
We have many fine posters and moderators here who are cops, and I believe them to be good ones, or they wouldn't stay here long. Jeff White, Lawdog, IIRC, Glenn Bartley, Bartholomew Roberts, to name a few. I may not always see eye to eye with them, but I believe them to be good men.
I, like many others, see the "War On Drugs" as a primary cause of many poorly thought out laws, and as a primary factor in the erosion of our rights.
10-Ring
Member
I remember when THR started, it was small enough and there were enough mods to stay on top of most if not all of the threads. I think as we experience growth, we experience some down side....things will swing back but it will take all of us to police our playground
sm
member
Soundtrack.
Hey, now we have something for the Search Function too...
- Nope, I don't do drugs, I don't drink.
I do smoke, shoot guns - so 2 out of 3 on the ATF list ain't bad...
"Us vs Them" - yes we have that, we are going to have that in anything. In fact folks in the same profession are going to disagree. Maybe just me, this "Us vs Them" - should be "Freedom vs Tyranny" and not all this other stuff...just me you understand.
The HighRoad is big, and being big, some Dope's are going to have an email address, get a username and not be civil , polite, and try to learn what we have to offer.
THR is a community, and like a real community, bigger we get, the more potential problems we are likely to have.
Anyone is welcome here, those that think similar, those not sure like Fence Sitters, even Folks against us - Just like a real community, obey the rules agreed to by entering, be civil, polite, and respectful.
If one cannot abide by these simple rules THR has measures it takes. Member self police, and we do have more serious measures.
As a community each member is an ambassador of this community - how we post, reflects what we are.
While I have a very serious side, and I do not do drugs or any illegal activity, I can, and did post , the fact I, as a Responsible Firearm owner, do have a sense of humor, and appreciate certain genre' of music, such as John Prine.
Fence sitter probably our there wondering if any gun owner know who John Prine is, much less like his music.
Now they know there is at least one member here [me] so come on in, register, introduce yourself and make yourself at home...
Illegal Smile: Hey, do not tell me some of you folks have not grinned like you ate the canary shooting a full auto, shooting under the lights on a clay field at white targets, been to a low light/ no light training exercise, in taking a deer, being with your kid, wife or someone when they took their first game, on first hunt...
To some that do not know "Us" - that smile is Illegal. Tyranny for sure thinks it is.
illegal
Hey, now we have something for the Search Function too...
- Nope, I don't do drugs, I don't drink.
I do smoke, shoot guns - so 2 out of 3 on the ATF list ain't bad...
"Us vs Them" - yes we have that, we are going to have that in anything. In fact folks in the same profession are going to disagree. Maybe just me, this "Us vs Them" - should be "Freedom vs Tyranny" and not all this other stuff...just me you understand.
The HighRoad is big, and being big, some Dope's are going to have an email address, get a username and not be civil , polite, and try to learn what we have to offer.
THR is a community, and like a real community, bigger we get, the more potential problems we are likely to have.
Anyone is welcome here, those that think similar, those not sure like Fence Sitters, even Folks against us - Just like a real community, obey the rules agreed to by entering, be civil, polite, and respectful.
If one cannot abide by these simple rules THR has measures it takes. Member self police, and we do have more serious measures.
As a community each member is an ambassador of this community - how we post, reflects what we are.
While I have a very serious side, and I do not do drugs or any illegal activity, I can, and did post , the fact I, as a Responsible Firearm owner, do have a sense of humor, and appreciate certain genre' of music, such as John Prine.
Fence sitter probably our there wondering if any gun owner know who John Prine is, much less like his music.
Now they know there is at least one member here [me] so come on in, register, introduce yourself and make yourself at home...
Illegal Smile: Hey, do not tell me some of you folks have not grinned like you ate the canary shooting a full auto, shooting under the lights on a clay field at white targets, been to a low light/ no light training exercise, in taking a deer, being with your kid, wife or someone when they took their first game, on first hunt...
To some that do not know "Us" - that smile is Illegal. Tyranny for sure thinks it is.
illegal Marshall
Member
I wrote:
fjolnirsson wrote:
OK, so maybe it's not so tough.
fjolnirsson wrote:
OK, so maybe it's not so tough.
romma
Member
I'll bite. I would not so much say I advocate drug use, I would however advocate personal privacy and personal accountability for such matters. I don't think it is our governments business to dictate what grown up and consenting adults do to their bodies. Mind you, I don't use drugs(or alcohol) myself anymore,,, but I did very heavily at one time . Consequently, I am a 12+ yr recovering addict. But I made my own choices.
browningguy
Member
I'll have to agree THR is a pretty civil place, if anything the mods shut down threads way to early.
I'm actually pretty outraged that the unecessary killing of an old women is being used to try to accuse people of LEO bashing. LEO's are just people, some good, some bad, and the bad ones deserve bashing because they are breaking a special duty to serve and protect the citizens of this country.
Although I am fiscally a conservative, I am definately not on the right wing of the republican party, I care more about the constitution and both parties seem to have no problem trashing it. Heck, I'm not even Christian, does that mean I shouldn't be on this board?
As far as LEO bashing, I don't think it happens much at all. People making quick decisions, happens all the time in the real world also.
But talking about killing a 93 year old women in her house, if someone doesn't see something seriously wrong with that then there really is a problem. I don't need any more facts, the system is seriously broke if police can break in a door and kill an old women in her own home, then say it's ok because we followed procedure. I don't care if she was a drug dealer, absolutely no reasoning in the world can make it right, or moral, or whatever terminology you want to use.
I'm actually pretty outraged that the unecessary killing of an old women is being used to try to accuse people of LEO bashing. LEO's are just people, some good, some bad, and the bad ones deserve bashing because they are breaking a special duty to serve and protect the citizens of this country.
Although I am fiscally a conservative, I am definately not on the right wing of the republican party, I care more about the constitution and both parties seem to have no problem trashing it. Heck, I'm not even Christian, does that mean I shouldn't be on this board?
As far as LEO bashing, I don't think it happens much at all. People making quick decisions, happens all the time in the real world also.
But talking about killing a 93 year old women in her house, if someone doesn't see something seriously wrong with that then there really is a problem. I don't need any more facts, the system is seriously broke if police can break in a door and kill an old women in her own home, then say it's ok because we followed procedure. I don't care if she was a drug dealer, absolutely no reasoning in the world can make it right, or moral, or whatever terminology you want to use.
This is an interesting thread. I appreciate the OP starting this. But I think it may have overstated the issues.
I came back over here from another board. My experience is that THR is much more civilized and much less prone to name-calling and real insult-slinging. There is a thread, at least 8 pages long last time I looked, on "sexism within the firearm community" in which only one person has, IIRC, indulged in what I think of as "hit and run" insults. Out of 8 pages, that's pretty good.
People do criticize government and law enforcement when those entities appear to have trampled on the rights of individuals, where rounding up a drug dealer ends up in the death of a 92-year old woman, and others. But what is the alternative? To assume that if the police did it, it must be ok? I am very pro-LE, and I'm aware that the only news items we get about this sort of thing are the ones where something has gone wrong; the thousands and thousands of traffic stops, warranted searches, arrests, etc., where everything is done RIGHT and everybody is still alive at the end of the day are not what we end up reading about. Maybe that's not fair, but it's the way news works.
As to the drug thing, I'm sorry, but I've never seen any glorification of drug use. There is disagreement with current drug law, but so what?
All in all, THR really DOES embody that "high road" principle. It's a good place to be, which is why I'm here.
My $.02, highly overinflated, as usual.
Springmom
I came back over here from another board. My experience is that THR is much more civilized and much less prone to name-calling and real insult-slinging. There is a thread, at least 8 pages long last time I looked, on "sexism within the firearm community" in which only one person has, IIRC, indulged in what I think of as "hit and run" insults. Out of 8 pages, that's pretty good.
People do criticize government and law enforcement when those entities appear to have trampled on the rights of individuals, where rounding up a drug dealer ends up in the death of a 92-year old woman, and others. But what is the alternative? To assume that if the police did it, it must be ok? I am very pro-LE, and I'm aware that the only news items we get about this sort of thing are the ones where something has gone wrong; the thousands and thousands of traffic stops, warranted searches, arrests, etc., where everything is done RIGHT and everybody is still alive at the end of the day are not what we end up reading about. Maybe that's not fair, but it's the way news works.
As to the drug thing, I'm sorry, but I've never seen any glorification of drug use. There is disagreement with current drug law, but so what?
All in all, THR really DOES embody that "high road" principle. It's a good place to be, which is why I'm here.
My $.02, highly overinflated, as usual.
Springmom
So what? They tire of our "bashing".. what do they do? Institute a forum rule where no "bashing" of cops will be allowed? Who defines bashing? Who dicates what is right or wrong? That just goes to prove the point of those who bash. Law enforcement just has to accept that fact that the majority of the populace will not and do not respect them one iota. I'm not saying it's right or wrong.. that's just the way it is. If you became LE for respect then I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. Unfortunately, or fortunately, I guess it depends on how you look at... LE is a profession that serves.. like the military.. you shouldn't require love from everyone to do your job.. you do it because you think it is just and honorable... not because you want respect.
If they wanted people to love them and make lots of money they would start a rock band or something... not become a cop... lets be "real" here. "High road" or not, I've been in the miltary and I never expected anyone to love me or respect me any more than the guy next to me based on that reason... same reason cops shouldn't expect it. It's personal gratification, nothing else. If it were, they would get ticker tape parades, medals and be on Regis every day. They aren't.
I don't care what they think. I have the same voting rights they do. They do their job, I'll do mine.
LandShark
Member
I don't mean any insult by this, but I think that LEO's have to deal with so much rabidly anti LEO crap on a daily basis, from songs about shooting them to biased stories in the news to bad attitudes from the people that they actually deal with, that they mistake a lot of forum members libertarian mistrust and criticism of any authority as bashing. They put up with a lot of crap all the time, that it is also natural for them to circle the wagons to deal with all of it.
I've never seen drugs advocated here, however.
I've never seen drugs advocated here, however.
I was going to post my own response but it would really just look as if I was a parrot on your shoulder. From Jefferson to the ridiculously costly war on drugs to gay marriage and banning my guns. If the federal government was really interested in doing things "for the children," they would pass draconian environmental protection laws so my grandchildren can still see this country for what it is. From the white sandy shores of California, the sweet rolling bluegrass hills of Kentucky, the awe inspiring sea ports in New England that once played a crucial role in the development of our nation ... and even Little Habana down in Southern Florida. Alas, that would require politicians to bite the hand of the large polluting corporations that feed them, so instead they try to take my guns and make air travel ridiculously tedious. All to make the general population "feel" more safe.
There is a world of difference in saying "I think some drugs should be made legal" and "you should not be arrested for using drugs, which is currently illegal."
That's on the same plane as "The speed limit is 60. I was going 75. But in 10 years the speed limit will be 75, so I don't deserve a ticket."
There are some who advocate for changing the law. There are others who state that anyone enforcing the current "bad" law on drugs are the bad guys.
That's on the same plane as "The speed limit is 60. I was going 75. But in 10 years the speed limit will be 75, so I don't deserve a ticket."
There are some who advocate for changing the law. There are others who state that anyone enforcing the current "bad" law on drugs are the bad guys.
X-Rap
Member
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2006
- Messages
- 6,657
As far as drugs and a persons right to use what he wants we need to look at the total libertarian principle and let it run both ways. From the users point as we are all familiar with I'll not deny anyones right to self destruction. Now from the other view as the public or employer. If I as an employer want people to work for me that are clean and void of any mind altering drugs or chemicals be they recreational or religious that is my right as someone who put their a$$ on the line to have a business. As far as the public we have the right to live in peace without being molested or injured by someone under the influence of these compounds If you can get messed up and live under these rules then go in peace. If you cannot than prepare for retribution. Todays lawman does seem to have us against them attitude that must be taught as doctrine today. You can almost draw a line in a group of them by age the oldest being still anchored in the protect and serve mentality although I agree with a previous poster about LE generaly becoming more of an income stream than before.
As to the drug issue......
I've yet to see a post on here advocating illegal drug use. Libertarians are against making drugs illegal b/c of the effect of Prohibition, which gave us organized crime, and b/c of the massive cost of the 'war on drugs', which comprises about half of the police budget across the country. This is a far cry from advocating drug use.
I don't advocate being an alcoholic, yet I think drinking alcohol should be legal. There is a difference. Doing drugs is a downright stupid idea for many reasons, but wasting our money trying to stop people from doing them is the issue that many people have. It empowers drug dealers and the black market. If drugs were legal, Wal-Mart and Sam's Club would have your local street dealer out of business in a week.
As to the LEO issue....
I wouldn't say that people here are anti-police. I think people here are against unethical LEOs and unethical legal policies. There's a difference. The police in my city are great. I love them. They come when I call them, and they don't harass innocent people. My city is safe. It's great. But the police in the town I grew up in were very much the opposite--total bullies. It's like anything else... there are good LEOs & bad LEOs. The LEOs we criticize on here are the bad ones.
I do agree that police departments and our legal system in general have been on a downward slope for a while. I feel that criminals have more rights than victims and that they're rewarded with fame, publicity, and million dollar interviews with Dateline when they commit horrendous violent acts. I also feel that the desire to "make a speedy collar" for a horrible crime sometimes impedes due justice.
That is to say that sometimes I fear the police want to be able to say, "We got the guy!" immediately to get good press, and the DA wants to be able to say, "I have a 99% conviciton rate!" when he runs for re-election. Who's to say that 99% of the people he tried really were guilty? I don't think a conviction rate should be something to brag about or a measurement of performance. Innocent people do get accused of crimes they didn't commit. Yet people get sentenced to prison for ridiculous things these days while criminals are set free over technicalities. Judges rule based on their own opinion or religion instead of the Constitution. The whole system is biased.
Ultimately money wins. Michael Jackson and OJ Simpson get off b/c they have $$$$. Ambulance chasers go nuts putting good people in prison and ruining their careers b/c it makes them millionaires, and yet judges continue to hear these ridiculous cases. The Castle Doctrine laws were long overdue, but were a step in the right direction.
I just think that politics and money have tainted many things in our society, and the legal system is one of them. It's certainly not the only area affected. Look at health care and what managed care has done to our system. It's a mess. Medicare, Medicaid... It's all awful.
So.... don't take offense when we exercise our right to deep discourse. We mean no offense to law-abiding peace officers. There are some great cops out there. I've met quite a few. When we speak negatively, we're speaking of a select few, like the ones who hospitalized the old lady in New Orleans and directly violated the Constitution in doing so. Those are the people who make us mad. Please understand the difference.
I've yet to see a post on here advocating illegal drug use. Libertarians are against making drugs illegal b/c of the effect of Prohibition, which gave us organized crime, and b/c of the massive cost of the 'war on drugs', which comprises about half of the police budget across the country. This is a far cry from advocating drug use.
I don't advocate being an alcoholic, yet I think drinking alcohol should be legal. There is a difference. Doing drugs is a downright stupid idea for many reasons, but wasting our money trying to stop people from doing them is the issue that many people have. It empowers drug dealers and the black market. If drugs were legal, Wal-Mart and Sam's Club would have your local street dealer out of business in a week.
As to the LEO issue....
I wouldn't say that people here are anti-police. I think people here are against unethical LEOs and unethical legal policies. There's a difference. The police in my city are great. I love them. They come when I call them, and they don't harass innocent people. My city is safe. It's great. But the police in the town I grew up in were very much the opposite--total bullies. It's like anything else... there are good LEOs & bad LEOs. The LEOs we criticize on here are the bad ones.
I do agree that police departments and our legal system in general have been on a downward slope for a while. I feel that criminals have more rights than victims and that they're rewarded with fame, publicity, and million dollar interviews with Dateline when they commit horrendous violent acts. I also feel that the desire to "make a speedy collar" for a horrible crime sometimes impedes due justice.
That is to say that sometimes I fear the police want to be able to say, "We got the guy!" immediately to get good press, and the DA wants to be able to say, "I have a 99% conviciton rate!" when he runs for re-election. Who's to say that 99% of the people he tried really were guilty? I don't think a conviction rate should be something to brag about or a measurement of performance. Innocent people do get accused of crimes they didn't commit. Yet people get sentenced to prison for ridiculous things these days while criminals are set free over technicalities. Judges rule based on their own opinion or religion instead of the Constitution. The whole system is biased.
Ultimately money wins. Michael Jackson and OJ Simpson get off b/c they have $$$$. Ambulance chasers go nuts putting good people in prison and ruining their careers b/c it makes them millionaires, and yet judges continue to hear these ridiculous cases. The Castle Doctrine laws were long overdue, but were a step in the right direction.
I just think that politics and money have tainted many things in our society, and the legal system is one of them. It's certainly not the only area affected. Look at health care and what managed care has done to our system. It's a mess. Medicare, Medicaid... It's all awful.
So.... don't take offense when we exercise our right to deep discourse. We mean no offense to law-abiding peace officers. There are some great cops out there. I've met quite a few. When we speak negatively, we're speaking of a select few, like the ones who hospitalized the old lady in New Orleans and directly violated the Constitution in doing so. Those are the people who make us mad. Please understand the difference.
spencerhut
Member
Drug usage? Speaking from the perspective of a person that has never done an illegal drug I can say without reservation that I am completely and totally in favor of legalizing all drugs. Get a prescription from your doctor and have at it I say. Meth 'till you die anyone? Let 'em. Clean up the gene pool a little it would.
The WoD (War on Drugs) has already cost us far more in time, money and lives than prohibition ever did. You want drugs? Fine. Pay the same taxes I have to on beer and knock yourself out.
LEOs? I feel sorry for them. What a thankless low paying job. We should all give them a break. Hell most of the poor SOBs are lucky to stay married because the job messes them up so bad. I live in the sticks, I have never passed by a cop with a car full of people pulled over -ever- without stopping and asking if he was okay. I've helped plenty with some menial stuff over the years. Glad to do it, anything to help someone willing to lay their life down for me and my family. That we allow our government to manipulate these LEOs to battle the WoD is a crime we should all feel ashamed about. Making drugs legal puts so many things right in our country that are so wrong, its worth it. If I hear about one more old lady getting murdered by an otherwise well meaning, do-gooding LEO on the premise they are enforcing a drug law I will cry. The WoD is tearing our country apart, anyone that can’t see it is blind or nuts. How many rights have we (gun owners) lost because of the WoD? The WoD has been used for the past three decades to slowly remove our right to keep and bear arms. Guess what? It’s BS and we’ve all fallen for it or stood by and watched it happen.
The WoD (War on Drugs) has already cost us far more in time, money and lives than prohibition ever did. You want drugs? Fine. Pay the same taxes I have to on beer and knock yourself out.
LEOs? I feel sorry for them. What a thankless low paying job. We should all give them a break. Hell most of the poor SOBs are lucky to stay married because the job messes them up so bad. I live in the sticks, I have never passed by a cop with a car full of people pulled over -ever- without stopping and asking if he was okay. I've helped plenty with some menial stuff over the years. Glad to do it, anything to help someone willing to lay their life down for me and my family. That we allow our government to manipulate these LEOs to battle the WoD is a crime we should all feel ashamed about. Making drugs legal puts so many things right in our country that are so wrong, its worth it. If I hear about one more old lady getting murdered by an otherwise well meaning, do-gooding LEO on the premise they are enforcing a drug law I will cry. The WoD is tearing our country apart, anyone that can’t see it is blind or nuts. How many rights have we (gun owners) lost because of the WoD? The WoD has been used for the past three decades to slowly remove our right to keep and bear arms. Guess what? It’s BS and we’ve all fallen for it or stood by and watched it happen.
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benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
Back in the 1920's, someone criticizing alcohol Prohibition did not mean that the person advocated drunkenness. Prohibition was a failed social experiment, and its irrationality became clearer the longer it was in force.
Same thing today. I have never used illegal drugs and never plan to. But the current approach is doing nothing to reduce drug availability (diacetyl morphine is probably easier to get in a city than prescription foot powder), and is increasingly being used as an excuse to abrogate the second, fourth, and fifth amendments. Prohibition is not working any better this time around than it was last time; I think the difference is, we are less honest about its failures now than people were in the 1920's.
The main problem I had with that raid was that somebody asked for, and got, a NO-KNOCK WARRANT against a 92-year-old woman who lived in a bad neighborhood. Early reports indicated that she had a "gun permit" (CCW?) and no criminal record. The warrant was served by undercover agents wearing "Police" vests but not uniforms.
The FBI has said that no-knocks should NOT be routinely used, for precisely that reason:
The thing that scares a lot of us about the recent shooting of the Atlanta homeowner is, if somebody signs a no-knock on our house (or a knock-and-announce that somebody interprets as a 3-second delay before kicking down the door), we're going to be under the assumption that it's not the police, because the police have no reason to be raiding our house. THAT is where the "us vs. them" creeps in, I think--because the pushing-the-envelope tactics adopted to fight the "War on Drugs" make many honest, law-abiding citizens scared of the police to at least some degree. That is a very, very sad thing to have happen in a free country; only criminals should have to fear the police, IMHO.
I appreciate your post, as I agree that the High Road is a special place, due in part to the high level of civility and mutual respect that has long set it apart from a lot of other forums. I think all of us should keep a sharper eye out for impoliteness, especially in our own posts (and I say that to myself as well). But we also need to recognize that THR *is* a diverse place, with widely diverse political affiliation (repub, dem, indie, libertarian, gun-totin' conservatives AND gun-totin' liberals), religion (from Christian to Wiccan, and everything in between), heterosexuals, gays, lesbians, all "races," geographic origins, and multiple nationalities. The ONE thing that nearly all of us have in common is guns--everything else is going to represent a range of diverse views, and we all need to be able to "live and let live" to a degree.
Outlaws
Member
See, I don't disagree with that. While I do not think the government should be allowed to tell people what they can and cannot do on their own time, I think as an employer/buiness owner, you have the right to decide who works for you. Including drug screening. Infact I would go so far as to say that ideally, you should have the right to discriminate based on any reason you so choose, including race, religion, sex, sexual orientation, age, clothing, hair style, etc. I would say you should even be allowed turn away business because you don't approve of something. That would be freedom. I don't actively support being racist for the sake of being racist, but if someone wants to be racist, its not my right to force them to change. Its my right to not agree and not associate with them, but thats as far as it goes IMO. Same thing with drugs....sans while operating motor vehicles and heavy equipment.
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/10382628/detail.html
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/10374909/detail.html
http://www.11alive.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=88020
It's the news...so don't treat it as gospel!
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