travelling in europe

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bowman

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hi thr,
me and a friend are going to be travelling through europe for 1/1.5 months in the spring. my main question is regarding commonality of robbery and such against tourists. is oc spray or other self defence equipment allowed in most of western europe? and part 2: what is the deal with hostels, are they safe? can i expect theft if i leave a bag there for a few hrs whilst out to eat or at night to a pub or whatevs?

thanks, alot
rob bowie

any other info i may find useful is very welcome:)
 
I can only speak for Germany...

OC is allowed under certain conditions. It's a bit complicated but I'll try to explain it anyway. Generally chemical agents for defensive purposes (that count as weapons under the Weapons Act) must be certified by a certain government agency. For some reason they don't certify OC at the time.

There is, however, a loophole that is being tolerated by the authorities. If it says something like "Animal Defense Spray" on the container it doesn't fall under the Weapons Act anymore and doesn't have to be certified. My advice would be to simply buy such a product over here after your arrival. DON'T bring your own, it's illegal over here.

Most folding knives and ASP-type batons are legal, too.

Hope that helps.


Regards,

Trooper
 
I can't speak for hostel's but I've never had a problem leaving my computer or other valuables in a hotel room in Europe. I do try to minimize the # of times that I do it and keep them out of sight if I do leave them.

As far as being safe it's the same as it is here in the US. Are you safe walking in Chicago? Depends on what part of Chicago you're in and what time of day it is. Just trust your instincts. Doesn't hurt to find a "local" tour guide either. You'd be amazed at how many people will hang out with you if you pick up an occasional beer for them plus you get to see things you might not normally see. I was working in Munich for 2 weeks about 8-10 years ago and one of the young guys I met over there suggested that we go to this little cafe. Turns out the Rolling Stones were in there and even played a little bit with the local band that was on stage. (pretty cool).

Of course I had another incident in Munich where I ended up in a skin-head bar by mistake. Luckily I'm fairly large guy who has his hair cut using a clipper instead of scissors (read that as almost bald. :) ) I was able to get out of that one by pretending that I agreed with their POV and just quietly leaving at the first opportunity.

(I've never run into a problem in Amsterdam, Paris, or London either . . .but I think you need to keep your wits about you . . .don't walk into an Irish bar and start spouting off "politically incorrect" things. :) )

Have a good one,
Dave
 
Regarding Sweden: Just about anything effective is illegal to carry here, including OC, knifes, batons, tear gas, stunguns/tasers etc. However, there are one legal defence spray availible, I think its called Skunk Spray. Hard to get, since its sold by only a few companies, and one have to order it. From what I've heard its somewhat effective though, and gives you the ability to run off/kick em hard between the legs.
Knives are a bit tricky though, I believe that most policemen here would bother much with a Swiss Army Knife, but a "tactial" folder, or a fixed blade will get you into trouble. Also, depending on the situation, one might get charged with breaking the law against carrying knifes even if you have only a small screwdriver. Its all about the situation you are in...
I would strongly advice against bringing in pepperspray from Germany, since it requires a license here (harder to get than a license to carry a firearm I believe :what: ). IOW, it will almost just as bad as carrying a 9mm...
 
The U.K. isn’t to bad safety wise, depends were you are of course. You can’t carry any kind of spray or baton in the UK. Sprays are classed as a firearm over here. I carry a small folder most of the time with no problems. Keep the blade under 2 inches and not a lock knife. I travel all over the UK for work with a Laptop. I tend too secure mine at night with a security wire and lock. I also wedge my door at night, but then I'm a professional paranoid.

Bowman if you need any advice on locations / information about the UK drop me a message.
 
Depends upon which neighborhood you are in ..... just like the USA.

Generally speaking, I found Europe to be pretty safe.

Stay away from any and all political or religious discussions with the locals. Same thing with football (soccer) discussions. Like anyplace, some people get all heated up over politics, religions or sports.

If staying at a hostel, I suggest buying one of those lightweight silk sleep sacks from L.L. Bean. Some people who reside in hostels have questionable personal hygiene practices ..... aka 'street people'.

Be friendly and try to learn some phrases. Most Europeans will bend over backwards to help out a polite tourist.
 
I backpacked around europe for a couple of months, frequently left bags in hostels (but not any valuables, just clothes, etc) and never had any problems.
I got a bunch of those minipadlocks and locked all the zippers on a bag shut if i were leaving it behind. The small backpack i took with me when i went out, i tied shut with rope if i were going to be in places where things could be easily stolen out of it without me noticing (crowds, subway trains, etc.)
 
I have been to a few countries in Europe. I would be careful being a foreigner and packing certain gear, especially since you will travel around to different countries. I think improvising normal gear for self defense might be easier to go around with, and of course more situational awareness.

On the Germany discussion, I too found most of Germany pretty safe. It's beautiful country. There are tensions in some areas over the Turkish population and others since unification. I would like dmftoy1 said about being in Munich and walking into a skin-head neo-nazi bar, be careful about where I would be going to when it comes to bars. Especially if you are not looking too aryan. It's rare, but in cities like Munich and Berlin, there can be problems like any other big city.
 
I've spent a couple of months in Germany

When I was in Germany over a couple of months I accumulated some Euro coins for tipping, small purchases, etc. The tended to wear on my pocket so I used a small stuff sack to hold them. You know us Americans aren''t use to using coins like we use paper. However having that little sack in my coat pocket with 7-10 oz of coins sure smarted if I got hit pulling it out of my pocket too quick.;) ;)
 
If you do not hang out late night at slum parts of towns, there is pretty low chance to be searched by police.

(And they probably do not search someone with a US Passport, but do not try it with a Turkish or Albanian papers):))

There are NO customs, border guards on the internal borders of Schengen Treaty, so state borders are not problem at all.

So practically do not bother too much to carry something effective BUT not a real firearm.

In worst case you can get some money penalty.

CS and/or OC sprays are legal in most parts of Europe.
 
Yeah, Germany in general is pretty safe. Just ask some locals if they know of any not-so-nice neighbourhoods to stay out of.
Click to expand...

I agree. I felt very safe travelling in Germany. Honestly thats the one place I wouldn't even personally bother carrying a self defense tool.
 
If going to Germany, keep away from the parts of town where turks and arabs live, they commit most of the robberies. In Berlin that would be Kreuzberg, Neukölln, and Wedding. Watch out for groups of turkish or arab youths. In Germany, locally buy a can of pepper spray.

In Europe, buy ALL self defense stuff in the country you visit, and only in a shop run by a national of that country. Ask them what is ok.
DO NOT bring anything from one country to another in Europe, you can buy things in Prague which will get you in big trouble in Berlin. When you leave a country, leave your self defense stuff there.

The only thing you can legally carry in all of Europe is a walking cane.
 
rudolf said:
The only thing you can legally carry in all of Europe is a walking cane.
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I don't agree fully here, if I were to walk around with a cane (being a healthy 20 YO), the police would probably confiscate it. Why? Well, its the intent that counts here. If they suspect that I intend to use it as a weapon, irregardless of wether or not I'm only interested in defending myself, then it is a weapon. End of story. If I'm walking around with a baseball bat, I'm in trouble. If I walk around with a baseball bat, glove and ball, things are probably OK.
 
This part of world isn't too crazy, either, but tourists get mugged all the time, as they're not paying attention what's around them. You know, in Tallinn there's even warning signs in the Old Town - be wary of wallet-snatchers. Yeah, moving around with guns is quite hard as different countries have different policy, but gas is usually OK. Baton is not OK around here. Motels? usually safe but be a little paranoid, as reccommended, use cablelock for valuables and keep them out of sight. Hanging a bucket of paint over door will not do, sadly. It helps to have local help, if coming to my corner of Universe, then only ask :)
 
rudolf said:
The only thing you can legally carry in all of Europe is a walking cane.
Click to expand...

Or a well-trained dog.

Even in Sweden, I found I could walk around with a stout walking stick.

On the hostels, I used them frequently as a youth, and never left anything unlocked in them. They were fine. There were, however, a number of sad stories of wallets, cameras and such being removed from bags when left.
 
I don't agree fully here, if I were to walk around with a cane (being a healthy 20 YO), the police would probably confiscate it. Why? Well, its the intent that counts here.
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Definitely not in Germany. You can carry all types of weapons without any kind of permit (except for firearms) as long as they're not prohibited items according to the Weapons Act.

Non-flexible batons, the above-mentioned "animal defense" OC products, CS/CN gas and most knives are legal to own and carry as long as you're over 18 years old.

Just stay away from knives whose blade shoots straight out of the handle (either spring-powered or gravity-powered). Spring-powered folders are okay as long as the blade is not longer than 8,5 cm, its width measures at least 20% of its length and it is not double-edged.

Note: don't carry any kind of weapon while attending a public event (such as a sports match, carnival, demonstration, political rally or concert). It's illegal and will result in criminal charges is you're caught.


Trooper
 
here are some ideas

use thunderwear to carry your money..

carry a fake wallet to give a hostile if he sticks u up..

put a good knife there, and take some lessons on how to use it
 
rudolf said:
DO NOT bring anything from one country to another in Europe, you can buy things in Prague which will get you in big trouble in Berlin. When you leave a country, leave your self defense stuff there.
Click to expand...
I thought I read an anedote about a guy from Prague driving into another European country with a couple hand grenades in his glove box, he told the border guard they were for self defense and was allowed to drive on. :eek:

Kharn
 
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