armoredman
Member
Hmm, oddly enough, when I took auto mechanics in the early 80s I was told that was a tire iron. The inner tubes we used for tubing on snow and water came from truck tires, complete with valve stems sticking out.
Trunk Gun: Smart Investment or Bad Idea?
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michaelbsc
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The inner tubes we used as kids were the smaller ones from auto tires. And you kept a package of patches in the trunk of the car along with a couple of the spoon like tire irons in the lower link.
When you had a flat you had to use the tire irons to get the sidewall of the tire off the wheel. Then fish the inner tube out. Find the hole. Patch it with the patch kit. Fish it back in. Use the tire irons to convince the tire sidewalls back over the wheel rim. (God help you if you let it turn or it would be out of balance.) Then pump the thing for about 72 hours it seemed.
You got any idea how much bigger a tire is than a pump cylinder? Well, think about how many strokes that takes.
But it gets you home from the beach on Sunday afternoon!
Yeah, they sure don't build cars like thy used to. And it's a good thing.
MB
fireman 9731
Member
What about the Gary Fadden incident? A rifle in his truck saved him and his wife that day.
http://www.davehayes.org/2006/02/10/the-gary-fadden-incident
http://www.davehayes.org/2006/02/10/the-gary-fadden-incident
I think the biggest takeaway from that story is to keep a cell phone handy (I understand the event occurred prior to cell phone proliferation) and also to know where the nearest police station is.
The full-auto rifle may have helped him drop the BG, but using it also got him into a lot of trouble. Assuming he was proficient with a sidearm, he would have been better off just using that.
Also, he just happened to have a rifle in his trunk because he was a salesman for HK. That doesn't mean it is wise for average civilians to keep one in the trunk 24/7. Interesting read, though.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Yeah, the Fadden incident did not seem to require a rifle to prevail. Fadden used a rifle because that's what he had, and it certainly worked just fine (though he had some troubles because of the exact nature of it), but I don't really see that the rifle was a compellingly better solution to the problem than a handgun would have been. Further, he was extremely fortunate to even be able to deploy it. A handgun could have been in his hand and ready to go long before the truck was even stopped. He had to create precious few seconds of time and yards of space to be able to exit, retrieve, and ready the rifle before his attacker was upon him.
He made it work because he had to, and kudos to him for that, but I'd consider that event to not be a compelling call for a stashed long-arm over a carried handgun by any means. ONCE he had it deployed, it was superior to a handgun for stopping the threat (as long guns tend to be), but it nearly hurt him by being hard to access/deploy before the shot, and could be argued DID hurt him badly afterward in the defense.
He made it work because he had to, and kudos to him for that, but I'd consider that event to not be a compelling call for a stashed long-arm over a carried handgun by any means. ONCE he had it deployed, it was superior to a handgun for stopping the threat (as long guns tend to be), but it nearly hurt him by being hard to access/deploy before the shot, and could be argued DID hurt him badly afterward in the defense.
Right, (bold is mine).
If he had gotten stabbed in the back as he was trying to unlock the trunk, and the bad guys proceeded to steal his vehicle AND the gun (and likely do unthinkable things to his wife) then the story wouldn't be such a great example.
No, not for me, it's bad enough when your car get's stolen let alone your gun. In NYC, it was actually to leave a "carry gun" in your gar. Until I moved in 94. Cars get stoled so fast there that you have a 50/50 chance wth a nice ride, like a vette-30 minute street time, expect a theft in NYC.
SharpsDressedMan
member
Inexpensive AK variant in 7.62, put together by my brother from a surplus kit. The red dot sight is worth more than the rifle.
[/IMG]
For me the answer is that, these days, I am more likely than not unarmed (not carrying on my person) because I am at a location prohibited by state law (but legal to keep in my car). Or I am on my way to or from said prohibited location.
And my vehicle kit is very comprehensive. I couldn't even remember everything to list it all off the top of my head, but it includes (all quality stuff) the below and more:
Portable jump starter/power source
Jumper cables
D-rings/shackles
Recovery strap
Tarp
Drop cloth
Basic hand tools
Coolant
6 gallons of water
Oil
Radiator hose repair kit
Heater hose repair kit
Duct tape
First aid kit
Fixed blade knife
Spare fuse kit
Spare clothing, boots, and shoes
Hat
Flashlight/batteries
Possibly a spare serpentine belt
Bright yellow safety vest with reflective stripe
Lifeboat ration style emergency food
JustinJ
Member
Even if it were a valid arguement that one should join in a firefight between uniformed police officers and criminals, which it generally isn't, it is now common practice for departments to issue or allow carbines in the patrol cars.
Onward Allusion
Member
Bad things can and will happen when one least expects it. Might as well be prepared. As for providing an easy gun to a BG, the same can be said for just owning a gun in the first place.
Think about this...and this is only an analogy... Should women stop wearing dresses because evil men may be tempted to do something horrible?
Think about this...and this is only an analogy... Should women stop wearing dresses because evil men may be tempted to do something horrible?
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
I know! It must be so because everyone says so. My response remains "LIKE WHAT?"
If you are preparing for something you have to have some idea of what that SOMETHING is, so we can have some idea if the response we're preparing is sufficient or at all appropriate.
So...WHAT is a plausible need that requires a trunk rifle/shotgun?
If we can't think of ONE, plausible, at all likely threat that a rifle or shotgun is needed to solve, and that could be solved realistically with a rifle we keep stored in the trunk of a vehicle, then this whole line of "reasoning" just starts to look like intellectual laziness.
Why?
Because.
Why?
Oh, just because.
Why?
Oh, you just never know.
No, really, WHY?
You never can tell.
Seriously? WHY?
Uh...what about Mumbai?!?!?
Uh huh. :banghead:
Onward Allusion
Member
Like car breaking down in the middle of nowhere or in a bad neighborhood. Er, yes - this has happen to me. When I was 18 my car broke down on the S. side of Chicago. Yeah - it was plenty nice to have than not. Please don't preach about legalities. That was then and this is now and now I am some middle-aged exec with a MBA working for a company you know very well.
Like my ex-father-in-law during the '68 riots in Chicago. Yeah, you betcha he was glad he had a shotgun stashed in his trunk. 3 or 4 of his drugstores got burnt to the ground but he made it home alive.
No, it can't happen again, can it??? Really???
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
We've already assumed a concealed handgun, so how do those situations then justify the risks of leaving a long gun stored in a vehicle 24/7?
My meaning here is that this isn't supposed to be simply what someone once did because they happened to have a rifle in the vehicle that day or a long gun was all they had or could have.
My meaning here is that this isn't supposed to be simply what someone once did because they happened to have a rifle in the vehicle that day or a long gun was all they had or could have.
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srtolly
Member
I've been reading some of this thread. Interesting what others have to say about the subject. Personally I wouldn't keep a gun in my trunk unless I'm going to or from the range. If I have to use a gun and my carry isn't enough I'm gonna get out. I had my car stolen at 3am once by a drunk that didn't want to walk home (I know. How? Don't ask about my stupidity). If that drunk had used my gun in a fit of drunken rage I would feel some responsibility.
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Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk 2
It was "nice to have" as in, in neither case a long gun was actually needed? Or was it actually used in self defense in either situation, other than as a deterrent? And if it was the latter, would a handgun have not sufficed? Ironically, riots are just a reason against trunk guns...looting is rampant; you are more likely to provide a rioter with a riot gun than you are use one in self defense. I understand maybe if made you feel good, but it is false security. Was your ex-FIL driving home with the shotgun out the window blasting away in order to get home?
A pretty poor analogy at that. Temptation to do evil has nothing to do with it, means and opportunity are the issue. I just want to do my best not to provide them the opportunity to acquire the means.
Onward Allusion
Member
Then I say to all y'all - to each their own but please don't pontificate and try to impose your values on others.
Not trying to "force" values on anyone, but just calling into question the statistical likelihood of being able to successfully use a trunk gun for SD, as well as shed light on the likelihood of that gun being stolen.
Similar to if you said you don't trust planes, so you choose to drive cross-country instead. I will point out that, statistically, you are making the higher-risk choice. Just because you have never been in a car accident, but your cousin died in a plane crash, doesn't change that. (But I guess I can understand how someone who lost a loved one in a plane crash may avoid planes, not because it is rational though).
The difference with trunk guns is that the risk isn't solely yours (aside from financial risk) but to society at large.
Similar to if you said you don't trust planes, so you choose to drive cross-country instead. I will point out that, statistically, you are making the higher-risk choice. Just because you have never been in a car accident, but your cousin died in a plane crash, doesn't change that. (But I guess I can understand how someone who lost a loved one in a plane crash may avoid planes, not because it is rational though).
The difference with trunk guns is that the risk isn't solely yours (aside from financial risk) but to society at large.
inclinebench
Member
I keep a rifle behind the seat of my truck 24/7. It has been a blessing on more than one occaision. I started keeping one because I saw a deer get clipped by a train across a river, and watched as the thing suffered for quite some time. I did not want to see that again. So I started to carry a .30-30 behind the seat. Later, a guy broke out of custody, shot and killed a security gaurd, and winged a sheriff's deputy, then fled to my neighborhood. Where he ended up shooting and killing another deputy. My wife took our infant son and headed to my fathers across town. We needed diapers, and formula for the baby. I drove to my neighborhood, and the streets were all blocked off by any municiple worker that could be found. I told the gentleman at the head of my street that I needed to get babyfood and diapers and other things. No police were available to escort me as they were all looking for the bad guy. The gentleman asked if I had a gun handy. I did, and pointed it out to him. He said "go ahead, and watch your ass". I got the supplies without incident, and was thanking my maker that I had a rifle behind the seat.
I have also used my truck gun to shoot coyotes, and pulled it out when a large group of fellows were tresspassing and vandalizing. I just told them to leave as I pulled the gun out. They left without protest. I keep my truck locked and know the risk of possible theft. I weigh this against the good that has already come from having a truck gun, and I can say for certain that I will always have a gun in the truck when it is legal to do so. I dont care what other people do with their tuck/trunk guns, but I stand firmly that it was and is the smart move for me to do so.
I have also used my truck gun to shoot coyotes, and pulled it out when a large group of fellows were tresspassing and vandalizing. I just told them to leave as I pulled the gun out. They left without protest. I keep my truck locked and know the risk of possible theft. I weigh this against the good that has already come from having a truck gun, and I can say for certain that I will always have a gun in the truck when it is legal to do so. I dont care what other people do with their tuck/trunk guns, but I stand firmly that it was and is the smart move for me to do so.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Inclinebench, do you feel that keeping a rifle there meets those needs in ways that your concealed handgun would not, or would not do better? If so, why?
MachIVshooter
Member
Threat, no, but reason, yes. I keep an 870 in my truck because, out here, the likelihood of needing to dispatch a wounded deer on the roadside is a very real one. Did it once with my 10mm Witness Compact, but I'm not always (or even usually) carrying that, and I don't really want to deal with a badly wounded and thus ill tempered 250 lb animal with antlers using my P3AT.
So yeah, I keep a long gun in the vehicle for valid reasons, but it has little to do with defense. A 12 gauge with slugs is far superior to a concealed carry handgun for dispatching wounded animals.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Accepted, if it is legal to shoot on/near roads (or on whatever adjacent property) where you are that might be a perfectly reasonable use. I'm not sure I agree that a 12 ga. slug is requried to put down a wounded 1?0 lb. deer at close range, as opposed to a .45ACP, but that's a discussion for the hunting forum, probably. 
That's a big ol' deer!
My thought is if it is wounded enough that it doesn't flee, it is probably wounded enough to get close enough for a humane kill with a pistol, but then again, that is also very personal and based on your skill and circumstance. It does seem like a valid reason for a long gun though, if only for the fact that if you are in a rural enough area that it is a common problem for you, then you are probably at a lower risk of theft.
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