I would like to acquire some more NFA items. I would like to get my forms pending prior to the changes for trusts taking effect. I plan to buy a .30 cal can and to submit a form on a couple other guns. I also am considering doing a ranch hand just because a shorty lever gun is cool and I like to play cowboy sometimes. I also plan to submit a stamp on a glock mag AR lower. One gun I have wanted for a while is a 9x19 SBR. There are a lot of options in this field. Unfortunately non of them seem to stand out to me as an obvious choice. I have been paralyzed by indecsion and now with the deadline looming and finances strained as I just to squeeze a number of projects in under that deadline I'm trying to finally make up my mind.
I'd love to hear thoughts on which 9x19 rifle to get.
I see this gun filling two possible niches:
First, and predominantly, as a fun gun to shoot 9x19 and suppressed 147 grain sub sonic 9x19. It is more affordable subsonic shooting than the 300 Blk. I like iconic guns and while that takes a back seat for guns that primarily tools for range toys and the personal reference collection its a pro.
Secondly, as a compact gun offering additional capability over a duty sized handgun, but filing a different niche from the 7.62x39, 5.56, and 300 Blk SBRs available to me. This includes suppressed shooting. To be used from 0-150 yards or so.
Categories that weigh into it:
Proven design and quality gun: Since this will become an SBR and part fo the push is to get a stamp in before the trust changes take effect having the thing work right is at an even higher premium than normal.
Small and light: The second use of being a useful intermediate option between a full size handgun and a 10.5" AR isn't really achieved by a gun that's the same size or bigger than a 10.5" AR or an 11.5" AK w/folding stock. Folding or collapsible stocks are a plus here too. I have really come to appreciate them for storing or transporting SBRs.
Shooting suppressed: I would like to be able to use a couple of Octane suppressors on the gun. One in .45 and one in 9x19.
922r:
Many of the pistols that would make a great base for an SBR are able to be imported simply because the are pistols. The ATF had most recently opined that 922r applies to SBRs. I think a fair reading of the law supports that position (that's not to say it isn't a really stupid law). As such 922r is a factor in the decision. It is a factor in terms of whether compliance parts will be required, their cost, and their availability.
Cost:
I'm not filthy rich and as such cost is always a factor. It is even more of a factor given that I am trying to beat the deadline for the trust changes and would like to get as many NFA items as possible prior to those change. I plan to buy a .30 Cal suppressor and so that wraps up about $1k. I have a couple items I already own I'd like to submit forms on too.
RDS Attachment: I'd like to put an aimpoint micro on it.
Other: Other important factors I'm failing to think of right now.
The contenders and the perceived pros and cons:
Uzi
Pros:
Cost ($600)
Iconic
Ease of SBRing. Just requires a stamp and a barrel swap
Cons:
The design is proven but I'd get a UC 9 which although most reviews seem positive, it is Century.
Its not small or light. It is bigger and heavier than my folding stock AK
MP5 (I'm looking at a POF reverse stretch)
Pros:
Iconic (although a purist would call me out on the reverse stretch)
Proven design
Should shoot well suppressed and comes threaded and with with
Relatively compact
Cons:
Expensive. The base price is $1500 and it requires 922r compliance parts. Mags seem to run $30 for POF and up to $70 for real deal HK mags.
I'm yet to use a MP5 with a red dot set up that I like.
Lacks the ergonomics and modern features of some of the other options.
MPX Gen 2
Pros:
AR style controls
Keymod hand guard
Caliber conversion capability
Ease of mounting a red dot
Cons:
Gas to the face when shooting suppressed seems to be a real issue.
Although its Gen 2, sig has had issues in releasing new guns lately
Mags are absurdly expensive
Its not real cheap at $1300 and about $200 for a stock (but it is less than the MP5)
Uzi Pro
Pros
One of the smallest and lightest options
Mags are reasonably priced
RDS easy to mount
Cons
I haven't found any 922r parts so this may be a total no starter
It might be just about as useful with just a brace
Barrel isn't threaded.
TMP
Pros
Small and light
Cons
Price
Availability
922r parts?
Suppressor compatability(?)
Scorpion
Pros
Affordable at under $800 and $200 for stock and compliance parts
Mags are affordable.
Seems to have less gas in the face than the MPX
Cons
I'd rather have a gen 2 than gen 1
Availability
Trigger is said to be less than stellar
Full Auto Mac
Pros:
Its a real sub gun
Lage slow fire upper makes it a pretty useful tool
Can mount folding stocks and RDS
Can shoot suppressed
Can do a .22LR lage upper
Cons
Price
Finding one for sale that I can get pending in time.
Price
Kriss V
I haven't seen the 9x19 version and haven't given the 45 a hard look but would be interested in hearing input on it
Keep in mind I'm going to build out the 9x19 AR at some point. I have a sub 2000. I have other SBRs in real rifle calibers .
I'd love to hear thoughts on which 9x19 rifle to get.
I see this gun filling two possible niches:
First, and predominantly, as a fun gun to shoot 9x19 and suppressed 147 grain sub sonic 9x19. It is more affordable subsonic shooting than the 300 Blk. I like iconic guns and while that takes a back seat for guns that primarily tools for range toys and the personal reference collection its a pro.
Secondly, as a compact gun offering additional capability over a duty sized handgun, but filing a different niche from the 7.62x39, 5.56, and 300 Blk SBRs available to me. This includes suppressed shooting. To be used from 0-150 yards or so.
Categories that weigh into it:
Proven design and quality gun: Since this will become an SBR and part fo the push is to get a stamp in before the trust changes take effect having the thing work right is at an even higher premium than normal.
Small and light: The second use of being a useful intermediate option between a full size handgun and a 10.5" AR isn't really achieved by a gun that's the same size or bigger than a 10.5" AR or an 11.5" AK w/folding stock. Folding or collapsible stocks are a plus here too. I have really come to appreciate them for storing or transporting SBRs.
Shooting suppressed: I would like to be able to use a couple of Octane suppressors on the gun. One in .45 and one in 9x19.
922r:
Many of the pistols that would make a great base for an SBR are able to be imported simply because the are pistols. The ATF had most recently opined that 922r applies to SBRs. I think a fair reading of the law supports that position (that's not to say it isn't a really stupid law). As such 922r is a factor in the decision. It is a factor in terms of whether compliance parts will be required, their cost, and their availability.
Cost:
I'm not filthy rich and as such cost is always a factor. It is even more of a factor given that I am trying to beat the deadline for the trust changes and would like to get as many NFA items as possible prior to those change. I plan to buy a .30 Cal suppressor and so that wraps up about $1k. I have a couple items I already own I'd like to submit forms on too.
RDS Attachment: I'd like to put an aimpoint micro on it.
Other: Other important factors I'm failing to think of right now.
The contenders and the perceived pros and cons:
Uzi
Pros:
Cost ($600)
Iconic
Ease of SBRing. Just requires a stamp and a barrel swap
Cons:
The design is proven but I'd get a UC 9 which although most reviews seem positive, it is Century.
Its not small or light. It is bigger and heavier than my folding stock AK
MP5 (I'm looking at a POF reverse stretch)
Pros:
Iconic (although a purist would call me out on the reverse stretch)
Proven design
Should shoot well suppressed and comes threaded and with with
Relatively compact
Cons:
Expensive. The base price is $1500 and it requires 922r compliance parts. Mags seem to run $30 for POF and up to $70 for real deal HK mags.
I'm yet to use a MP5 with a red dot set up that I like.
Lacks the ergonomics and modern features of some of the other options.
MPX Gen 2
Pros:
AR style controls
Keymod hand guard
Caliber conversion capability
Ease of mounting a red dot
Cons:
Gas to the face when shooting suppressed seems to be a real issue.
Although its Gen 2, sig has had issues in releasing new guns lately
Mags are absurdly expensive
Its not real cheap at $1300 and about $200 for a stock (but it is less than the MP5)
Uzi Pro
Pros
One of the smallest and lightest options
Mags are reasonably priced
RDS easy to mount
Cons
I haven't found any 922r parts so this may be a total no starter
It might be just about as useful with just a brace
Barrel isn't threaded.
TMP
Pros
Small and light
Cons
Price
Availability
922r parts?
Suppressor compatability(?)
Scorpion
Pros
Affordable at under $800 and $200 for stock and compliance parts
Mags are affordable.
Seems to have less gas in the face than the MPX
Cons
I'd rather have a gen 2 than gen 1
Availability
Trigger is said to be less than stellar
Full Auto Mac
Pros:
Its a real sub gun
Lage slow fire upper makes it a pretty useful tool
Can mount folding stocks and RDS
Can shoot suppressed
Can do a .22LR lage upper
Cons
Price
Finding one for sale that I can get pending in time.
Price
Kriss V
I haven't seen the 9x19 version and haven't given the 45 a hard look but would be interested in hearing input on it
Keep in mind I'm going to build out the 9x19 AR at some point. I have a sub 2000. I have other SBRs in real rifle calibers .