Two Missions, Two Paths, One Gun

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TarDevil

TarDevil

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Time to buy a rifle. It won't get used a terrible lot unless my wife takes a likin' to it, but I want a long gun that will hunt (deer and pigs, medium to short range) and be a decent SD rifle.

I've leaned long and hard toward a side gate loading lever gun, most likely in .30-30. This appeals to me because I like the ease of reloading on the fly (kinda like my wife's bottom feeding 12 ga pump). The round is readily available, carbines are readily available and they're durable. I might consider .44 Magnum. Maybe. Convince me. Question... how easy are they to load?

I'm not ruling out a semi-auto. If I went that route I'd look first at the Ruger Mini-Thirty in 7.62x39. Always wanted one, but people here run hot and cold on those rifles. I'm not at all considering anything in 5.56 so if - IF - I could be convinced to look at AR's (they've never appealed to me) it would be a -10, probably in 6.5 Creedmoor. This option actually is gaining traction in my head.

Ok, go.
 
44mag is easy to load. It packs a heck of a wallop. But its limited to about 100 yds. 30-30 has more distance and probably a similar punch.

I like the mini 30 idea. Hunting with an AR just doesn't seem quite right to me. I generally take my 243 Rem 700 out for deer. Occasionally, if im planning on walking a bunch, I take the ruger 96/44 lever action. It feels like it weighs about 4 pounds lol. So light and handy.
 
A 44 mag levergun will hold more cartridges than the 30-30, and has a bigger bullet for knocking things down. It's also quite a bit quieter than a 30-30 inside the house. But the 30-30 has a lot flatter trajectory for easier long range shooting.

In a semi auto rifle the ar15 is a great balance of compromises, but I will admit I'm not really enamored with 5.56 either. I have them, and they shoot great, but I prefer a bigger bullet than 5.56 can easily run reliably. There are at least half a dozen viable cartridge options though that have increased performance over 5.56 in an ar platform before stepping up in size (and weight) to the ar 10. Look at the 7.62x39, 6.5 grendel, 350 legend, or the new Hornady 6mm ARC. None of these quite equal the power of the 30-30, but they come close, and many extend the range of usefulness a bit further than 30-30 in a levergun.
 
I happen to really like minis, so that would be my first and last stop. Im waiting for a .350 legend mini, instead of getting a mini-30 but that's just cause for what I would use it for 180-220gr bullets are more where I wanna be.

If going with a lever gun, I'd go with a .30-30 over a .44 if it's the ONLY long rifle you own. While the .44 offers excellent performance, I think the .30-30s greater ease of use at range, makes it a better choice for a single long gun user. You can also load down the .30-30 with 110gr carbine bullets if desired.

The AR is the practical choice. With 3 uppers you could conceivably shoot anything from mice to moose at reasonable ranges.
Personally I don't care for them either, but the functionality is there.
 
LoonWulf said:
I happen to really like minis, so that would be my first and last stop. Im waiting for a .350 legend mini, instead of getting a mini-30 but that's just cause for what I would use it for 180-220gr bullets are more where I wanna be.

If going with a lever gun, I'd go with a .30-30 over a .44 if it's the ONLY long rifle you own. While the .44 offers excellent performance, I think the .30-30s greater ease of use at range, makes it a better choice for a single long gun user. You can also load down the .30-30 with 110gr carbine bullets if desired.

The AR is the practical choice. With 3 uppers you could conceivably shoot anything from mice to moose at reasonable ranges.
Personally I don't care for them either, but the functionality is there.
Click to expand...

I am one of those with the single AR15 with 3 different uppers: 5.56, 6.5G, and 50B. But I also prefer wood and steel on my rifles.

I love the way the wood and steel ruger semi autos feel. The mini is a bit heavy, especially compared to the 99/44 deerfield, but isnt limited to a measly 4 round mag. Ive only shot a mini 14 in 223. I suppose i personally wouldnt overlook the sks either, as its a great all-around firearm.
 
LoonWulf said:
Sure you can! You just have to admit that personal preferences, out way practicality at times!
I don't shoot my ARs very often, but I keep building em.......that's about as backwards as you can get ...
Click to expand...
This is me... I have built so many ars I can't count, but wood and steel is what moves me... A mini in 350 legend would be superb..
 
TarDevil said:
Time to buy a rifle. It won't get used a terrible lot unless my wife takes a likin' to it, but I want a long gun that will hunt (deer and pigs, medium to short range) and be a decent SD rifle.

I've leaned long and hard toward a side gate loading lever gun, most likely in .30-30. This appeals to me because I like the ease of reloading on the fly (kinda like my wife's bottom feeding 12 ga pump). The round is readily available, carbines are readily available and they're durable. I might consider .44 Magnum. Maybe. Convince me. Question... how easy are they to load?

I'm not ruling out a semi-auto. If I went that route I'd look first at the Ruger Mini-Thirty in 7.62x39. Always wanted one, but people here run hot and cold on those rifles. I'm not at all considering anything in 5.56 so if - IF - I could be convinced to look at AR's (they've never appealed to me) it would be a -10, probably in 6.5 Creedmoor. This option actually is gaining traction in my head.

Ok, go.
Click to expand...

What kind of SD do you consider you may encounter ? Single / 4ish people at once ? .... or a possible mob mentality group.

I like Lever Guns, and own a 44Mag, and 45/70... they aren't as quick to reload as a mag fed rifle.. but if you are concerned with small count groups. I could see it being just fine.
A typical 30/30 SP bullet will work.
A 44Mag HP will work.

If you are concerned about larger groups in a SD scenario , I would tend to steer you towards a mag fed SA.

Given your dual roll request.... and these are just a few thoughts.

If you were content with a 7.63x39 rifle... any reason not to consider a SKS or a AK47 ? Accuracy can be adequate within its envelope , especially if a ammo the barrel likes is used ( Maybe Hornady 123gr SST ammo shoots far better then ComBloc ammo from my 7.62x39 rifles.
A well made AK can be crazy reliable.... and the magazines are fool proof ... provided you don't buy the cheapest stuff out there.
Mags and ammo are readily available.
SKS's are built like a dependable tool... 10rd box mag, easy to fill via stripper clips or by just opening the box and dumping rounds into the opening. Decent accuracy given the cost of the rifle.

A 300BK AR with 110-130ish gr supersonic ammo... might be GTG... I get a 16" barrel length to squeeze as much velocity as possible out of it.
Mag fed, similiar to a 30/30 within 100ish yards... I'd be happier with about 200FPS faster ammo ( 300Ham'R ) to extend the hunting distances though.
Ammo... good expanding ammo is tough to come by currently, because of the panic.

Another suggestion is 6.8 SPC...( Basically a .270 bullet in a AR15 platform. ) in an AR. IMHO, Great cartridge.. excellent ballistics, plenty accurate.... a lot going for it in the close to medium range world.
The downside is, it never really caught on. So ammo can be awkward to purchase. ( Not readily available ) Frankly if good ammo was more readily available I would own , and use one frequently.

Lastly... and this will be a heavier option. Even with a light weight barrel.
A .308 Large Frame AR.
Ammo supply is very , very available, with a ton of great choices.. big or small, 2 footed or 4 footed the 308 can step up to the plate and deliver. Heck even cheap SP hunting ammo just works.
Mags are dependable.
Accuracy can be very,very good... plenty of distance available from a 308 round.
Might be a little more cartridge and rifle ( weight ) then desired given your specs.

Any how just a few thoughts.

Good luck , and keep us posted ... I am curious as to your final choice.
 
Given the dual role and limited range, I'd opt for a lever action in .44 magnum. Load up some .44 specials for self defense. If defense were the first priority, I'd prefer a .357 mag, but not for hunting deer and pigs.

You'll have to compromise to cover both roles. My preference would be a bolt action rifle in a medium bottle-necked cartridge (almost anything from 6mm/243 to 7mm/284) for hunting and a magazine-fed pistol caliber carbine for self defense; I'm not really an AR guy, even though I own one.

YMMV.
 
Last edited:
bfoosh006 said:
What kind of SD do you consider you may encounter ? Single / 4ish people at once ? .... or a possible mob mentality group.
Click to expand...
Lordy, I don't plan these things!
bfoosh006 said:
any reason not to consider a SKS or a AK47
Click to expand...
I've shot them, I wanted to think they were heavy
bfoosh006 said:
Another suggestion is 6.8 SPC...( Basically a .270 bullet in a AR15 platform. ) in an AR
Click to expand...
I was a big fan but as you say, didn't get traction.
 
From a practical perspective the Mini-30 is the logical choice. I don't dislike the Ruger Mini family of rifles, but can't bring myself to pay double what an AR15 will cost to buy one. For 1/2 the money of the Mini-30 I'd buy the ranch rifle in 7.62X39 and learn how to run a bolt rifle fast. With practice you can get off "AIMED" shots as fast as you can with a lever action. You can empty the magazine faster on a semi, but if you intend to hit something there isn't much if any difference in speed.. It uses the same magazines too.

https://ruger.com/products/americanRifleRanch/specSheets/16976.html

The lever action in 30-30 is the least practical. But it will fill the role. Plus it's almost Un American to not own a lever action in 30-30. So of the options you listed the 30-30 is my pick.

The AR-10's are going to be a big, heavy rifle, plus they get pricey. If I were going AR, it'd be AR15. If I want a 308 class cartridge then make it a bolt gun. The 223/5.56 round works for me. But there are other options for those who want another cartridge. The 6.5 Grendel is the one most appealing to me if 223/5.56 is off the table.
 
Almost anything loads easily enough if you practice and enjoy shooting it.

I’d go for the Marlin 30-30. Fun. Also versatile. But any rifle will be deafening inside. Not my first pick for in home self defense. Doable though.
 
So if the rifle is to be a hunting gun first I'd start with a lever in really any cartridge but I'd opt for one of the "tacticool" models that Henry, Marlin, and Rossi just came out with. Main reason is threaded barrels to put a suppressor on to help with any indoor shooting. Personally I'd look at the Henry in 45 colt but that is mainly because my stepdad already loads for it and I could piggyback off his experience with the cartrige.
https://www.henryusa.com/rifles/big-boy-x-model/

If a defensive gun first I'd be sorely tempted by a mini but would first look to a SCR lower from Fightlite and then pop an upper in 350 legend or 300 black on top of it. Get a bunch of the benefits of an AR with the classic look and feel of a mini.
https://fightlite.com/lowers/scr-rifle-lowers
 
TarDevil said:
probably in 6.5 Creedmoor. This option actually is gaining traction in my head.
Click to expand...

A 6.5Grendel in an AR-15 would save you two or more pounds, several hundred dollars of what I can only figure to be “AR10 Tax” by the makers, and be every bit as effective at all the activities you have planned as any other cartridge, while providing reach for the only time The Big One gave you a shot and just stood there at 275 yards.

It’s like a 6.8, without the goofy bullet diameter.:)

Magazine changes are faster than a single cartridge at a time and come in twenties or more, so farther in between fill-ups.

somethingbenign said:
Main reason is threaded barrels to put a suppressor on to help with any indoor shooting.
Click to expand...
Another good feature already present on any AR barrel.

The downside is, hmm. I can’t really see a down side. Maybe getting one right this second might be a little challenging.
 
somethingbenign said:
If a defensive gun first I'd be sorely tempted by a mini but would first look to a SCR lower from Fightlite and then pop an upper in 350 legend or 300 black on top of it. Get a bunch of the benefits of an AR with the classic look and feel of a mini.
https://fightlite.com/lowers/scr-rifle-lowers
Click to expand...
I'll spend some time looking at this today!

I've got a lot to learn about the AR world, should I take that path. Lots of options.
 
I haven't had a chance to see one in person yet but I really like the concept of the Henery side gate loading levers that also have a removable tube for quick loading or quick unloading without working every round through the action.

BUT if it is going to be your wife's rifle you had darned well better take her along and let her pick out what she likes. If you pick out a rifle for her it is almost guarenteed that she won't take a liking to it.
 
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