U.S. Pastor Gets 3+ Years for 20rds in Russia

[strat81]

And how much com-block ammo is imported into this country??? Ironic.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

Doesn't fit the crime. Too harsh. Maybe a fine or 30 days at most - it's hunting ammo, gawdsakes!

 

[-v-]

PremiumSauces, what's the difference between the hunting ammo for a Remington 700 series rifle in .308 and M-24 sniper rifle chambered in 7.62x51?

Moral of the story, read what it says in our passport about being subject to foreign laws, and read up on foreign laws especially in regards to anything firearms related, if you're bring in anything like that!

For most countries, their view on "weapons of war" or "guns" is much different then their view on tidy-whities, or a few liters of alcohol.

Also, as others have said, American citizen ship does not grant us de-facto diplomatic immunity to foreign laws. Its just like going over to visit someone else's house. You follow their rules or else you deal with their penalties. Doesn't matter if its something innane like "you must wash your hands after greeting strangers" if its the law, you do it and if you don't like it, don't visit.

 

[Robert Hairless]

As I've often read in this forum, "If you can't do the time, don't do the crime."

 

[jaholder1971]

We demand that those visiting our country respect our laws, so should we when visiting a foreign country.

The bozo probably thought since he was a pastor he could get away with it. Too bad, so sad.

 

[SSN Vet]

loss of perspective casualty....

uh .... duhh!

Having been through customs in Moscow myself....all I can say is that this was an absolutely STUPID move.

It aint exactly a free country over there.

I hope his appeal goes well and that he doesn't have to rot in a Russian prison for three years......that's not a place you ever want to find yourself.

 

[SSN Vet]

I doubt any person that has responded to this thread has ever been to Russia or even knows any Russians, so the accusations of religious persecution do not ring true or accurate. The PEOPLE of Russia always were and continue to be God fearing. It was the STATE that held down those freedoms and they are no longer in power.

Uh...

wrong!

I've been there...met many wonderful people there...still have contact with several of them.

My wife worked for five years in Russia for two different Christian organizations.

If you're not Russian Orthodox.....your "religous freedoms" are very precarious.

And for what it's worth....at the leadership level, the Russian Orthodox church was SEVERELY compromised under their 70 years of communist oppression.

In the last five years, the Russian government has been tightening up and revoking registrations for many churches and religious organizations. No registration....no legal standing. You try to plant a new church in a town where there isn't one or host a small prayer group in your home.....your at risk of being charged with operating an "illegal" unregistered religious organization.

It was only four or five years ago that we received photo's of busses of people that showed up to a well publisized open air prayer service, only to be clubbed in the head and carted off to prison....... women! clubbed in the head along with the men.....and bussed off to jail for holding a prayer service that they had a permit to hold!

Sorry Charlie......

I love the Russian people.....but they are living under some pretty oppressive circumstances. And it's getting worse....not better.

 

[sanglant]

“I see nothing, nothing!” hehe







sorry,, but it i just couldn't help meself

 

[Robert Hairless]

I doubt any person that has responded to this thread has ever been to Russia or even knows any Russians, so the accusations of religious persecution do not ring true or accurate. The PEOPLE of Russia always were and continue to be God fearing. It was the STATE that held down those freedoms and they are no longer in power. FWIW I have met 100's if not 1,000's of Russians. I have found them to be the most 'American like' of nearly any nationality in the world except Canadians.

What an odd combination of statements to make in this kind of forum. I suppose it's possible that the entire allotment of Russians ever allowed into this country was originally shipped to Texas, but its borders must be exceptionally porous because there are at least a few Russians who have escaped into other parts of the United States where they freely mingle with other people.

There also are Russians in Brighton Beach, New York, which is not yet in Texas but it continues to have high aspirations so there is still hope. They look like ordinary people, not like Canadians.

I hate to brag but I've even seen a great many real Russian babies. I know they were Russian because all of them said "Yes" twice in Russian: "Dada." Or maybe they were retrogressive artists pledging allegiance to Tristan Tzara. I'm easily confused so anything is possible for me except doubt that only one person in this thread has ever known a Russian. Now if you want to talk about insularity, I'd bet that not one person who contributed to this thread has ever married an aardvark. Not legally, I mean. I don't approve of common law relationships with aardvarks.

That's my contribution to sophisticated international lore on the Internet for tonight.

 

[ASM826]

It isn't just Russia

Think about having a spare magazine in a trouser pocket that gets packed for a trip, and that magazine, full of modern self-defense loads, get found at the Newark airport. How long are you going to jail for in New Jersey for a magazine full of hollow points? What sort of legal repercussions will follow you? Will you lose your right to even own a firearm in your home state?


__________________________________________
Freedom isn't free, it's bought and paid for in blood.

 

[mrsig]

Does being a felon in Russia now preclude him from owning guns in the US?

- Sig

 

[lvcat2004]

^^Practically speaking, no. There is no way that a U.S. Justice system/authorities would efficiently communicate with Russian authority to have that info unless you volunteer that information. Heck, they can't even communicate domestically among themselves.

 

[kentucky bucky]

Let me get this straight, Russia can sell thousands of guns and millions of rounds of ammo in our country, but one box of hunting loads gets you hard time in a Russian hell hole? I SURE the Russian mafia goes buy this law, and if they did get caught they would just bribe the judge. S.O.P. in that God forsaken sewer. Just another reason to never go there.

 

[Robert Hairless]

Let me get this straight, Russia can sell thousands of guns and millions of rounds of ammo in our country, but one box of hunting loads gets you hard time in a Russian hell hole?

Illinois gun makers probably sell thousands of guns to people in Vermont, but a Vermonter who gets caught carrying one little gun while in Illinois can do hard time in an Illinois hell hole.

 

[Old Fuff]

You are right of course, but I'm delighted to say that most if not all of the gunmakers in Illinois have been jumping ship - and taking jobs and tax payments with them.

 

[Muzzy_B]

Hello friends,
Out of respect for each other, Pastor Philip, Philip's family, and the Russian community that he loves, can we please stop the bickering? Philip knows he made a hugely boneheaded move. He'll be the first to tell you that. Nothing any of us can say on this forum can change what he did or what has come as the result. After his release he will still love the Russian people he has visited, fed, clothed, and witnessed to over the years. Pastor Philip is an amazing individual with an equally amazing wife and family. They are the most generous and humble people I have ever had the priviledge to call friends (even after he convinced me to speak in front of our huge congregation after visiting me and my wife at the hospital when our daughter was born). He will make the most of his situation and chaulk it up as a learning lesson. I'm excited for his release, even if it is 3 years from now, because I know it will make great campfire talk when I finally take him deer hunting at my family's place in Alabama- a trip to which he's asked me to include him on a couple of times recently. In the meantime, Conway, South Carolina will miss him greatly.

 

[Daemon688]

So, what would happen if I tried CCW through Canada and got stopped by the mounties? Imagine what would happen to you if you walked into NYC carrying a single new AR mag and you got busted (but it's just one magazine!). There are consequences for your actions and don't be surprised if foreign governments are particularly harsh if you break their laws.

 

[Muzzy_B]

Daemon688,
I hope you weren't referring to my last post, but instead to someone else's. If your post is in response to mine, then you misunderstood what I was trying to say and I may need to edit mine for clarity. I wasn't making excuses for anyone. He broke the law. He knows it, I know it, you know it, we all know it. I was just hoping that we could put the banter aside and keep this man, a pro 2A man who's on our side, in our thoughts and prayers. I doubt there are very many people, who, if found in the same situation and were facing jail time in any prison, much less a Russian prison, would not ask the sentencing judge for mercy and understanding.

 

[Robert Hairless]

Old Fuff:

You are right of course, but I'm delighted to say that most if not all of the gunmakers in Illinois have been jumping ship - and taking jobs and tax payments with them.

I'd known of Les Baer's escape but I hadn't realized it was a mass breakout. Good for the others. It's hard to leave home, but when it becomes hostile it's best to emigrate to friendlier lands. They might even come to like the United States of America even better than Illinois.

I wonder if the hostiles who control places such as Illinois think about these matters in terms of jobs and tax payments. They are a moral people, as are most other inhabitants of this continent, and where morality and principles are concerned there is no sacrifice too great to appease the gods. Many gun owners seem to think the same way, which speaks to the universal brotherhood of mankind.

The rest of us can use the money, though, so everything does work out okay in the end.

 

[K3]

So, if one does want to hunt in Russia, is it better to procure a rifle and ammo while there?

 

[shdwfx]

Muzzy,

Thanks for that information. I'll be praying that the judge for your Pastor Philip's appeal considers the circumstances and grants clemency.

Having said that, I'm appalled at the reactions of some on this forum which is (I summarize) "the arrogant American pastor got what he deserved." Shame. That attitude isn't even worth debating.

 

[Skoghund]

Ignorance of another countries laws is no excuse. 3 years may seem harsh. Then again i see what mild punishment you hand out in the USA. Just because he is American why should he be treated any different. But i'm only an English man from a backward country.

 

[Pilot]

So, if one does want to hunt in Russia, is it better to procure a rifle and ammo while there?

Yes. A friend of mine hunted in Russian and he rented the rifles and bought ammo in Russia. Pretty expensive trip.

 

[shdwfx]

Just because he is American why should he be treated any different.

You are arguing with yourself on that. Has anybody said he should be?

 

[RPCVYemen]

Think about having a spare magazine in a trouser pocket that gets packed for a trip, and that magazine, full of modern self-defense loads, get found at the Newark airport.

And then tell them that you intended to take the ammo to a friend - you had not left it in your pocket, nobody has slipped it in your pocket, etc. My guess is that the judge will not buy the "I assumed the laws were the same in Wyoming and NJ" argument.

Mike