Wadcutters?

[Puncha]

For the truely recoil and blast sensitive,

will standard 148gr .38 Special wadcutter loads fired from a 6" barrel .357 magnum revolver be effective as a self preservation round?

If we consider that the wadcutters first have to penetrate one layer of cotton and one layer of denim, how much penetration will it achieve through ballistic geletine?

Lastly, is $84 for a batch of 500rds of .38 special remington wadcutters a good deal?

 

[MCgunner]

Just going on energy, it'd be about the worst choice in the caliber, but on par with .32 auto I reckon. The blunt bullet should do better than a round nose for damaging tissue, though there ain't a lot of energy there.

All in all, I'd try a .32 H&R mag if I was recoil sensitive before I'd rely on .38 wadcutters. Not sure about recoil of the .32 other than it's lighter than .38 defense loads or your particular recoil tolerance.

I reckon wadcutters are better than throwing bricks, though. I load a light wadcutter round for my .38/.357 revolvers that is accurate. Remington's hollow base loads are astoundingly accurate, but mine work pretty danged good for small game hunting. Often, I'll carry a .38 afield with wadcutters in it for small game reasons. If I met a BG out there, I reckon that's all I'd have, though I don't lose sleep over that possibility.

 

[Old Fuff]

It may depend on other factors, such as distance and barriers between the shooter and attacker, but what really matters is not so much what the bullet is, but where it hits. The idea is to disable an attacker as quickly as possible so that they cannot continue to be a threat.

The 148-grain midrange .38 Special cartridge will unquestionably do this, particularly if the bullet damages something in the attacker's central nervous system. Otherwise it may not. The most powerful of loads is worthless is the shooters misses.

I would say the quoted price isn't bad, but it isn't especially good either. I would shop around a bit.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

We're talking about two different things here, wadcutters as bullets, and wadcutter loads.

Wadcutter loads that you buy across the counter are loaded for punching holes in paper. They are not designed as self-defense rounds. Typically, they will not have muzzle velocities of rounds designed for self-defense.

On the other hand, the wadcutter shape is a good one for both penetration and making a wide wound channel. If you load a wadcutter to higher velocities it will perform better than a roundnose in a self-defense situation. This, of course, brings us to the whole can of worms over should you use handloads for self-defense.

 

[greatgoogamooga]

Gonna hafta agree with Vern. If it's recoil you're concerned about, you may want to look into some of the new low recoil defense loads like the Federal stuff:

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=211732

I imagine it' sstill got more oomph to it than a wadcutter, but it may be worth looking into. If you feel safe shooting reloads for self defense (I don't) you can try different powders for a soft feeling recoil, that still has the velocity. I like AA #2 in .38 for this purpose.

Keep in mind, it's not always about speed or weight wth self defense ammo. a 125gr hollowpoint has less weight than the wadcutter, but has more stopping power because of the expansion. Wadcutters dont' expand as much and may not stop, but rather go right through the BG.

Goog

 

[Quantrill]

I think Vern is pretty close. The standard .38spec wadcutter load is designed for punching those nice round holes in bullseye targets. BUT increase that velocity some and you just could have a bear. For example, I load my target .38s with 2.5gr of 700x. BUT increase that load to 3.8grains of that same 700X and you have an effective round especially for a snub. Quantrill

 

[JohnKSa]

Wadcutter bullets are usually dead soft since they're designed for low velocity target work. Expect a lot of leading if you push them fast.

 

[Standing Wolf]

will standard 148gr .38 Special wadcutter loads fired from a 6" barrel .357 magnum revolver be effective as a self preservation round?

They'll beat the socks off a .22 long rifle round.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Wadcutter bullets are usually dead soft since they're designed for low velocity target work. Expect a lot of leading if you push them fast.

Swaged wadcutters are soft -- those are usually hollowbased. But you can buy wadcutter moulds and cast them at any hardness you like.

 

[Jim March]

Federal has a 110gr "Personal Defense" 38Spl load (not +P) that is quite mild. From a 6" barrel it'll probably expand OK. From a 2", forget it. It'd still be better than target wadcutters.

Another standard pressure 38 to try is Cor-Bon's 110gr DPX.

What else...AH! Ammoman has a stash left of the old Federal 125grain Nyclad hollowpoint, another good standard pressure round:

http://ammoman.com

None of these should recoil too much more than target wadcutters, esp. from a 6" barrel 357.

 

[scubie02]

AN awful lot of old timers I have known swore/swear by using 38 wadcutters as their self defense load. I was dubious of that when younger, probably, but have actually seen tests before where they compared quite well with some of the whizzbangiest newfangled defense loads. They tend to be accurate, very mild (which also aids in people shooting them well most likely) and they apparently tend to also cut nice round holes going through flesh which don't clase up as easily. Oftentimes those oldtimers knew what they were talking about, so I'm inclined to believe them. I've used them as a carry round back in the day, but nowadays tend to carry a 45 or 9mm now that I can afford more expensive toys.

 

[Quantrill]

"Swaged wadcutters are soft -- those are usually hollowbased. But you can buy wadcutter moulds and cast them at any hardness you like"

I cast Hensley & Gibbs #50 , also Lyman #35891 and 358495. All of which can (and are) cast a lot harder than swaged HBWC. They are all 140something grain wadcutters. Quantrill

 

[Starter52]

.38 Wadcutters were widely recommend by gun writers in the 1970's, mostly because we didn't have anything better. They figured (correctly) that a hit with any load was better than a miss with a SuperVel.

I agree with Vern that the factory target WC loads are just too slow for self-defense. I'd go with a SWC instead. The non +P 158 gr. SWC is a good place to start.