What Constitutes an Elephant Gun?

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CraigC said:
It is! For what it costs to go to Alaska to hunt bear 'or' moose, you could take several head of African plains game. Probably have more fun doing it. My uncle has hunted all over the world, has dozens of trophies including a full mount Alaskan brown bear and muskox. Every time he goes to Alaska he nearly dies.
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My 2 bucket list hunts have always been an Alaskan brown bear and an Alaskan moose, but my finances will not allow me to do that as well as drag race.
 
I changed my bucket list to include doing moose/black bear in Maine and/or black bear in the Carolinas. So I can better afford Africa. ;)
 
CraigC said:
I changed my bucket list to include doing moose/black bear in Maine and/or black bear in the Carolinas. So I can better afford Africa. ;)
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I was lucky enough to get to take a boon and crocket class black bear at home, so I guess I have checked black bear off my list already. It would still be a fun adventure to go black bear hunting out west or in canada, and definitely more affordable than brown bear.
 
CraigC said:
* * * They also head shoot swimming caribou to stock up for winter.
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That's true.

What the natives do isn't really relevant to the rest of us.
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Actually it is. I'm considering relocating to rural Alaska and becoming a permanent resident there.

That will deflate enormously the cost of hunting there, not to mention learning the native techniques and practices for surviving 24/7/365 in the testy AK environment.
 
I haven't hunted animals (four-legged variety) since I exited the Corps in '81. I still shoot though, and recently had a chance to shoot 2 rounds ($20 dollars worth according to the owner of the rifle) out of a 416 Rigby.

I was sitting at a concrete shooting bench and while getting behind the scope the owner's friend cautioned me about getting too close to the scope. He said it could bite. I told him no, it won't, and proceeded to put both rounds downrange on a steel plate and 200.

The 'friend' made the comment that it seemed like I didn't even move when the rifle went off (I did move a little I think, but maybe not as much as he was expecting). I smiled and told him that this may be one of the few advantages of being 6'3" and almost 290 lbs. :)

I didn't mind shooting that rifle at all. It didn't hurt, nor did it leave any marks/bruises. If the cartridges are truly $10 each I couldn't afford to shoot one though.
 
Hesa Hard1 said:
That's true.


Actually it is. I'm considering relocating to rural Alaska and becoming a permanent resident there.

That will deflate enormously the cost of hunting there, not to mention learning the native techniques and practices for surviving 24/7/365 in the testy AK environment.
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I’m not talking about residents but natives.
 
brmiller said:
I haven't hunted animals (four-legged variety) since I exited the Corps in '81. I still shoot though, and recently had a chance to shoot 2 rounds ($20 dollars worth according to the owner of the rifle) out of a 416 Rigby.

I was sitting at a concrete shooting bench and while getting behind the scope the owner's friend cautioned me about getting too close to the scope. He said it could bite. I told him no, it won't, and proceeded to put both rounds downrange on a steel plate and 200.

The 'friend' made the comment that it seemed like I didn't even move when the rifle went off (I did move a little I think, but maybe not as much as he was expecting). I smiled and told him that this may be one of the few advantages of being 6'3" and almost 290 lbs. :)

I didn't mind shooting that rifle at all. It didn't hurt, nor did it leave any marks/bruises. If the cartridges are truly $10 each I couldn't afford to shoot one though.
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378 and 460wby goes for about 120 bucks a box here, ive never even seen a Rigby round for sale. I shoot some expensive stuff, but 120-140 bucks for 50 cases is about the most im willing to spend.
 
Discussions of "elephant guns" usually bring to mind heavy caliber British doubles like this Westly Richards drop lock rifle. I've never shot an elephant with it or any other dangerous game, but the battered condition of its case indicates that in it's former life it traveled to dangerous places and probably shot elephants and many other species. DSC_0175 (2).JPG DSC_0154 (3).JPG DSC_0167 (2).JPG DSC_0018 (2).JPG
 
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Offfhand said:
Discussions of "elephant guns" usually bring to mind heavy caliber British doubles like this Westly Richards drop lock rifle. I've never shot an elephant with it or any other dangerous game, but the battered condition of its case indicates that in it's former life it traveled to dangerous places and probably shot elephants and many other species.View attachment 1041844 View attachment 1041845 View attachment 1041846 View attachment 1041847
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You know your my hero right?
 
I got a chance, back in the 80s, to shoot a .378 Weatherby at 100 yards. It hurt, and the bullet hit the exact center of the "X" ring. The load was 108 grains of something and a 270 gr. bullet. I handed the rifle back and said " I'm done. I can never top that!" Gotta think that thing, with solids, would take out an elephant.
 
From Wiki-pedia (the compendium of all things true on Al Gore's interweb :) )"The .577 T-Rex is a rifle cartridge developed by A-Square in 1993 on request for professional guides in Zimbabwe, who escort clients hunting dangerous game. The cartridge is designed for use in "stopping rifles" intended to stop the charge of dangerous game. The 577 contains a .585-inch diameter 750-grain monolithic solid projectile which when fired moves at 2,460 fps producing 10,180 ft-lbs of energy."
 
Kano383 said:
"Elephant guns" were guns made specifically for elephant hunting in the days of blackpowder, such as the 4 and 8 bores, and of such weight, recoil, and cost that no-one in his right mind would use them on anything else than an elephant.

Frederick Selous used a 4 bore to great effect on his quarry, and to dismal effect on himself. Here is what he had to say about it in later years: “…the 4-bore guns kicked most frightfully and, in my case, the punishment received has affected my nerves to such an extent as to have materially influenced my shooting ever since, and I am heartily sorry I ever had anything to do with them.”
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I have a 4 bore rifle. It is heavy, has about 340 ft/lbs of recoil energy, and it is quite expensive. I think those old elephant hunters were full of it when they were describing their rifles. The normal load that I use is 450 grains of powder. The recoil will knock me back about 5 or 6 feet. Look behind you before shooting! It will NOT make you spin around, give you a concussion, or detached retinas. It does NOT make you flinch for the rest of your life. I had a pretty flinch when I first started shooting it. after 20 or 30 shots I was able to shoot with no flinch. With a well made rifle the recoil is massive, but it is not painful. My rifle has no recoil pad. It has a brass butt plate. I have never gotten a bruised shoulder from shooting it. If you have never fired anything over 30 caliber a 4 bore will be quite a surprise and likely cause injury. If you are accustomed to shooting the larger dangerous game rifles you will be able to handle a 4 bore with a little practice. The 4 bore reputation is a bit exaggerated.
 
Bill Raby said:
I have a 4 bore rifle. It is heavy, has about 340 ft/lbs of recoil energy, and it is quite expensive. I think those old elephant hunters were full of it when they were describing their rifles. The normal load that I use is 450 grains of powder. The recoil will knock me back about 5 or 6 feet. Look behind you before shooting! It will NOT make you spin around, give you a concussion, or detached retinas. It does NOT make you flinch for the rest of your life. I had a pretty flinch when I first started shooting it. after 20 or 30 shots I was able to shoot with no flinch. With a well made rifle the recoil is massive, but it is not painful. My rifle has no recoil pad. It has a brass butt plate. I have never gotten a bruised shoulder from shooting it. If you have never fired anything over 30 caliber a 4 bore will be quite a surprise and likely cause injury. If you are accustomed to shooting the larger dangerous game rifles you will be able to handle a 4 bore with a little practice. The 4 bore reputation is a bit exaggerated.
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Selous' rifle (the one he regretted using) was a single barrel muzzle-loader, weighed 13lbs, and he loaded up to 540 grains of powder.

Different animal, I'd guess... You do the shooting, I'll take the pictures :D
 
General Geoff said:
There was a company from many years ago that rechambered M1 Garands to .458 WInchester Magnum specifically for guys who wanted to use a Garand for hunting African dangerous game.
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That sounds good on paper except there is not one single African hunting country that I'm aware of that allows semi automatic rifles for sport hunting.
 
Thanks Grayrock,
But can anyone actually produce a follow up shot WITH OUT flinching.
For that matter can anyone ever fire it a second time with out flinching.
I’ll NOT add the T- Rex experience to my bucket list.:rofl:
 
H&Hhunter said:
That sounds good on paper except there is not one single African hunting country that I'm aware of that allows semi automatic rifles for sport hunting.
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The .458 McCann Garand was designed for hunting DG anywhere a non-mag-fed semi-auto would be legal.

The .458WM is certainly a species-appropriate cartridge for bears - and specifically the big bruins like the brownies, Grizzs, and Polars found in Alaska and Canada (a country where the M1 is still a legal semi-auto, by the way).

IMG_1032.JPG

And even if the McCann 458 M1 isn't made anymore, you can still get an M1 chambered in .35 Whelen, which is a pretty potent critter-slayer in its own right, including on the Big Stuff.

Shuff's Parkerizing can build one on a full-size donor Garand, starting with a M1-profile 35W barrel from Criterion. He can also build one on the carbine-size 16" Mini-G. He mods the internals of the receiver to reliably feed 8-rds of big heavy .358-dia slugs from a USGI en bloc clip, along with a few other tricks. You can also use a 5-rd "hunting" clip if the wildlife regs of a particular state restrict capacity.
 
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There is nothing magical about the .275 Rigby (7x57) just about any round firing a bullet of a sectional density .300 or greater using a quality round nosed solid will penetrate and elephants skull from the side or behind to the brain. The trick is knowing where the brain is located. There’s a lot of head and a comparatively small brain on an elephant.

Bell was one hell of an athlete, he spent the time to study elephant cranial pathology and he could shoot.

A .308 shooting 150 Gr ball will do the same in the hands of a knowledgeable elephant shooter. And cropping officers did it all the time. In fact many more elephants than Bell stacked up.
 
I'm in the double rifle fan club!!! Big Nitro cartridges. For an Elephant rifle.

For hunting the big five a bolt action 375 H&H or 458 win mag.

I think a 375 Ruger would be a nice / affordable option for a world wide rifle :cool:
 
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