What if situation Not sure who is BG

[online2mch]

What if you suddenly hear a shot say in a mall parking lot, and see one guy on the ground and one standing both have weapons. What are your actions? Which is the bad guy? Is this a CPL holder defending himself? If you are the legally armed citizen who just foiled an attack in a public place what do you do if another legally armed citizen comes up to help. How do you know?

 

[tepin]

If you don’t fear for your life, remain and call 911. Otherwise run away then call 911. If you don’t know the details of what is happening or what has happened, you are not justified to take any action. You are not law enforcement.

 

[shermacman]

You answered your question with your last question!
You don't know.
Therefore, you can't do anything except keep safe, call 911, and observe. The scenarios are too varied: undercover cop, two bad guys, mall ninjas, etc.
You could very easily make the situation much worse.

 

[hso]

That's a difficult situation.

LE would be authorized to take control of the situation and would be justified in drawing a weapon and bringing it to bear on the person with the gun until they surrenderd the weapon.

As a civilian you have no authority to do any of that and are only authorized to use your weapon to defend yourself or the life of another. In this case your life isn't in danger and you don't know who the Good Guy is.

Best to alert 911, seek cover, be a good witness if you can do so safely.

 

[mete]

There was a case in my area where a BG took a hostage .Just before the cops came the hostage managed to take the gun from the BG. Cops arrived and shot the GG !! You cannot take anothers word for it either ! You have to see things for yourself and determine who's the BG. If a uniformed cop arrives immediately put the gun down and follow his instructions.

 

[Preacherman]

As others have said: if you can't positively ID who is the GG and who the BG, stay out of it, observe closely so as to be a good witness later, call 911, and wait for the cops to arrive.

I'd add that if you're a GG who's just put down a BG, I'd suggest you immediately holster your weapon (you can get it out quickly enough if you need it again, after all!) and wait for the cops with your hands empty. If the BG is uninjured, and you're holding him for the cops, I'd suggest making him lie down with his face turned away from you. That way, your gun can go back in the holster, and he won't know it - and you can still get it out as he gets up, if he decides to do something silly.

When the cops arrive, they'll probably do so in response to a "Man with a gun - shots fired!" type of call. They won't know who's the GG and who's the BG. If you have a gun in your hand, they might find out too late that you're on the side of the angels . . .

 

[The Drew]

If you cannot ID who is who, best advice is to call 911 and observe until the cops arrive.

I disagree with what some others have said though about intervening, many states deadly force laws extend to protecting others who are in immediate danger. Know your state laws and abide by them.

 

[Jeff White]

The Drew said;

I disagree with what some others have said though about intervening, many states deadly force laws extend to protecting others who are in immediate danger. Know your state laws and abide by them.

Does PA commission it's CCW holders as peace officers? Just because the law says you can take some action doesn't mean that you should or are under any obligation to. The criminal and civil liability that you take on when you jump into an unknown situation can change your life and not for the better....

Jeff

 

[ball3006]

If you don't know..........

just try to be the best witness you can to what happened. Don't approach anyone until the cops arrive......chris3

 

[Lupinus]

you aren't law enforcment, if you witness this do just that, be a witness and call 911. Unless one of the two is clearly the agressor take no action, your CCW is to save your life, if possible the lives of others, not to be a hero and get involved in a situation that is very unclear.

 

[Oldtimer]

It will be very difficult to figure out "Who's who in the zoo", unless you observed the entire indident and knew some FACTS as they presented themselves.

Back in 1972, when I was a LEO, my partner and I responded to a "shooting in progress" radio call. When we arrived, there was a HUGE man on top of a smaller man, proned out. The HUGE man had a .45 auto pistol in his hand, so it could have been very easy to surmise that he was the bad guy. Well, the HUGE man also had 5 holes in his chest! There was blood everywhere, but not from the smaller man. It turned out that the HUGE man was the victim of an armed robbery, and after being shot by the bad guy, he tackled him, threw him to the ground, disarmed him, and held him down until we arrived. After pulling him off of the bad guy, the HUGE man passed out from the loss of blood. Somehow, he survived and testified in court!

In 1979, I was working an "undercover" assignment, and the uniformed officers in that area didn't know who I was. I got "rounded up" with a bunch of bad guys, but because I was ARMED, I was looked upon as a bad guy of the WORST kind! Fortunately, I was bailed out by my back-up officers before anything terrible happened, but it was VERY close! In a way, however, that incident only added to my "bad guy" credibility rating within that group of REAL bad guys, since my cover hadn't been compromised. That investigation eventually ended with the arrest of 19 people who were manufacturing "home-made" machine-pistols for sale to a major gang.

Looks are OFTEN deceiving, even for the trained eyes of seasoned LEO's that have had countless contacts with bad guys.

Lastly, LEO's are NOT on-duty "24/7", nor do most LE agencies require them to carry an off-duty firearm. There IS one basic requirement, however, for the majority of all LE agencies require off-duty officers to "take action" if they observe a crime. That doesn't mean that they are required to wade into the middle of a shoot-out or an armed robbery, but IF they observe a crime being committed, their least "action" to take would be to report it AND stick around as a "professional witness".