What is a liberal?

[UberPhLuBB]

In that case, Bush must be a Democrat who has somehow managed to trick everyone into thinking he's a Republican.

Well, that's those are the definitions of the words. There's not much of a distinction anymore.

 

[R.H. Lee]

Liberals think of themselves as people who want to maximize individual liberties and they believe no amount of government is too much to achieve that end.

 

[seansean]

the liberal and conservative labels are meaningless. This is all managed conflict, we fight each other, and the real players get away with the whole candy store when we're not looking

 

[wingnutx]

my definition: a well-meaning person who wants to save everyone from everything, including themselves, and does not understand or care about unintended consequences as long as their action feels like the compassionate thing to do.

 

[Bunkster]

I wish I had saved a piece I read a few years ago regarding this very issue. It explained in great detail when and how the bastardization of the word "liberal" took place.

It was in the early part of the 20th century when a left-leaning group in the United States surmized that calling themselves "leftists" didn't sell too well with the general public. It was a woman in this group that came up with the notion that "liberal" would be far more acceptable and welcoming to your average soccer-mom, soccer-dad, soccer-son and soccer-daughter.

This is unique to the United States. Go to South America and elsewhere, a "liberal" is still regarded as a non-leftist, a person of "liberty".

For instance, in the translator's notes of "Guide to the Perfect Latin American Idiot" by Mendoza, Montaner & Llosa, they specifically point out that all use of the term "liberal" means "libertarian" or "classical liberal".

If you ever listen to or read David Horowitz, you will quickly sense him not playing into the word games of the left: He will, 99% of the time, refer to them as "leftists".

A leftist can attempt to euphemize themselves with "liberal" or "progressive" or "populist" all they want to, but they are still humanity's most destructive, rancid element.

Ergo, to be accurate, call them what they are: LEFTISTS

 

[lysander]

I award the kewpie doll to.........

seansean said:

the liberal and conservative labels are meaningless. This is all managed conflict, we fight each other, and the real players get away with the whole candy store when we're not looking

A "Liberal" is the bogeyman living under the bed of anyone who considers themselves "Conservative."

.....and vice versa

The definitions of liberal and conservative (in relation to American politics) from a political science standpoint, are miles away from common usage. Which is why we have new terms to describe old friends...Neo-Cons, Paleoliberals, Greens, Neoliberals, Paleocons, etc., etc., ad infinitum...

What most would call a "liberal" in America...I would call a Leftist Authoritarian.

What most would call a "conservative" in America....I would call a Slightly less Leftist Authoritarian.

Both groups spit on individual rights, think that government and bureacracy can cure what ails ya, tax and spend, constrict the market, decry conduct outside their approved boundaries, etc.

Wikipedia has a pretty decent overview of Liberalism.

 

[ceetee]

This is a test. This is only a test. I am temporarily replacing a few choce words in a previous post, to see how it sounds. Please do not be alarmed. If you feel yourself becoming nauseous, just place your lap tray in the upright position, and lean back. It'll all be over soon...


A conservative is someone who seeks to impose their ideas of what individuals in our society *need*, and advocates that no one is responsible for their own actions. if you can blame it on someone else, you're a conservative. if you think you can make the decisions for everyone based on your own narrow view of reality you're a conservative.
Conservatives mask their own hypocrisy with horrid whining and incessant crying. they may say they are 'tolerant', but count how many times they insult you with racial or sexual epiteths and you'll see just how much they really 'tolerate' minorities and those with different sexual orientations.

At the heart of conservatism is good old fashioned greed and envy. They want the money that the people have, and they want the prestige of being a so-called 'elite'.
Conservatives think that somehow they are special and deserve special privileges. They preach about eliminating things like 'capitol gains taxes' and talk longingly about 'sharing resources' with one another, but in reality they desire to amass fortunes and wealth and hoard it all for themselves.
Conservatives tell everyone else to 'spend money to drive the economy' but when they are asked to share their riches, they instead 'raise prices' and claim that the money will 'trickle down', rather than dip into their own bank accounts and get those in need the help they require immediately.
Conservatives want us to believe they truly care for each and every individual, but while millions are being tortured or slaughtered, they care more about whether or not they are on some blacklist they blame on the jews in hollywood.

 

[el44vaquero]

Liberal is to communist as corruption is to politician.

 

[MrTuffPaws]

So MRTUFFPAWS I believe if this thread runs for 100 post you will get 100 different answers as to what a liberal is.

So far that is what it is coming too.

 

[MrTuffPaws]

But liberals, being the opposite of conservatives, do not value tradition.

See, this is what I am talking about. Generalizations so dang broad that they become meaningless. What is worse, is it is a declaration of ignorance of the past. Most tradition that we value today are relatively new.

 

[Graystar]

A liberal is a socialist that likes money. A liberal wants socialism for everyone else. Liberals want to take care of the poor and needy just as long as they don't move into their neighborhoods.

 

[UberPhLuBB]

See, this is what I am talking about. Generalizations so dang broad that they become meaningless. What is worse, is it is a declaration of ignorance of the past. Most tradition that we value today are relatively new.

I'm sorry, but can you argue that liberals do not value tradition?

 

[The Real Hawkeye]

I prefer to call them leftists.

 

[coylh]

Anyway, can you guys help me out and tell me what a liberal is?

Around here, Liberal is a pejorative epithet, like Yankee or Punk. It's not used so much to describe someone's politics as it is to disparage him.

See Also: Redneck

 

[Bigjake]

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTuffPaws
See, this is what I am talking about. Generalizations so dang broad that they become meaningless. What is worse, is it is a declaration of ignorance of the past. Most tradition that we value today are relatively new.


I'm sorry, but can you argue that liberals do not value tradition?

They are all for gay marriage, which, is traditionally an oxymoron

next

 

[Bigjake]

what are we defining anyway? the classical liberals that founded the country? or the filthy socialists that grab guns and raise taxes now??

 

[The Real Hawkeye]

what are we defining anyway? the classical liberals that founded the country? or the filthy socialists that grab guns and raise taxes now??

Good point, which is why I call the modern kind leftists, not liberals. The leftists stole the label and don't deserve to have the root for liberty as any part of their description.

 

[chickenfried]

I thought it was FDR that mashed up the classic definitions of liberal and conservative?

It was in the early part of the 20th century when a left-leaning group in the United States surmized that calling themselves "leftists" didn't sell too well with the general public. It was a woman in this group that came up with the notion that "liberal" would be far more acceptable and welcoming to your average soccer-mom, soccer-dad, soccer-son and soccer-daughter.

This is unique to the United States. Go to South America and elsewhere, a "liberal" is still regarded as a non-leftist, a person of "liberty".

For instance, in the translator's notes of "Guide to the Perfect Latin American Idiot" by Mendoza, Montaner & Llosa, they specifically point out that all use of the term "liberal" means "libertarian" or "classical liberal".

If you ever listen to or read David Horowitz, you will quickly sense him not playing into the word games of the left: He will, 99% of the time, refer to them as "leftists".

A leftist can attempt to euphemize themselves with "liberal" or "progressive" or "populist" all they want to, but they are still humanity's most destructive, rancid element.

Ergo, to be accurate, call them what they are: LEFTISTS

 

[Bigjake]

A leftist can attempt to euphemize themselves with "liberal" or "progressive" or "populist" all they want to, but they are still humanity's most destructive, rancid element.

Ergo, to be accurate, call them what they are: LEFTISTS

The problem remains, you know the they are leftists, and i know they are leftists, but they think they are "liberals" and are known as such by most people in general

 

[Kim]

I agree today a liberal is a leftist. They talk about the greedy conservatives. But they forget Thy shall not steal and you will never hear them say Thy shall not COVET------- kinda like the 10th amendment to the Constitution. I can't see it, I can't see it. What they would do if they could get away with it is----------Take my paycheck and directly deposit it into the US Treasury. They would then provide me a government living place, food, medical care, transportation, clothes(as they determined I needed) they would then send me back an allowance and if I was tolerant and good I would get to keep that to spend in the government store. This store would have no religious things for sale, no guns, sharp kinives, things made of fur, fatty foods, cigarettes, chemicals that I could comment suicide with or posion the earth mother. They would allow abortion, euthansia , sexual realtions of any kind any where, and hard drugs. And if I really complained they would demand instead of capital punishemant state sponsored euthansia for my mental illness. Oh and they would care(steal ,take away) all my children to be raised as they see proper. Hillary " I am going to take things from you"

 

[coylh]

The Democrats seem to be basically nicer people, but they have demonstrated time and again that they have the management skills of celery. They're the kind of people who'd stop to help you change a flat, but would somehow manage to set your car on fire. I would be reluctant to entrust them with a Cuisinart, let alone the economy. The Republicans, on the other hand, would know how to fix your tire, but they wouldn't bother to stop because they'd want to be on time for Ugly Pants Night at the country club. -- Dave Barry

 

[Capteddie]

whereas conservitives believe goverment is the problem.

Republicans want power kept at the lowest levels, where it belongs.

Hmmmm....
Sounds like a LIBERTARIAN to me.

In that case, Bush must be a Democrat who has somehow managed to trick everyone into thinking he's a Republican.

If it looks like it and smells like it better not step in it...

 

[No_Brakes23]

To put it simply, liberals believes goverment is the solution to all problem, whereas conservitives believe goverment is the problem.

You have that exactly backwards. Liberty = Less Gov, Conservation = Restriction.

Liberals want to change things that do not need to be changed.

Simple as that.

Yeah those stupid founding fathers. Should have left well enough alone. UberPhLuBB, you are a Tory, plain and simple.

Liberal=socialist

That doesn't even make sense. Perhaps leftists who call themselves liberals are socialists, but that doesn't mean they are liberals.

a liberal is someone who seeks to impose their ideas of what individuals in our society *need*, and advocates that no one is responsible for their own actions. if you can blame it on someone else, you're a liberal. if you think you can make the decisions for everyone based on your own narrow view of reality you're a liberal.

That is pretty much the exact opposite of liberty. I suppose you think that the people shooting at our soldiers in Iraq are "Freedom Fighters" too. I mean, that is what they call themselves, so Freedom Fighters must be people who hack off people's heads on TV, right? That is the logic you are using.

no alex, that topics just a little bit more complicated that how you'd like to see it.

Oh, I get it, your narrow views are okay, but other people's narrow views are wrong?

Liberals think of themselves as people who want to maximize individual liberties and they believe no amount of government is too much to achieve that end.

Nothing liberal about that.

It was in the early part of the 20th century when a left-leaning group in the United States surmized that calling themselves "leftists" didn't sell too well with the general public. It was a woman in this group that came up with the notion that "liberal" would be far more acceptable and welcoming to your average soccer-mom, soccer-dad, soccer-son and soccer-daughter.

Ergo, to be accurate, call them what they are: LEFTISTS

+1 Yup, just as Terrorist doesn't sound as good as Freedom Fighter.

the liberal and conservative labels are meaningless. This is all managed conflict, we fight each other, and the real players get away with the whole candy store when we're not looking

Sadly, IAWTC

What most would call a "liberal" in America...I would call a Leftist Authoritarian.

What most would call a "conservative" in America....I would call a Slightly less Leftist Authoritarian.

Both groups spit on individual rights, think that government and bureacracy can cure what ails ya, tax and spend, constrict the market, decry conduct outside their approved boundaries, etc.

That sounds a little more like it.

 

[No_Brakes23]

.

 

[wheelgunner.41]

Liberals

Liberalism is the absense of moral absolutes.