What to say to 911 after a self-defence incident

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vanilla gorilla said:
If you will read my whole post, you will note that I said nothing about filling in the dispatcher on everything that happened.

From your original post...

vanilla gorilla said:
Were it me making the call, I'd first provide my address and name, and that somebody has attacked me. "I pulled my weapon and fired to defend myself, and have now retreated to a safe area."

And what exactly will that add to the information relayed to the Police if indeed it is relayed verbatim?
And what if, in the excitement, that sentence comes out as "I shot the F&^%$#@ B*&^%$# with my .357 Mag and I can stick my F*&^%$# Fist into the exit wounds. Wow did those puppies ever open up nice! I'm hiding behind my F*&^%$# Sofa." Let this get played with commentary and it may sound like you were just waiting to ambush someone with your "killer toy". How do you KNOW what you will say in such an emotionally charged situation? The point is that you DON'T know what you will say or how you will say it. That is why saying a practised minimum is best.

vanilla gorilla said:
If they start asking too many questions about exactly what happened, a lot of "I don't know." or "I'm not sure." is the rule.

Which is exactly what you don't want... in the excitement you will want to tell all... and get re-assurance. But since you don't know what you will say or that you won't say something when you meant it entirely different - getting into a conversation is not a good idea... how do you know when to stop when you may not be thinking rationally?
(Actually, you agree with my position when you say that... )

Also... starting your post with "I must admit, I've heard stupid things said in my life, and this is pretty far up on the list" is not a good (THR) way to respond. My post comes from a well thought out, researched and substantiated position.
You may not agree with it - as you obviously don't. But then opinions are like ...emmmm noses.... everybody has one.
 
I live in the Gestapo state of Illinois, they are going to prosecute me no matter what is said. I mean, how dare I use a weapon to defend my family and home
Most of Illinois outside of Chicago is not so bad. Much of the criminal justice system still respects your human right to self defense and you will probably be treated fairly. In Chicago, it is a crap shoot. You might get a fair break, or they may just decide to make an example of you.

As for the call to 911, I agree on minimal details. Anything you say can and will be used against you. Not so sure about hanging up as it might not be well received. Don't talk your self into trouble. 911 calls are recorded.

When the cops get there they will almost certainly cuff you. They don't know what happened and their instinct in such cases is to just cuff everyone in sight. It makes them feel safer and they are on an adrenalin high that will take a few minutes to wear off. Make sure you don't point a gun at an officer, and pay attention to what they are saying. Nothing good will happen to you for some period of time. Just stay quiet and be a good serf and do as you are told.

Answer no questions other then to ID yourself. Once questions are asked about the incident, ask that your lawyer be present for all questioning. There may be an attempt made to try and con or coerce you into talking.
Avoid the impulse to tell your side of the story until your lawyer shows up.
Avoid the impulse to tell your side of the story until your lawyer shows up.
Avoid the impulse to tell your side of the story until your lawyer shows up.
 
as someone that is married to a professional photographer, i have several high end cameras in each room... i would snap off a couple of pics of the scene from my vantage point before the cops got there too... my lawyer would need those...

as for what to tell the dispatcher... you better let them know that shots have been fired... if you dont and your neighbor calls reporting hearing shots... you are screwed when they show up...
 
ilbob said:
Avoid the impulse to tell your side of the story until your lawyer shows up.
Avoid the impulse to tell your side of the story until your lawyer shows up.
Avoid the impulse to tell your side of the story until your lawyer shows up.

Couldn't have said it better myself... wait... I did say it myself!:D
But - (without the smily) - This impulse is hard to resist. Been There - Done That....
 
AZ Rebel's comments

You nailed it, dude! Say NOTHING else to anyone except your attorney. Anything you say to anyone will be mis-quoted, mis-used, mis-understood by way of professional incompentence, personal or departmental bias, and just the fact that what people say, hear and repeat changes over time. Heck, even exploits in college of me and folks I know have improved each and EVERY year since they occured...just like fishing stories!
 
Up to the Miranda warning, nothing you said can be used against you; after that, everything can.

Gotta question that one.

El T's a lawyer. Where's he when we need him? He went to Indiana University, but he should still know enough to get by...
 
as someone that is married to a professional photographer, i have several high end cameras in each room... i would snap off a couple of pics of the scene from my vantage point before the cops got there too... my lawyer would need those...

after shooting someone you probably won't be thinking real straight. probably best to keep your activities to a minimum, even if you mental state was such that you were in a position to take pictures. if the cameras are in the vicinity they may well get confiscated anyway, and taking pictures then hiding them might look bad.

besides that, the shootee might not be dead yet as another poster mentioned. in an amazing number of shootings, the shootee walks away under his own power. if he wants to walk off, let him. you are under no obligation to hold him for police, but it would be a real good idea to inform 911 the shootee left the premises.

another strong possibility is that you may shoot and miss. in a choatic and terrifying situation like that, your shooting skills go out the window. if the guy stops and runs off, let him. tell 911 that when you call.
 
Up to the Miranda warning, nothing you said can be used against you; after that, everything can.

Gotta question that one.

not so.

most anything you say either prior to or after a warning is admissible in court.

everything you say, or don't say, potentially could be used against you, but might not be admissible in court. insisting on a lawyer being present during questioning can't be used against you in court, but it might be used against you by the investigating officers. Or not.

Even if you are in for some unpleasantness, you are still alive.
 
First time I ever called the police, I told them I'd just seen a man run by my house with a purse in his hand, and that I could clearly see the purse strap dangling. I informed them that the person was crouched down next to some bushes at my neighbors house.

An hour and half later, 5 units arrived. There had been a murder that night and no one had come to catch the lowly purse snatcher. (Who had injured a woman when he used his knife to cut the purse strap)

The next incident that happened a few years later, I told the dispatcher, "There's someone outside next to my truck. I'm taking my shotgun outside to ask him what he's doing."

30 seconds after I walked outside there were two units there.
 
from LFI-1 Judicious Use of Deadly Force, April 2000
INTERACTION WITH THE POLICE COMMUNICATIONS OPERATOR


(1.) Give your address
(2.) Tell them exactly what's going on without going into un-necessary detail:
" I live at 27 Elm Street. There's an intruder in my house RIGHT NOW.
I have him at gunpoint RIGHT NOW. I live at 27 Elm Street."
(3.) Don't begin at the beginning and chronologically describe everything that
has happened. The Dispatcher doesn't need to know and doesn't care! Get to
the point! You can explain the other details later to the responding officers.
(4.) Repeat your address so that they know for sure where you are.
(5.) STAY ON THE LINE!
(6.) Give the cops your description -- race and gender, how you're dressed, etc.
(7.) Tell them where in the house you are located and how they can get to you -- will a family member meet them at the door or do they have to break in, or what?
(8.) Give them a description of the suspect, so there will be no problems of
mistaken identity once the police arrive.

INTERACTION WITH THE FIRST RESPONDING POLICE OFFICERS

(1.) When they arrive, do exactly as they say. If they tell you to put your gun down, hen put it down. If they handcuff you, don't resist. Self defense situations are very chaotic, and the average officer does not go to many incidents involving a legitimate display or delivery of force by a law-abiding citizen, so it may take them quite a while to figure out what's going on.
(2.) What do you tell the cops?
-- "This man tried to attack me"
-- "The evidence is here"
-- "The witnesses are here"
-- "I will sign the complaint"
-- "I will cooperate with the prosecution"
-- "I will cooperate with the investigation, but I'm kind of upset right now. I will cooperate with the investigation and make a full statement after I've had time to gather my thoughts and speak to my attorney."
(3.) You need to give enough of a statement so that the police have an idea about what happened. In particular, they need to know who potential witnesses are and where relevant physical evidence might be located. At the scene, they need enough information to begin the investigation and properly manage the crime scene. Remember, the police equate silence with guilt! The only people who utilize the "right to remain silent" are those with something to hide, so a carefully worded statement is probably in your best interest.

"At the scene, tell the responding officers a synopsis of the incident. Cops connect silence with guilt. Almost everybody they ever deal with who asks for a lawyer turns out to be guilty. Tell them what they need to know to get an idea about what just happened. Especially identify any witnesses so that the cops know who to talk to, and point out any potential evidence that they might otherwise overlook. Help them to do their job better. If you are perceived as obstructing the investigation, that perception is NOT in your best interest." -- Massad Ayoob


SURVIVAL FOR ARMED CITIZENS, PLAINCLOTHES COPS, and
OFF DUTY COPS

(1.) Contact the police. Explain the situation. Describe your physical description so that they know who to look for to prevent a "mistaken identity shooting".

(2.) If the event takes place within a building, you need to designate a
"welcoming committee" for the police. Somebody needs to meet the police
at the door, and that somebody needs to be able to repeat the explanation.

(3.) In the case of an enclosed incident, such as the armed robbery of a business, it is desirable for someone to lock all exterior doors and to only open them for uniformed police. This keeps any robbers outside from rescuing their friends, and can prevent witnesses who "don't want to be involved" from slipping out in the confusion.

(4.) Control Yourself!
-- Keep your muzzle off the cops!
-- Don't point the gun at any responding officers by mistake
-- Follow directions from the police


If you're involved in a shooting, give a brief statement to the investigator at the scene. Don't give a detailed statement until you get a chance to calm down, collect your thoughts, and talk to an attorney. GIVE THEM ENOUGH INFORMATION TO GET STARTED IN THE INVESTIGATION. Where is the evidence? Where was the point of entry where he broke into your house? Who are the witnesses?


"Under fire, you will not be able to keep track of how many rounds you fire! We call it the "fire four, reload eight" phenomenon. Under stress, you will experience what is called "cognitive dissonance" which means that your thought processes will be all jumbled up. Your perception of time and distance will be altered and may not be accurate. History has taught us that if you fire more than two or three rounds in a self-defense scenario, you WILL forget how many rounds you've fired. Sometimes, an investigator who does not understand this dynamic seizes upon this inconsistency as evidence of deception. It is nothing of the kind. When they ask you how many rounds that you fired, tell them: "I don't know. I was in fear for my life. I didn't have time to count . . . " -- Massad Ayoob/14 April 2000

It's always best to tell the police SOMETHING. If you act like you've got something to hide, they will evaluate the situation in a whole different way
 
i would love to put a whole bunch of pretty things here... but what came out was much closer to.
"some stupid sob broke into my apt, i tried to get him to leave me alone, i tried to get him to leave... he wouldnt now he's hurt pretty bad, im at ******, no im alright i think, no i cant stay on the phone i need to call my roomie and tell her before she hears about it on the radio at work, *click*"

now... i took a lot of the F word out... but as it turns out the "i tried to get him to leave me alone" and the "i tried to get him to leave" and then the "he wouldnt" pretty much cemented them leaving me alone about it. open + shut

yeah... when they showed up i told them where he came from, i showed them the gun i used. they asked me how many rounds i fired i said i had no clue at all, that i was scared and i really wanted to sit in a police car. the officer sat with me and asked me random questions about it that i just replied "i really dont want to talk about it right now" and he was fine with it. i didnt handle things perfectly but as it turns out it was good enough.
 
Just speak plain english, don't divluge ant information, and keep cool. Do not use profanity, or state anything that you do not want a jury to hear you say in front of them, because it's all taped, and those tapes are government property. When confronted by a friendly officer askinf "what happened?" Politely request a lawyer.
 
Realize that everyone involved in the situation suspects YOU as the gunman, you are suspect#1. You need a LAWYER!, shut up, be cool, say nothing to anyone about anything, be polite, and wait. Let a lawyer, any lawyer, advise you as to searching your home, records, etc... but the main thing to remember is to keep your mouth shut! until you speak in court. loose lips sink ships!
 
Stupid questions:

If the shoot is in your home, how agressively can they search your home, if at all? Do they need a warrant?

Are all the guns in your gun safe at risk of being seized
 
i dunno, they didnt search mine very much because if they did find my other weapons they didnt say anything about it... and the only one they took was the one used. all in all they were pretty decent about it.
 
Nix, I take it that you have been unlucky enought to have actually been involved in a self defense shooting. I for one would appreciate knowing more about it.

Not the 'what happened, Dude!?' details, but more the basic facts and how it affected you. Legally, personally, emotionally. If you don't want to I understand completely, but if you can it might help me understand even more about the possible implications of exercising self defense with deadly force.

Thanks
Mark
 
.45&tkd-

Remember, for police to enter your home, they need one of three things:

1: PERMISSION, Where a cop shows up at your house because you summoned them about a problem, or they show up and ask you if they can come in. (Be careful, they can and will tell white lies to get you to let them in, such as, "I can have a warrant here in 20 minutes", or "Things will go better for you if you just cooperate".)

2: A warrant, signed by a judge. And remember, even if they get a warrant, the facts can later be contested and the results dismissed.

3: EXIGENCY. This means, some kind of emergency which reasonably required the cop to go inside. Like, they were chasing a suspect, and he fled into a home. Or, they received a report of shots fired at this residence and they must make sure everyone is ok.

ONCE THEY ARE INSIDE LEGALLY, plain view is in effect. Meaning, any evidence in plain view is fair game. Firearms involved in the incident. Property which was being stolen. Tools used to commit the crime. You specifically asked about guns in your safe, I could only see them seizing them if they had reason to believe that you had used a gun and then put it back in your safe before they arrived. This doesn't mean they wouldn't try to seize all guns on the premises anyway, even if they were told to return them later. (All dinged up, plan on that.)

Massad Ayoob was talking about this on PD T.V. the other night, he made a point to say on the phone, "A home invasion is in progress." This gets a much more urgent response from everyone involved than "I have experienced a burglary." He also made a point to not be running around with a gun when the police arrive. And again, ask for an ambulance, do not say; "I just shot someone."
 
After being involved in a shooting incident . . .

AFTER BEING INVOLVED IN A SHOOTING INCIDENT:
From John Farnam of Defense Training International
www.defense-training.com

14 June 2006
Two important points from Skip Gochenour's lecture at the 2006 National Tactical Invitational.Skip is involved with the criminal justice system daily, and these two points should be kept in mind by all of us: In the wake of a deadly-force incident in which you were involved:
(1) Let your lawyer do all the talking!
(2) "Self-defense" is a justification only available when your actions were intentional. "Self-defense" may not be invoked to justify accidents!
Your lawyer can have his facts all mixed up. He can tell outrageous lies.
You can fire him on Monday morning, and probably should! However, when talking with investigators and prosecutors, HE CAN GET YOUR SIDE OF THE STORY BEFORE THEM WITHOUT STATEMENTS THAT ARE ATTRIBUTABLE TO YOU! You needn't worry about what he says, to anyone. You need only worry about what you say.

It 's your statements, even inadvertent ones, that will come back to haunt you.

For example: When you intimate or even suggest, however subtly, that your use of deadly force was, in fact, accidental, from that point forward "self-defense" will no longer be available to you as a justification for what you did. A negligent discharge (ND) that results in an injury or death is a negligent homicide, and it cannot be subsequently converted to "self-defense," no matter what the person was doing when he was shot. STATEMENTS AS INNOCENT-SOUNDING AS, "I 'M SORRY." "I DIDN'T MEAN TO" or "I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS HAPPENED" ARE ALL THUS PERNICIOUSLY INCRIMINATING. Such statements must never leave your lips! Those of us who go armed neglect the foregoing at our peril.
/John

========================================================
15June06
Refinements, from a student who is a well-known and respected criminal defense attorney:
"I cannot count the number of times I've heard a client say, "They wanted to interview me, and we talked a little, but I didn't tell them ANYTHING. I was very careful.' Then, I get the discovery, including the report on the interview. It invariably includes a full confession, plus additional damaging statements, repeated multiple times. Great beginning for our defensive strategy!

The only thing that I believe a person should tell police who arrive at a hot scene (not all lawyers agree) is:

(1) 'Thank heaven you're here!'
(2) 'I'm the one who called.'
(3) 'A man broke into our house and tried to murder us.' (adjust as necessary)
(4) 'I'll be happy to answer all your questions, as soon as my lawyer is here.'

The only additional statements I advise are: Tell arriving officers about: (1) active threats, (2) innocent people in the area (3) evidence, and (4) witnesses. These are important to the case, to the safety of officers and others, and may not be obvious. Those statements, while still not risk-free, are appropriate and reasonable, and I think there is a moral duty to provide information which DIRECTLY effects the safety of officers and the discovery of truth."
/John
 
After being involved in a shooting incident

21 June 07

Sage advice from criminal defense attorneys with whom I work:
from John S. Farnam
www.defense-training.com

When I am asked by lawyers to provide them with expert consultation in
shooting cases, I always make it a point to ask several, general questions
about strategies for gun owners/carriers. This advice I, in turn, pass on to my
students:

The most dangerous and damaging single thing one can do in the wake of a
lethal confrontation, the one act that fatally damages most claims of legitimate self-defense? Answering questions asked by police investigators, at the scene, without first insisting on having your attorney present.

Even seemingly innocent-sounding statements like,
"I didn't mean to....", "
It was an accident.....",
"This is terrible....",
and "I can't believe I did that...."
are, in fact, monstrously incriminating.
Attorneys tell me that the strongest part of the prosecutor's case is almost always
Directly founded upon indiscreet statements made, at the scene, by the accused, to
police.

On the other hand, saying nothing to police carries risks also. When those
on one side of the incident talk freely to the police, and those on the other
side say nothing, talkers automatically go into the "victim" column on the
investigator's notebook, while the silent go into the "perpetrator" column.
Those assigned distinctions tend to be permanent and will color the
investigation from that point forward.

The best compromise is to have your well-rehearsed "tape loops" ready to go.
Tape loops need to be emphatic and unmistakable, but neither rude nor
insulting: "Officers, I want to cooperate, but I want my attorney here first"
, "
I'll be happy to answer all your questions just as soon as my attorney is
here."

At that point, police are obligated to stop questioning you. However, they
may say something to you like, "You can go the 'lawyer-route' is you want,
but it won't do you any good." , "You better start answering questions now,
while you still have the chance." , "All we want to do is just clear this up."
, "You'll feel much better after you talk with us." or, "We only have a few
questions, strictly routine..."


What they are trying to do is persuade you to definitively rescind your
demand that you have a lawyer to represent you during questioning. Once you
say, "Okay, I'll talk with you," they will assume, correctly, that you've
changed your mind and no longer want a lawyer. Don't do it! Continue to
remind investigators that you still want a lawyer and continue to politely decline to
answer questions.

So, when first confronting arriving police officers, (1) assume a non-threatening posture, with both palms turned outward and clearly visible. Make sure no guns or other weapons are visible. (2) Get into the "victim" column" right away with, "Officers, thank God you're here!" Then (3) identify yourself by saying, "I'm the one who called." VCAs don't call the police very often!

When asked what happened, say: "That man tried to murder us," pointing in
the direction of the perpetrator. Then comes (4) "I'll be happy to answer all
your questions just as soon as my attorney is here."

Beyond that, shut your mouth. Don't sign anything and don't "consent" to
anything. If arrested, submit peacefully and without comment. When asked
if you understand your rights, say "No." When asked what you don't understand,
say, "I don't understand any of it."

"Tape loops" need to be practiced every time we go to the range. None of the
foregoing may seem important, until the unthinkable happens. Then, I promise
you, the nightmare will begin, made all that much worse when you don't know
your lines!
 
You're certainly better off to make a brief statement to the police after any self defense incident you're in. Give the first responding officers a brief synopsis, so they can get on with the investigation. If you decide to make a short statement to the police, make it to a supervisor or the case detective. You don't want to make multiple statements. One will do fine.

Police officers are trained to make a brief factual statement after any shooting incident they're involved in. It is often referred to as a "public safety statement" and deals only with the relevant information needed to deal with the incident and to protect the scene. Such as, how many suspects were there? How were they dressed? If some escaped, which way did they go? Are there any witnesses around? Are there items of evidence around that need to be protected and recovered? Does anybody need medical attention?

You don't have to give them your life story and you probably won't be able to remember all the details about the incident, so DO NOT try to go into great detail. But a brief statement is probably in your best interests. You have to survive the initial incident, and then you have to survive the investigation, and then you have to survive any potential civil litigation.

If you respond to the police in the same way that they are trained to do when involved in a self-defense shooting, it may help them reach an understanding that you were indeed acting appropriately under the circumstances. If you lie to a cop, or try to hide something from a cop, or if they perceive that you are trying to hide something, they respond like sharks do when they smell blood in the water . . . you do NOT want that to happen to you. Nor do you want to talk too much, nor make multiple statements about what happened to multiple investigators. The more you think this stuff through in advance, the better off you will be.

You should locate an attorney locally who has some expertise and understanding of self-defense issues, and talk to him soon. Get an understanding of how the law works in YOUR STATE and also what the actual "prosecutorial climate" is toward self-defense incidents is in YOUR LOCATION. (Don't just depend on info you found on the net (even at THR!) or what you heard at the gunshop, the gunshow, at the sportsman's club, or at the bar. Or even, from your neighbor the cop.)

Remember, most cops and most prosecutors (and most defense attorneys) don't have that much experience investigating legitimate self defense shootings, because they don't happen all that often in most jurisdictions. So you need to do some research ahead of time.

IN THE GRAVEST EXTREME by Massad Ayoob remains the standard work on the legal issues of self defense. It was written in 1980 and needs to be updated, but most of the information in there is still valid.
 
general thoughts on self defense

You need to take a look at the law in YOUR STATE to see how the law is worded. In my state (Wisconsin) the use of force in self defense is specifically addressed by statute. (In some "common law" states, that is not true). The way the law is interpreted here is with the concept of "privilage" (also defined by statute) which defines the exceptional situations where you can use force in self-defense. Other states have the issue addressed differently, in more or less detail, and the wording may be easier or more difficult to understand.

Usually, the use of force requires an AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE at trial.

AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE -- Where you make the argument that you did the act, you did use force, and you were right and justified to do it. The burden of proof then shifts to you in trial strategy, and you must prove that your use of force was justified under the circumstances and under privilege.

DOCTRINE OF NECESSITY or THE DOCTRINE OF COMPETING HARMS --
Justification to break the law in those rare circumstance where obeying the law would result in more human injury than violating the law. Which is the lesser of two evils? Your use of force to protect yourself, or being injured or crippled or killed because you couldn't protect yourself? (This does not become applicable until the harm actually exists)

In a self-defense shooting, the appropriate tactic in court is that of the AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE. Essentially, you state "Yes, I used force on the guy who was trying to kill me, and I was justified in doing so, and this is why . . . " and then you explain why you did what you had to do.
Make a pre-emptive strike and get your side of the story out in front of the judge and jury as quickly as you can.
Once you have received formal training by somebody they then can be retained as an EXPERT WITNESS. They then have access to all the reports, can go to the crime scene and look it over, look at the evidence, depose witnesses, do reconstructions, do demonstrations in court, and etc. Your communication with them is protected under the attorney-client privilege.

"You never have the RIGHT to shoot anybody. "Self Defense" is an extenuating circumstance. Self -Defense is a justification for the use of force, but it DOES NOT confer a "right" in the normal sense.
If you shoot somebody, as far as the criminal justice system is concerned, it is the death of a citizen. A homicide has been committed, and they already have the guy who did it, which is YOU. It's up to you and your attorney to show that the actions that you took were reasonable under that particular set of unusual circumstances, based on the information KNOWN TO YOU AT THE TIME." -- John Farnam/Defense Training International
30 April 2000

So what does this mean in relation to your interactions with the police?
DON'T ACT LIKE A SUSPECT!! If there were circumstances that required you to use force to defend yourself, you need to get that out front immediately!
How much you tell the police at the scene will depend on the depth of your before event research, how "rattled" you are after the incident, and the advice of your attorney.

This question comes up all the time on the various internet forums. Often times people will resond to the question, and just keep repeating "don't say anything" over and over again, and it's clear that they don't have any training on the issue nor much personal experience. More significantly, they are ACTING LIKE A SUSPECT and NOT like a law-abiding citizen who had to use force to defend themselves.

Should you have the misfortune to become involved in such a situation, deal with it as you see best, but for God's sake do some research ahead of time, so that your actions -- legally, morally, and tactically -- are correct. This may mean that you have to read some books and attend some training. It certainly means that you have to know how the law works in YOUR state!
 
My CHL class was taught by a number of LEOs and their advice was along these lines, "I was attacked and had to defend myself. I'll be glad to give you a full statement as soon as I've had an opportunity to meet with my attorney." Sounded like good advice to me. Frame the situation but don't try to talk while still pumped full of adrenalin and not thinking clearly.

As an ex-law enforcement agent, this is the best advice I've read so far on this subject. But from my former perspective, several other things to strongly consider.

1. For everyone who says they would calmly state, "I'm Joe Blow, I live at 1234 YouNameTheStreet and I've just shot an intruder, please send help," you may be surprised and have another thing coming SHOULD you ever find yourself in this situation.

Shooting another human being is a traumatic event. Killing another human being is even more traumatic. Plan on NOT being calm, NOT having great presence of mind and DO plan on having a "confession" tendency if you do not do anything and everything possible to control it.

2. No matter what, make sure the dispatcher sends an ambulance--for YOU. Depending on your age and/or health, you could be a candidate for a mild (or severe) heart attack for starters. It never hurts to get checked out. And, it becomes part of the official investigation.

3. I've yet to meet the cop, who when arriving at such a scene, doesn't ask, "Can you tell me what happened?" And therein lies the pitfalls. Not so much as from where the investigating officer sits, but from where the idiot District Attorney sits. A DA wants convictions and rarely gives a damn where he/she gets them. He/she will spin it to the press in a manner most advantageous to himself and his inevitable run for a Congressional seat.

You can tell the cop certain elements such as "he broke into my home" or "I came home and went into the bedroom and he ran at me from inside the closet" or something. You generally do NOT have to tell the investigating cop that you shot the intruder. Let them draw that assumption

If you immediately "lawyer up," that can also raise suspicion with the investigating officer. Instead, stating something such as, "Officer, I'm feeling like I could pass out at any second. I just want to go to the hospital and get checked out. When everything is okay, I'll call my attorney and then we can all sit down and talk, okay?"

3. This one is important. If you get a confrontational cop, or one who insists on questioning you, request that he/she immediately call their supervisor to the scene and then don't say another word to the cop. If he refuses, pick up your wireless/cell phone and call 9-1-1 right back and state that you are being asked to answer questions without your lawer and to please send a supervisor or higher ranking cop to the scene immediately.

You want all of that on the dispatcher's tape.

In summary, you're gonna be shook up, you're gonna want to "confess" or "explain," but instead ask for medical attention (and DON'T talk to the EMTs either!), and if the cop pushes or hassles or otherwise makes you uncomfortable, demand that he send out a superior.

Until then, pray you never have to use any of the advice given on this subject.

Jeff
 
ironic that the LE people who posted consider it a sign of guilt for someone to want to wait for their attorney to come after a shooting, yet virtually every LE agency allows their officers that privilege w/o considering it a sign of guilt. in many cases it is built into the police union contract.

I suspect you will get a fair break in most areas of the country from the investigating officers. Most of them don't have a lot of sympathy for crooks and won't really care much if another crook gets but to sleep.

places like chicago are a crap shoot, because the SA may decide to make an example of you even if the cops think you are clean.
 
ironic that the LE people who posted consider it a sign of guilt for someone to want to wait for their attorney to come after a shooting, yet virtually every LE agency allows their officers that privilege w/o considering it a sign of guilt. in many cases it is built into the police union contract.

I suspect you will get a fair break in most areas of the country from the investigating officers. Most of them don't have a lot of sympathy for crooks and won't really care much if another crook gets but to sleep.

Various reasons for this:

1. Today's new generation of cop sees himself as an extension of the prosecuting system rather than a protector of the citizenry. That's the power of the badge. When I left federal law enforcement, that power-complex was beyond nauseating.

2. It's an evolutionary process. Investigate enough crimes and you become jaded. Most uniformed units that will respond to the call we're discussing have been to hundreds, if not thousands of previous domestic disturbances where things are rarely as they initially appear.

3. Cops answer more than just home invasion calls. Think of all the various calls they go on. Most of the time, they deal with the scourges of society who are adept and experienced at navigating our "justice" system, and know to lawyer up immediately.

When a private citizen does this, it clicks off a reflex factor in the cop, as in "If you think you need a laywer, then . . ."

Were it not for overzealous prosecutors, piece-of-crap injury/ambulance chasing lawyers who sue the home owners, etc, most folks would have no problem telling the investigating officer(s) exactly what happened.

Jeff
 
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