what's your preferred bp substitute?

[TTv2]

Getting into blackpowder and I would like to here from those on which substitute they prefer? The stores near me don't carry real black, but all of them have pyrodex and some have triple 7. Between the two, which do you prefer and which is easier to clean?

 

[Stony]

If I had to use something other than the real thing....and it would have to be something really pressing for me to do so, I guess I would use some 777. It's hard for me to recommend anything other than the real stuff. Many years ago when Pyrodex first came out I tried some and was so disappointed I have never used it again. Cleaning procedures are basically the same for any of them.
Asking for a recommendation between Pyrodex and 777 is sort of like asking a guy which he would prefer, halitosis or bad breath.

 

[rodwha]

I use Triple 7 at times, but typically use Olde Eynsford. My guns are hunting sidearms that I expect a certain level of power from that most powders cannot achieve. The difference is often over 100 ft/lbs leaving the others with 300 ft/lbs or less.

My father gave me some Pyrodex and I disliked the sticky fouling.

It's also known to corrode faster and worse than BP, though that's moot if you clean it right away.

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Howdy

The few times I have used a Black Powder substitute I have used APP.

http://www.americanpioneerpowder.com/products.html

I have heard too many reports over the years that Pyrodex is more corrosive than real Black Powder, plus Pyrodex requires a bullet lubed with a soft BP compatible bullet lube, no different than real Black Powder does.

I have not wanted to mess with 777, because it is more powerful than real Black Powder and I don't want to subject some of my antique cartridge revolvers to that.

APP does not require a Black Powder compatible bullet lube, it can be used with regular hard cast bullets with regular hard cast bullet lube.

Of course, normally I use Schuetzen FFg for all my Black Powder shooting.

 

[Steel Horse Rider]

I used Pyrodex before I got into flint and found a source for real black powder. I never found Pyrodex any harder to clean than the real stuff (hot water and dish soap clean both very quickly) but I do not like the odor of burned Pyrodex as it smells like rotten eggs.

 

[Noz]

I've tried all of the subs up to blackmaz(sp)
Cleanshot Pyrodex 777 APP(Shockey's Gold) and of those if I were forced to choose it would be APP. I've used Pyrodex in my shotguns and I can show you a lovely Ithaca 200E with a pitted barrel. I bought a container of 777 and was so disappointed I sold 3/4 of it. Early on tried the Cleanshot but it disappeared so APP was the only usable one for me. Point is moot as I shoot nothing but real black, currently KIK as powder of choice.

 

[BigBore45]

Between pyrodex and Triple 7 I would pick triple 7 all day. So what if it's a bit stronger than real BP. Just down load 10%. It's pretty clean and not near as corrosive.


If you have a modern BP gun then no problem at all with the bit extra kick to it.

 

[BCRider]

I've only used Pyrodex in some rifle cartridges for my cowboy action shooting. And it's horrible for the fouling it does on the brass.

TTv2, you don't list in your profile where you live. But generally black powder shooting is popular enough that I'm willing to bet an E-beer that there's at least a modest size group in your area. Perhaps make contact with them through one of the gun stores or check the club's in your area for indications of black powder shooting events. Dig a little like this and it's likely you'll find a local source for the proper stuff.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

I use Pyrodex in muzzleloading rifle because it is a volume-for-volume equivalent to black powder and is not overly sensitive to variations in compression.

I use Triple 7 in loading cartridges because it is slightly more powerful. Although it is sensitive to variations in compression, I have more control over that problem in seating bullets in cartrdige than I have when ramming a bullet down a barrel with a ramrod.

When I decide to shoot them for nostalgia sake, my two worn out *slightly* stretched brass frame cap'n'ball revolvers get true black powder only. My experience with BP substitutes is that they perform best in revolvers if there is very tight cylinder/barrel gap: they seem to burn slower than true BP.

The substitutes are not as hazardous as BP because the oxidizer is harder to ignite, but their residue is more corrosive than BP residue which is corrosive enough as is. I clean thoroughly with water and dish detergent or Windex, follow-up clean 3 days later, and double check clean a week after the follow-up clean.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I use loose Pyrodex simply because it is relatively easy to find in my area and I've never had bad results with it.
Yes, cleaning requires some effort, but come on. We're shooting BP guns here. That is part of it.

 

[Patocazador]

Blackhorn 209 or real black powder. None of the others are suitable IMO.

 

[Noz]

Powderinc is in Clarksville AR and is the major source in the midwest for black powder.

 

[TTv2]

I've only used Pyrodex in some rifle cartridges for my cowboy action shooting. And it's horrible for the fouling it does on the brass.

TTv2, you don't list in your profile where you live. But generally black powder shooting is popular enough that I'm willing to bet an E-beer that there's at least a modest size group in your area. Perhaps make contact with them through one of the gun stores or check the club's in your area for indications of black powder shooting events. Dig a little like this and it's likely you'll find a local source for the proper stuff.

That's the route I'd go, but the indorr range doesn't allow blackpowder/subs. This is for backyard shooting in my parent's woods the couple times I'm there every year.

Also, nobody at the range shoots bp, hence y I'm here.

 

[rodwha]

There was a test done on another forum in which three pieces of steel had a pile of powder, Pyrodex, Triple 7, and BP that were lit and left in a humid garage for 4 days. Pyrodex was by far the worst and left some pitting. The BP also had some minor pitting, but the T7 was nearly pristine after it was cleaned off.

I looked for it as I though I posted it here too, but didn't find it.

After taking two revolvers and a rifle to the range and spending much more time than I planned I only cleaned my revolvers and left the rifle 'til the morning as I had read a couple of CAS guys claimed to leave theirs for days without issue. I had used Pyrodex and it wreaked havoc on my barrel that took hours to get a clean patch from.

Later I read of a guy who applied Ballistol to the inside and out of his revolver and was able to wait with the theory being the fouling absorbs oil giving no way for moisture to touch the gun. I tried this and found it to be true. It's nice to know if you ever run short on time, though I clean my guns a soon as I get home.

 

[damoc]

777 Ive found pyrodex to deteriorate and lose power over time if it has any air
available to it.

 

[X-Rap]

I'm a hunter not a purist, triple 7 has been my go to powder for many years. I tried some Shockey Gold and it shot like half a charge of 777. Got a jug of BP, Pyrdex,and the Gold that I may as well dump on the grass.