+101 on the AMT hating.
Which is the worst .45 pistol ever made in your opinion?
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RPRNY
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The WWII "Liberator". Single shot, two inch, smoothbore barrel made from stamped parts and dropped behind enemy lines under OSS and SOE direction. Effective to about 6ft.
Tejicano Loco
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I hear a lot of hate on the AMT's but have not had problems with mine.
I have and AMT Government model - similar to the hardballer but the slide/frame fit was looser. Accuracy is ho-hum but not terrible. I don't shoot it a lot these days because I don't get to go shooting enough as it is. I pretty much only shot 230 grain FMJ out of it because I believe in heavy bullets and back when it was my main pistol - 20 years ago - 230 grain JHP's were very rare. So that may be another part of the reason that I never had a problem with it.
I believe the AMT Hardballers had functioning problems because of the tight fit on the slide and the type of stainless steel used. The slide/frame fit on the Government model was loose enough that it didn't bind.
I have and AMT Government model - similar to the hardballer but the slide/frame fit was looser. Accuracy is ho-hum but not terrible. I don't shoot it a lot these days because I don't get to go shooting enough as it is. I pretty much only shot 230 grain FMJ out of it because I believe in heavy bullets and back when it was my main pistol - 20 years ago - 230 grain JHP's were very rare. So that may be another part of the reason that I never had a problem with it.
I believe the AMT Hardballers had functioning problems because of the tight fit on the slide and the type of stainless steel used. The slide/frame fit on the Government model was loose enough that it didn't bind.
I've never tried any of "the worst" thanks to some good advice I've received before (thanks Dan-D if you ever come around here), but my understanding is there are a few of the cheaper brands to absolutely avoid because their material standards are so low they are often a serious safety risk to their own operators. Here's the list of ones to avoid at all costs: Lorcin, Phoenix Arms, Standard Arms, Jimenez, Bryco, Jennings, and High Point. Hi-Point may be technically safe, but they're no fun to shoot, not reliable, and seriously ugly to boot. 
Another brand I generally steer clear of is Taurus. Never fired a .45 by them, but their autos are generally not reliable enough for me to trust them for carry, and also not great shooters for range-toys either.
Another brand I generally steer clear of is Taurus. Never fired a .45 by them, but their autos are generally not reliable enough for me to trust them for carry, and also not great shooters for range-toys either.
Old Dog
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Always the Taurus hate from folks who admit they've never tried one ...
Have gone through two PT-145s that were superb pistols; a couple friends with PT-1911s have had no problems with 'em, and love 'em. My PT-92 (bought new in 1991) is a gem -- in five figures for round count, never ever a malfunction.
Back to the OP's topic: I have to jump onboard the Llama bandwagon ... my brother inherited one from Grandpa that we just couldn't get to digest a whole magazine. We tried everything, for months. It looked nice, was reasonably accurate as a single-shot, but no one could get it to work ...
Many would disagree.
Have gone through two PT-145s that were superb pistols; a couple friends with PT-1911s have had no problems with 'em, and love 'em. My PT-92 (bought new in 1991) is a gem -- in five figures for round count, never ever a malfunction.
Back to the OP's topic: I have to jump onboard the Llama bandwagon ... my brother inherited one from Grandpa that we just couldn't get to digest a whole magazine. We tried everything, for months. It looked nice, was reasonably accurate as a single-shot, but no one could get it to work ...
CoRoMo
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The Haskell JS-45
Valkman
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I've had .45's in a Star Firestar, 3 xd's and lots of 1911's and never have had a problem with any of them. Norinco, Kimber, SA, all were great. My one Colt had like a 10# trigger pull but I fixed that. So none of them really although I'm glad to not have to carry that Firestar anymore!
Monac
Member
A) I am surprised no one in this thread ever mentioned the AMT Backup in 45 ACP. What I heard was that it was too small, had a poorly shaped grip and a terrible DAO trigger, and was made to AMT's usual highly variable manufacturing standards.
B) My personal suggestion would be the very obscure Thomas 45 automatic pistol from the late 1970's or early 1980's. It relied on grip strength to hold the slide closed for an adequate time during the firing cycle. No, really, it had a thing that looked like a grip safety but actually stuck two small fingers from the frame up into the slide when gripped. These held the slide closed until the recoil forced the grip safety thing back into your hand. It had a long springy DAO trigger too. As a bonus, anyone who was unfamiliar with the gun could not get the slide open to check the firing chamber or load the first round. The one time I took it apart, I had to have a much stronger friend put it back together; I could not get the slide back and down over the barrel hood.
I have never fired it. All of them that I have seen have been in mint or near mint condition, suggesting that shooting them did not work out very well for anyone.
C) This thread had been dead for over two years before being revived. Cesoir45's AMT must be really good!
B) My personal suggestion would be the very obscure Thomas 45 automatic pistol from the late 1970's or early 1980's. It relied on grip strength to hold the slide closed for an adequate time during the firing cycle. No, really, it had a thing that looked like a grip safety but actually stuck two small fingers from the frame up into the slide when gripped. These held the slide closed until the recoil forced the grip safety thing back into your hand. It had a long springy DAO trigger too. As a bonus, anyone who was unfamiliar with the gun could not get the slide open to check the firing chamber or load the first round. The one time I took it apart, I had to have a much stronger friend put it back together; I could not get the slide back and down over the barrel hood.
I have never fired it. All of them that I have seen have been in mint or near mint condition, suggesting that shooting them did not work out very well for anyone.
C) This thread had been dead for over two years before being revived. Cesoir45's AMT must be really good!
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Gladius
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Encom MP-45. Big, heavy, inaccurate, could not get through a full magazine without several jams. Soured me on the whole "cheap tacticool pistol" thing.
commygun
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I'm probably the only one but in my personal experience it would be CZ-97. Beautiful pistol but with more than 6 rounds in the magazine it wouldn't even feed FMJ reliably. I tried three different magazines and got the same result every time. Puzzling but there it is. Too bad because if it had been reliable I'd still have it.
Montana_was_a_leg
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In regards to reliability problems with the AMT hardballer, (and please, someone correct me if I am wrong about this) but doesn't the manual state that it should only be fed hardball Ammo? Hence the name?
ljnowell
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I traded for one once. It was reliable and pretty accurate. The problem was it was very bulky and balanced very poorly. My dad has it now and it's still running great.
I would buy a hi point before a taurus. The high point has a much better chance of working when new and if it has to go back will probably be fixed on the first trip to the factory, unlike Taurus in many cases.
Tallball
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Maybe ask about "the worst 45 pistol to ever be manufactured in largish numbers and sold to the public"? One offs made in someone's shed and primitive devices like the Liberator aren't really an apples to apples comparison with some of these others.
My 45's have all been okay. I have seen some cheap 45 derringers that I would be afraid to shoot.
My 45's have all been okay. I have seen some cheap 45 derringers that I would be afraid to shoot.
I've shot Hi-Points that were reliable and accurate. I put about 400 rounds through one on one night once. It held up just fine. We used it to knock bricks off a chimney on an old house. Or we tried it anyway. I managed to knock one chunk of a brick off. But we were hitting that chimney from about 40 yards pretty much every shot. It couldn't have been that inaccurate.
I didn't see a limitation on the .45 ACP here so I'm going with a .45 LC. My pick - The Judge. Maybe it's just because it was over-hyped and too many think it's a super gun but I don't think a .410 round is all that devastating in a revolver. They have no range at all to speak of. The fact it can shoot a .45 LC doesn't help it a lot IMO. It's still a revolver with a cylinder that's too long IMO. You can get more power from shorter rounds which make for more manageable revolvers. Yes you can load your own cartridges and get maybe even more power but I don't trust handloaded stuff for SD and that is the primary use for the Judge. Overall I just think it's a bad package. Obviously other guns have had more issues but for just plain bad design I'll pick the Judge.
I didn't see a limitation on the .45 ACP here so I'm going with a .45 LC. My pick - The Judge. Maybe it's just because it was over-hyped and too many think it's a super gun but I don't think a .410 round is all that devastating in a revolver. They have no range at all to speak of. The fact it can shoot a .45 LC doesn't help it a lot IMO. It's still a revolver with a cylinder that's too long IMO. You can get more power from shorter rounds which make for more manageable revolvers. Yes you can load your own cartridges and get maybe even more power but I don't trust handloaded stuff for SD and that is the primary use for the Judge. Overall I just think it's a bad package. Obviously other guns have had more issues but for just plain bad design I'll pick the Judge.
JR24
Member
Huh. Odd. I'd put my Warrior up against any Colt I've run across. Darn fine shooter, reliable, accurate and a phenomenal trigger. Thousands of rounds in and the MIM hasn't all shaken apart, crazy I know. Heck, my Glock 23 has had more chokes (and less rounds) than either of my Kimbers.
I honestly haven't encountered a bad .45 so far, so I count myself lucky.
2 Star Firestar .45s have been perfect. I sold the first one to buy an Egyptian Maadi AK.
I sold the AK to buy a Marlin .44 Mag. I bought the second Firestar because I missed the first one. I often think about selling the Firestar. Then, I shoot it and forget about selling it.
Never a problem with that gun. I had bought two spare mags in 1993 that weren't worth a dang. Swapped them out at the distributor for two more that were perfect.
ATI Commander .45 has been great EXCEPT for the soft ejector.
Taurus Judge has been perfect. It always works. It is a great snake gun with .410 birdshot. I bought it for a snake gun and a range toy. Didn't care about the hype or the hate.
S&W 4566. Perfect in every way.
AMT Government model. Slide was very tight to frame and the frame and slide rails had the same matte/rough sand/bead blasted finish as the outside of the gun.
Jammed every 1-2 rounds with ball. Wouldn't even chamber HP.
Spent an entire day with that gun in pieces and two Arkansas oilstones, and a Dremel with felt bobs and different polishing pastes and impregnated rubber points.
After that, it was 100% reliable, had a great trigger, and was accurate.
It was even reliable with the Speer 200 grain Flying Ashtray (the acid test of .45 autopistol feed reliability).
EAA Witness .45. Perfect.
Rexio break open single shot .45 Colt/.410.
You have to aim it up to cock it. Otherwise, the transfer bar hits the firing pin.
It's in a box, in pieces. Awaiting a "round tuit" for me to either modify the transfer bar or design/make a new one. Or, shorten and/or further radius the back of the firing pin.
So, the AMT sucked out of the box, but was great after I put a lot of time and work into it.
The Rexio sucked out of the box and I still need to get inspired enough to fix it.
The EAA/Smith/Star have been perfect.
The ATI is great except for the factory ejector.
To be fair, I knew it may or may not have a soft ejector before I bought one.
I bought it with the idea of replacing ejector, slide stop, and safety with Ed Brown or Wilson parts. I want the extended slide stop and I need an ambidextrous safety.
I also bought it with the idea of milling the slide for Novak LoMount night sights.
I sold the AK to buy a Marlin .44 Mag. I bought the second Firestar because I missed the first one. I often think about selling the Firestar. Then, I shoot it and forget about selling it.
Never a problem with that gun. I had bought two spare mags in 1993 that weren't worth a dang. Swapped them out at the distributor for two more that were perfect.
ATI Commander .45 has been great EXCEPT for the soft ejector.
Taurus Judge has been perfect. It always works. It is a great snake gun with .410 birdshot. I bought it for a snake gun and a range toy. Didn't care about the hype or the hate.
S&W 4566. Perfect in every way.
AMT Government model. Slide was very tight to frame and the frame and slide rails had the same matte/rough sand/bead blasted finish as the outside of the gun.
Jammed every 1-2 rounds with ball. Wouldn't even chamber HP.
Spent an entire day with that gun in pieces and two Arkansas oilstones, and a Dremel with felt bobs and different polishing pastes and impregnated rubber points.
After that, it was 100% reliable, had a great trigger, and was accurate.
It was even reliable with the Speer 200 grain Flying Ashtray (the acid test of .45 autopistol feed reliability).
EAA Witness .45. Perfect.
Rexio break open single shot .45 Colt/.410.
You have to aim it up to cock it. Otherwise, the transfer bar hits the firing pin.
It's in a box, in pieces. Awaiting a "round tuit" for me to either modify the transfer bar or design/make a new one. Or, shorten and/or further radius the back of the firing pin.
So, the AMT sucked out of the box, but was great after I put a lot of time and work into it.
The Rexio sucked out of the box and I still need to get inspired enough to fix it.
The EAA/Smith/Star have been perfect.
The ATI is great except for the factory ejector.
To be fair, I knew it may or may not have a soft ejector before I bought one.
I bought it with the idea of replacing ejector, slide stop, and safety with Ed Brown or Wilson parts. I want the extended slide stop and I need an ambidextrous safety.
I also bought it with the idea of milling the slide for Novak LoMount night sights.
Grunt
Member
Worst .45 I ever owned was a S&W SW99. Odd unaesthetic shaped with a longer grip than slide, horrible creepy trigger, my finger rubbed against the magazine release, the slide routinely failed to lock back when empty and had the worst accuracy of any .45 auto In my collection. Seldom is it that I sell a gun but that one didn't hang around very long.
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