Which of these three powders for 45acp?

[Detritus]

Getting time for more powder and I cannot find my old standby 45 powdwer W231 locally.

What I can find are unique, bullseye, and WST.
I'm loading plated 230gr rn and looking to make USPSA major. And have no experience with any of these three powders.

Advice etc would be appriciated

Thank you for your time and advice

 

[Metal God]

bullseye , unique , WST in that order . Maybe WST before unique but bullseye first . Bullseye has been the go to 45acp powder for ever .

 

[SlowFuse]

All three work well but I would choose wst or bullseye. If I really had to narrow it down to one it would be wst.

Cleaner than bullseye.

 

[ColtPythonElite]

Unique is about all I use in .45ACP.

 

[Reloadron]

Winchester 231 and HP 38 are one in the same, Hodgdon's technical support should back that up. I like Unique in the 45 ACP followed by Bullseye.

Ron

 

[LiveLife]

bullseye, unique, WST in that order

Unique is about all I use in .45ACP.

I have never seen anyone use Unique for USPSA loads as they are loaded to lighter minor/major PF velocities and Unique doesn't produce consistent enough powder burn/chamber pressures at lower charges. And with 230 gr, you are pushing only 717 fps to meet major power factor which is below start charges for most powders and you will need fast burning powders to produce accuracy at lower charges.

plated 230gr rn and looking to make USPSA major

+1 for HP-38 if you can't find W231.

Out of the three for USPSA major PF loads, I would use WST and Bullseye but not Unique as you only need to push 717 fps for 165 PF (730 fps for 170 PF) which is below start charges at less than 14,000 CUP and not sure if Unique will produce consistent enough powder burn for accurate loads.

But if using WST, keep in mind that WST is reverse temperature sensitive so loads you develop now in colder temperature will shoot slower in hot summer weather so would need to rechrono your loads to meet PF requirements.

Bullseye is temperature sensitive but not as bad as W231/HP-38 so you won't have to worry about meeting power factor requirement as your load will shoot faster in the summer heat - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=10117881#post10117881

 

[Oldman1151]

Unique is about all I use in .45ACP.

Unique works great for me with 230 LRN and coated.

 

[LiveLife]

OP is using plated 230 gr RN.

I have found most plated RN bullets to have rounded bullet base which will allow leakage of more gas.

With slower velocities to meet major PF requirement of around 717-730 fps, gas leakage will likely make things worse for Unique.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I also recommend WST of the three. Bullseye and especially Unique are too dirty for competition use. You don't want you Flynn to fail on a stage.

If you are willing to change powders I have to add my voice to W231/HP-38. It is a great choice for the 45 ACP. It meters well, will deliver major without excessive pressures, it's accurate and velocities are consistent.

 

[Metal God]

Sorry I totally skipped the competition part of the thread and never should have even posted because I don't shoot any pistol competition . oops :banghead:

 

[Detritus]

If you are willing to change powders I have to add my voice to W231/HP-38.

Well that's kind of the thing. I would very much like to have a few pounds of W231/HP-38, since I have a fairly good and accurate load worked up with 231 and the 230gr plated RNs I have. But currently can not find it/them locally.

and it is this lack of a supply of W231/HP-38, that leads me here

So if WST would be the best of the three, anyone have a good source of Start and max loads for a 230gr plated??

of course i'm still open to further input on all.


P.S. since I found a pound of it in the back of my stash, anyone have a good load for Power Pistol + a 230gr ??

 

[LiveLife]

Since you are looking for major PF load, you only need 717-730 fps for 165-170 PF and only your chrono will tell you that. Keep in mind the reverse temperature sensitivity of WST so you may need to increase powder charge for warmer seasons and rechrono your loads.

I have used lead load data for plated bullet with good results - http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/pistol

230 gr Lead RN WST COL 1.200" Start 4.0 gr (776 fps) 14,300 CUP - Max 4.3 gr (812 fps) 16,400 CUP

For increased accuracy, I would use the longest OAL that will pass the plunk test and reliably feed/chamber from the magazine to reduce gas leakage.

 

[Detritus]

For increased accuracy, I would use the longest OAL that will pass the plunk test and reliably feed/chamber from the magazine to reduce gas leakage.

currently seating them to around 1.270" or so, this isn't the max to pass the plunk test but it feeds well and except in my last batch (with CFE-Pistol) has given good results.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I load plated bullets with cast bullet data or up to middle jacketed data. I would think the starting charge for a 230gr LRN bullet with 4.0gr us a good starting place. Then check for accuracy and velocity to make power.

I would send away for 8 lbs of W231 if it were me.

 

[MikeInOr]

I have used Bullseye in .45acp for years. I haven't been able to find any lately so I tried a pound of bluedot. It takes twice as much powder per load with Bluedot than Bullseye. I hadn't ever realized how much unused case volume there is with Bullseye. I never really had any accuracy problems with Bullseye but I don't know about consistancy because I haven't t had a chronograph until recently. I would guess Bullseye would be less consistant because of the unused case volume but to me accuracy is really the only thing that counts.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I have used Bullseye in .45acp for years. I haven't been able to find any lately so I tried a pound of bluedot. It takes twice as much powder per load with Bluedot than Bullseye. I hadn't ever realized how much unused case volume there is with Bullseye. I never really had any accuracy problems with Bullseye but I don't know about consistancy because I haven't t had a chronograph until recently. I would guess Bullseye would be less consistant because of the unused case volume but to me accuracy is really the only thing that counts.

Again, the OP is talking about ammo used in competition so he has to be sure the results are clean. You can't clean your gun in the middle of a stage where a failure will coast you a match.

I know there are many who say dirty doesn't bother me, I clean my guns,after shooting but sometimes it does matter before you get to clean them.

 

[TommyD45]

For me, Unique is the way to go. It works well and is a bulky powder and if you accidentally double charge it, it is virtually impossible to fail to notice it. You won't be able to seat the bullet.

I don't dispute that Bullseye is a fine powder, but with the low volume it occupies in the 45 ACP case it is certainly possible to double charge and not notice it.

You can say, "I'm very careful and it will never happen to me."

I have a friend who used to think the same thing. One day we were on the range together he had a big Ka-Boom. The unsupported part of the case burst. The bottom of the magazine blew out as well as the 3 remaining live rounds in it. The Pachmayr rubber grips were noticeably bulged. Another round in the box was a squib, supporting our belief that it was a double charge that blew.

He was lucky to only have some minor cuts on his support hand when the bottom blew out. I think that the Pachmayr grips absorbed a lot of the blast and saved his shooting hand from injury.

After that, he switched to a bulkier powder.

 

[slapdead]

I've used Unique, HP38/W231, AA2, AA5, Blue Dot, Universal, and TiteGroup behind 230's, 200's, and 185's. The hands down favorite in my guns Para14 and Glock 21's has been the Titegroup. Low flash, very accurate and consistent, and very clean burning.

 

[JohnnyFlake]

I have been loading .45acp for over 40 years. When I first started and for at least 10 years, I used Bullseye, as it is what the military used from the very beginning. In later years, a friend turned me on to W231 because he found it to me more accurate. So, I tried it and never turned back. I found it be more accurate in my guns as well. So for the last 30 years or so, I have only ever used W231 and recently HP-38 because I have not been able to find W231 anywhere. W231 & HP-38 are virtually the exact same powder.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

The original powder trinity is Bullseye, Unique and 2400 but not because they were best but because they were the only powders available. My powder trinity is a little different and a little more current. Like I have posted many times, I can load all my handgun cartridges with only 3 powders and do it well. Those powders are W231(HP-38), W540(HS-6) and W296(H110). I use mostly W231 and I do use a lot of others to give them a try but always come back to my powder trinity.

 

[1KPerDay]

Any of those powders will work great in the .45 ACP. I've been loading WST lately.

 

[DBEAM]

How much titegroup do use behind your 230gn rounds slapdead? I'm currently loading 4.6 gns behind 230 gn xt at an oal it 1.25 and think that still might be a little weak (I started at 4.4 gns).

 

[Ironicaintit]

I like unique for full tilt, 230gr loads....
But since you are only wanting to build the rounds hot enough to qualify....
I would not use it. Dirty, and relatively inconsistent at the lower levels.

I have no experience with the other two, built to run at lower speeds

 

[Detritus]

But since you are only wanting to build the rounds hot enough to qualify....

Never meant to imply that I wanted to "just" make major

Would very much like to have a goodly cushion of MV over and above the 717fps needed for Major with a 230gr bullet.

my mention of needing major PF loads was because a few times in the past when I've asked for suggestions RE powder and loads, a goodly number of the loads suggested were accurate but "powder-puff" loads that I couldn't really use.

so yeah, got no problem with upper end loads

 

[jtap1957]

I use Hodgdon Titegroup in both my Springfield XDm and 1911. Love it!