bamawrx
Member
Ok it says 8m10 on the UL label. And double fire protection under that. What does this rating mean?
Thanks
Thanks
Why a safe isn't enough!
- Thread starter CraigJS
- Start date
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This is no different than the lock on your front door. It is not all that hard to break into almost any home. Locks do not stop anyone that really wants in. The idea is to deter them and slow them up enough that they go elsewhere.
Locks, dogs, alarms, safes, etc all contribute to the security of your collection, but nothing prevents a determined criminal fom getting your goodies if he has enough time to work on it.
Most of these crimes are not random either. They come to your house because they know you have something they want. Don't advertise what you have.
Locks, dogs, alarms, safes, etc all contribute to the security of your collection, but nothing prevents a determined criminal fom getting your goodies if he has enough time to work on it.
Most of these crimes are not random either. They come to your house because they know you have something they want. Don't advertise what you have.
Am Sec LP6030
I've read many positive posts about Am Sec's high price models, but I was wondering if anyone has any input about Am Sec's low end model the LP? How does it compare to the 12 gauge RSCs sold by other companies like the Ft. Knox Maverick.
I've read many positive posts about Am Sec's high price models, but I was wondering if anyone has any input about Am Sec's low end model the LP? How does it compare to the 12 gauge RSCs sold by other companies like the Ft. Knox Maverick.
Geronimo45
Member
Well... you could always have the inside of your safe filled with black powder. There was a case where a thief burned his way into a safe - then blew up 'cause of the black powder inside. Instead of the 'human blood samples' you should put 'human urine samples'.
I'm one who prefers to hide in weird places than to use a safe. When I go to swim, the .45 goes to the fridge or freezer - the veggie compartment. So does the wallet and keys. If you get a safe, get one put in the floor. Roll up the carpet to get to it. Have an el cheapo safe up top for emergency use stuff - extra ammo, etc.
Another alternative - stick your guns in a black trash sack and stick then in the fireplace.
Just a FYI: yes, the 1911 does seem to nearly fit into a VCR. A smaller gun (PPK, Bersa) would fit better. Would surprise a burglar to no end if you pushed 'eject' and got a gun. Point of this? Guns - especially small ones - can go in some interesting places. If you don't have a safe, put your guns all over the house to hide.
Does it speak to my deviant sense of humor that I put my 1911 in the 'Battleship' game case?
I'm one who prefers to hide in weird places than to use a safe. When I go to swim, the .45 goes to the fridge or freezer - the veggie compartment. So does the wallet and keys. If you get a safe, get one put in the floor. Roll up the carpet to get to it. Have an el cheapo safe up top for emergency use stuff - extra ammo, etc.
Another alternative - stick your guns in a black trash sack and stick then in the fireplace.
Just a FYI: yes, the 1911 does seem to nearly fit into a VCR. A smaller gun (PPK, Bersa) would fit better. Would surprise a burglar to no end if you pushed 'eject' and got a gun. Point of this? Guns - especially small ones - can go in some interesting places. If you don't have a safe, put your guns all over the house to hide.
Does it speak to my deviant sense of humor that I put my 1911 in the 'Battleship' game case?
LoadedDrum
Member
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 612
1911 in the 'reefer? What about condensation when you pull it out? Also hiding a gun in a vcr is not a good idea as a thief is likely to steal a VCR. Instead, consider putting it in the bottom of your hamper. Who wants to steal dirty clothes.
a1abdj
Member
The LP series is an imported line that they put their name on. There are nicer imported safes available for the same or less money.
wally
Member
I keep my black powder stored inside my safe, on the door right behind the lock.
There is a warning sign on the safe that says "Danger! Black Powder stored inside."
I may lose my guns but I'll have had the satisfaction of taking out any a**h**** with a torch or plasma cutter.
Its not a booby trap, its proper storage with a warning label attached!
--wally.
There is a warning sign on the safe that says "Danger! Black Powder stored inside."
I may lose my guns but I'll have had the satisfaction of taking out any a**h**** with a torch or plasma cutter.
Its not a booby trap, its proper storage with a warning label attached!
--wally.
CraigJS
Member
Yes they got the guns, no it wasn't "staged" (ask yourself Carpetbagger, why would someone "stage" it..), the guy has a reward sign out next to the safe. And yes the photo was cropped, not to show the guys home phone number!
Well at least it got SOME of you thinking.
Be safe.
Well at least it got SOME of you thinking.
Be safe.
a1abdj
Member
CraigJS,
If you know the owner of the safe, have him (or her) contact me.
If I were him, I would sue the manufacturer. They clearly misrepresent the security their safes provide.
If you know the owner of the safe, have him (or her) contact me.
If I were him, I would sue the manufacturer. They clearly misrepresent the security their safes provide.
DesertRat
Member
flagged for future reference...heypete
Member
Emphasis on "intelligent".
My friend is married to an Arizona highway patrolman ("DPS Officer"). A month or two ago, some guy turned on all the external faucets for a bunch of homes in their townhome development, hosed down a few cars, and finally bashed in the glass window next to her front door with the burglar alarm warning sign ("This house protected by [company]").
She armed herself with the shotgun and hopped on the horn to call 911, while the husband armed himself with his Sig and Surefire and poked his head out of the bedroom door, zapped the guy with the light (causing the bad guy to flee), and getting a basic description. Cops showed up shortly afterwards and apprehended the half-naked bad guy skulking in the bushes nearby. Turnes out he was some kind of crazy guy.
But still, the part about bashing the window with the alarm company sign cracks me up.
antagonist22
Member
That's why if you plan on using a safe, you put it somewhere not so visible.And since you are cautious enough to use a safe then you should probably put trigger locks on your guns.
dragongoddess
member
Ok I'll ask the question. How the heck do you hide a gun safe. They weigh hundereds of pounds are nearly 6ft tall and wide enough for a TV or two.
heypete
Member
Trigger locks are a child-safety device, not an anti-theft device. They can be defeated in just a few moments with a screwdriver and a hammer. If someone has the means to enter an RSC or a safe, defeating a trigger lock would be trivial indeed.
I just bought a Cannon C23 RSC (only 12 gauge steel, alas), and it's all I could afford, and about as large as is practical in my apartment. A proper safe would not be suitable in this apartment, and it's thicker, stronger construction would be wasted as one could easily cut out the wall behind it (arrangement of the apartment requires its back facing an interior wall of a closet, it wouldn't fit against the main walls, and even if it could, it'd be visible to anyone looking in) and remove the safe itself. It sure beats the thin sheet steel Stack-On cabinet I used before.
When I move into a proper house, and have a fair bit of money, I'll get a proper safe (the AmSec RF6528 looks promising, and reasonably affordable. At 3,455, that's a fair bit of protection). But until then, this is the best I've got.
heypete
Member
If it's a large, proper safe, mounting it in the garage seems to be pretty common. It's probably not practical for most residential floors.
With my Cannon RSC, I have it mounted in the closet of my apartment. It's out of direct sight from anyone in the main part of the apartment (it's just a studio).
When I lived in California, I had the Stack-On cabinet in the "wine cellar", a small room immediately next to the furnace room in the basement. It's essentially a small branch of the garage, and with the way the door to the room opened it was not immediately visible. The room mostly held Costco-sized rolls of paper towels and toilet paper, so it wasn't really obvious that anything of value would be in there.
Putting an RSC in the middle of the living room, like many of the catalogs show, seems rather silly. I also find it silly how the RSCs focus on the number of bolts they have and their size ("We have 10 1.5" bolts!") when the door can be easily cut. That many bolts won't really do much at all if someone just cuts the wall or door. I'd rather have two 3/4" bolts on each side of the door (dead bolts on the hinge side are ok) and thicker steel on the door and body.
dragongoddess
member
So what does one do in a 2nd floor apartment.
heypete
Member
Many RSCs aren't that heavy (mine's about 600 pounds or so), and the floors in most buildings should be able to handle them.
Most safe dealers have means of ascending stairs safely with a safe. It's usually worth the money to have them come out and bring it into your apartment.
CypherNinja
Member
Might as well throw out this question.....
I'm planning on purchasing a lathe sometime in the future. After said purchase, I figured I'd try my hand at a safe. (lathe being necessary to manufacture locking components and hinges)
About where in the spectrum would 1.5" mild steel interior wall + 5" high strength concrete (with 'fun' aggregate) + 1.5" mild steel exterior wall land me?
Plans are very loose at this point and I'm still looking into hardplate availability and stainless or copper layers for torch resistance. Lock would most likely be an Ebay X-09 or similar. Door devices would be well researched, and would make excellant lathe practice.
Just musing here, wondering about feasability.
Also, I was at the sporting goods store the other day. About half the gun cabinets in there could be opened with large can opener. The huge expensive ones weren't much better, either.
I'm planning on purchasing a lathe sometime in the future. After said purchase, I figured I'd try my hand at a safe. (lathe being necessary to manufacture locking components and hinges)
About where in the spectrum would 1.5" mild steel interior wall + 5" high strength concrete (with 'fun' aggregate) + 1.5" mild steel exterior wall land me?
Plans are very loose at this point and I'm still looking into hardplate availability and stainless or copper layers for torch resistance. Lock would most likely be an Ebay X-09 or similar. Door devices would be well researched, and would make excellant lathe practice.
Just musing here, wondering about feasability.
Also, I was at the sporting goods store the other day. About half the gun cabinets in there could be opened with large can opener. The huge expensive ones weren't much better, either.
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wacki
Member
This is going on my wall.... or some variation of it.
GregGry
Member
thats good, but I would use Locks keep honest people Honest..
dave_pro2a
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- Oct 28, 2006
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- 447
Dumb thread because it lacks specifcs. Lot's of "pm me for details", but no meat in the posts.
Most will NOT spend 2K plus on a home safe (super duper fancy 2000lbs+ TL30 type stuff)
So under 1k what's the best buy? Not a vauge reference to a chinese knock off.
Liberty?
Browning?
Amsec?
Cannon?
What brand, what model, what's the comparison on the actual price point (below 1k) of the commonly available, name brand, RSCs.
In that price range, given those perameters, what are the deal breaking features to look for.
Meat please.
Most will NOT spend 2K plus on a home safe (super duper fancy 2000lbs+ TL30 type stuff)
So under 1k what's the best buy? Not a vauge reference to a chinese knock off.
Liberty?
Browning?
Amsec?
Cannon?
What brand, what model, what's the comparison on the actual price point (below 1k) of the commonly available, name brand, RSCs.
In that price range, given those perameters, what are the deal breaking features to look for.
Meat please.
a1abdj
Member
All of those companies you list import some, if not all, of their sub $1,000 safes from China.
I sell sub $1,000 Chinese safes as well. Of course mine are built better and have more features since you're not paying the extra money for a Liberty, Browning, AMSEC, or Cannon sticker on the door.
The majority of these types of safes are Chinese, but China does not have a monopoly. I've seen Mexican and Korean gun safes as well.
Here's the problem. With the costs of materials and labor in the US, it is very difficult to build a nice gun safe that retails for under $1,000. If you researched the price of raw steel and the wages of union workers, that will become very obvious.
If you want a US made gun safe for less than $1,000, your best bet is probably a Winchester, sold through Sam's Clubs and other outlets, built by Granite out of Texas.
Why can Granite sell a US made safe for that little when nobody else can? When Granite was owned by FireKing (another large safe manufacturer), the process was completely automated. When they sold the division back to the current owners, I believe four employees built every one of those safes. They have also cut back on the quality from the Granite safes that were available 10 years ago.
There are a few other US built safes running under $1,000 for just the safe, but by time you factor in shipping, you're over your budget.
Lupinus
Member
and people can crack any bank vault known to man with the right time and tools, so whats your point?
Any defensive measure, reguardless of if its a safe, a vault, or a city wall isn't ment to keep those who want in out forever of its own devices. It is a hurdle to deter those who aren't equipped, who lack the time, or to hold out and bind the intruder up until lthe calvery can get there.
You can also hack through a some safes with a fire axe and punch a hole, but to what end? You are going to make a lot of noise, its going to be time consuming, and you are left with what? A hole with razor sharp edges not big enough to get a full size 1911 out of without some serious manipulating, scratching of the gun, and leaving a lot of dna behind. Let alone a rifle or shotgun which would be damn near impossible. Hell some of the guns in my el chepo safe I need to play with a little bit to get out the door of it do to a poorly designed shelf placement, it would be almost impossible through a hole someone quickly hacked into it.
Any defensive measure, reguardless of if its a safe, a vault, or a city wall isn't ment to keep those who want in out forever of its own devices. It is a hurdle to deter those who aren't equipped, who lack the time, or to hold out and bind the intruder up until lthe calvery can get there.
You can also hack through a some safes with a fire axe and punch a hole, but to what end? You are going to make a lot of noise, its going to be time consuming, and you are left with what? A hole with razor sharp edges not big enough to get a full size 1911 out of without some serious manipulating, scratching of the gun, and leaving a lot of dna behind. Let alone a rifle or shotgun which would be damn near impossible. Hell some of the guns in my el chepo safe I need to play with a little bit to get out the door of it do to a poorly designed shelf placement, it would be almost impossible through a hole someone quickly hacked into it.
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dave_pro2a
Member
- Joined
- Oct 28, 2006
- Messages
- 447
The Winchester at Sams Club has all the same features (on paper) that all the other sub 1k safes appear to have:
-12 gauge steel
-UL Group 2 lock
-Comparable fire rating (1200 degree for 32 min)
Cost is $899.
For $519 I can get a Amsec LP5924W or for $659 I can get a Browning TG15 (both are out the door prices). Those safes seem to have the same basic features at the Winchester, so what makes them not as desirable?
Is it the location of the lock works?
The number of bolts?
The lack of reinforced (hardened) plate?
Something to do with relockers? (I don't think any of them have that)
Warranty/guarantee?
-12 gauge steel
-UL Group 2 lock
-Comparable fire rating (1200 degree for 32 min)
Cost is $899.
For $519 I can get a Amsec LP5924W or for $659 I can get a Browning TG15 (both are out the door prices). Those safes seem to have the same basic features at the Winchester, so what makes them not as desirable?
Is it the location of the lock works?
The number of bolts?
The lack of reinforced (hardened) plate?
Something to do with relockers? (I don't think any of them have that)
Warranty/guarantee?
- Status
